Ever a good idea?

This is almost always a bad idea. You have no idea what he's working on, which projects he's getting, etc... It's a great idea to get famous people attached to projects, but usually that's only something you can do after you have an agent or at least a manager. Submitting directly to them is a no-no.

Also, avoid "Casting" your movie while you're writing it. Who knows who the actor is that will fill your role. If you start with, he's 6 foot 6, with flowing red hair, then all of a sudden you're going to eliminate almost all of the actors in Hollywood. And if you say, he's 5 foot 6 with a Tom Cruise-like impish smile, you'e also going to eliminate almost all of the actors in Hollywood. It's not a novel. You don't need to describe them.

Writing a short film for agents could be a good idea, I'm not nearly as sure on that one. Anybody else know if an agent will look at a film of an unknown writer?

zander said:

This is almost always a bad idea. You have no idea what he's working on, which projects he's getting, etc... It's a great idea to get famous people attached to projects, but usually that's only something you can do after you have an agent or at least a manager. Submitting directly to them is a no-no.

Also, avoid "Casting" your movie while you're writing it. Who knows who the actor is that will fill your role. If you start with, he's 6 foot 6, with flowing red hair, then all of a sudden you're going to eliminate almost all of the actors in Hollywood. And if you say, he's 5 foot 6 with a Tom Cruise-like impish smile, you'e also going to eliminate almost all of the actors in Hollywood. It's not a novel. You don't need to describe them.

Writing a short film for agents could be a good idea, I'm not nearly as sure on that one. Anybody else know if an agent will look at a film of an unknown writer?

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No they want something they can sell. Maybe if you wanted to be a director they'd look at it. If you go in as a writer you want at least one recent produced/released film, another under option to a proper prodco and five more killer scripts in the bag, polished and ready to be hacked to bits by whichever prodco buys them for big moolah.

Hollywood agents are very tough.

Don't approach cast at all unless you've got the money to pay or play them. And if they're big cast, unless your dad's Warren Buffet, forget it.

I think it also depends on the film. Some actors work on small film, even low budget films. It is true that if you contact an actor before things are pinned down, he might already have five projects lined up, and even after those five projects are done, the likely hood that an agent is going to suggest a small film to him...Well it's probably not even a fifty percent chance, but that doesn't mean you're completely out of luck. I'd say grab the information while you have it, keep the information you want until you are absolutely ready, and then maybe try. Most of the time it is better to have representation contact representation. Once you have an agent or you film is with a production company, have them work with you on the casting. There are no guarantees that you will get who you won't, but getting the film produced is the prize.

zander said:

This is almost always a bad idea. You have no idea what he's working on, which projects he's getting, etc... It's a great idea to get famous people attached to projects, but usually that's only something you can do after you have an agent or at least a manager. Submitting directly to them is a no-no.

Also, avoid "Casting" your movie while you're writing it. Who knows who the actor is that will fill your role. If you start with, he's 6 foot 6, with flowing red hair, then all of a sudden you're going to eliminate almost all of the actors in Hollywood. And if you say, he's 5 foot 6 with a Tom Cruise-like impish smile, you'e also going to eliminate almost all of the actors in Hollywood. It's not a novel. You don't need to describe them.

Writing a short film for agents could be a good idea, I'm not nearly as sure on that one. Anybody else know if an agent will look at a film of an unknown writer?

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I imagine there are legal complications to giving an actor or actress a screenplay? Esp. if you're a a new writer who's not in a/the union? Unless you give it to them as a gift!

Who would do that?!

Make sure your screenplay is polished to the max before you try. Your chances are slim but as Donovan Marsh proved, if you don't try, you have no luck. He asked John Cleese to be in a South African movie, and Cleese liked the script so much that he agreed to take the role.

He didn't expect Cleese to agree, but he tried anyway. Of course, getting some sort of agent or manager involved who knows how to approach this sort of thing is a very good idea.

Hey Richard,

I'd maybe take the gamble. Nothing ventured, nothing gained, right?

But there are legal complications. You might send your script off, it gets passed. Three years later MC Gainey appears in a film that's a bit like your script. Champagne cocktails for the lawyers - bad taste for everybody else.

Anyway, I'd suggest posting your query on the SYW Query Hell board. No matter how good you think it is... it probably isn't. And if you're looking for instant appeal, it'll probably help you enormously to get some feedback.

Now I know somebody who's looking for Guy Ritchie's contact details...

Regards

Whacko

whacko said:

Hey Richard,

I'd maybe take the gamble. Nothing ventured, nothing gained, right?

But there are legal complications. You might send your script off, it gets passed. Three years later MC Gainey appears in a film that's a bit like your script. Champagne cocktails for the lawyers - bad taste for everybody else.

Anyway, I'd suggest posting your query on the SYW Query Hell board. No matter how good you think it is... it probably isn't. And if you're looking for instant appeal, it'll probably help you enormously to get some feedback.

Now I know somebody who's looking for Guy Ritchie's contact details...

Regards

Whacko

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I'm so glad you posted this. I've been thinking about this thread. A spec script from an unknown or first-time writer would fetch about $500 -- at least that's what I've read.

What would happen if said writer "gifted" their screenplay to an actor?! Would that solve all legal problems? (The writer would have to really be willing to "give up" that screenplay in every sense.)

Do you suppose there are writers who would be willing to do this? Not I!

If you're going to produce and direct the movie yourself then go for MC Gainey. Using IMDB or any other means to contact him is fair game. Actors are used to getting scripts. Getting it to his rep is ultimately the way to go. If you get it to him personally, he might want you to submit it to his agent or through a lawyer.

On the other hand, if you plan to take the script onto the marketplace and want to attach the actor in order to create a worthwhile package - forget it.

Attaching talent can be a wise move, but it must be done thinking like a producer and not a fanboy. If you were thinking like a producer, you'd want to get Brad Pitt. If you're thinking like a fanboy, it's Gainey.

MC Gainey, a talented actor for sure (I always enjoying watching his performances), is not going to help elevate your project one millimeter. This is a business, and we have to approach it with some sensibility. You want an attachment that will excite producers,directors, executives and distributors.

Most actors are a liability when attached to projects.

Good attachments are actors who have name recognition/marquee value, can open a movie or have foreign clout.

If you have MC Gainey in mind for a smaller role, it's even twice as ridiculous to pursue him.



P.S.

If you're going to ask for the availability of talent, you need to have production dates. I don't know where you are with this project, but if you're still putting together a logline, I suspect you're reaching way too soon. And in the wrong places too.

Good luck.

You can try submitting to an actor with a production company that actually has some experienced/professional staff: always submit through agent or lawyer though and only send the script after they've specifically requested it after having been tempted by your killer query letter.

Big rider: most people do not look at unsolicited material from someone they do not know, however good it is. They will never know how good it is though because they will never even read it.

If, despite the odds, they are interested, they will offer you about USD1,000 or less to option the script with a USD5,000-USD10,000 buy out price (this is in the event that they really REALLY like it) and hold it for 12-24 months while they're working out what to do with it. In that time they may have a 'name' writer look at it (they'd buy it off you first before it got to that stage) and at some point they may re-write it/polish it and they may have the option to take your name off it.

I think it's fair to say that if you don't get royally f*cked in your first deal then you are one of the extremely rare, extremely lucky ones.

If you DO get a first deal though, you will get less f*cked on your second, and at some point, maybe on film 6, you might even be the one doing the f*cking.

Is that worth waiting for?

Yes.

Richard Alan Phipps said:

One last thing, since a few of you are keeping up with me. I've got the query down pretty well (updating below)

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"...in a struggle for perseverance." made me look twice -- not in a good way. This doesn't read well.

Just asking, have you read The Construction of a Logline? A most informative article on the Two Adverbs site.

Posting your logline/query for feedback in our Share Your Work forum (password = vista) has been suggested above, which is probably a good idea.

Tho' be aware, we have a minimum post rule, which denies new members from posting anything for critique until they reach 50 or more posts. Check out this thread in Share Your Work: Starting new threads in SYW - minimum post count requirement

-Derek

dpaterso said:

"...in a struggle for perseverance." made me look twice -- not in a good way. This doesn't read well.


-Derek

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I'll second that.

dpaterso said:

Just asking, have you read The Construction of a Logline? A most informative article on the Two Adverbs site.

Click to expand...

Thanks for that link; very useful article.

Once again, great link.

If you didn't already know, that article was written by creativexec who often posts here, and indeed has posted in this very thread.

-Derek

"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take" is a valuable quote from somewhere (I wrote it down when I read it, but can't remember where I read it). And, its also important to, as someone in this thread said, think like a producer, not a fan.

I've gotten scripts into the hands of a few actors, by querying their representation, and then signing the needed releases. No sales yet, and I felt like I had at least tried.

Good luck to you.

Hillgate said:

You can try submitting to an actor with a production company that actually has some experienced/professional staff: always submit through agent or lawyer though and only send the script after they've specifically requested it after having been tempted by your killer query letter.

Big rider: most people do not look at unsolicited material from someone they do not know, however good it is. They will never know how good it is though because they will never even read it.

If, despite the odds, they are interested, they will offer you about USD1,000 or less to option the script with a USD5,000-USD10,000 buy out price (this is in the event that they really REALLY like it) and hold it for 12-24 months while they're working out what to do with it. In that time they may have a 'name' writer look at it (they'd buy it off you first before it got to that stage) and at some point they may re-write it/polish it and they may have the option to take your name off it.

I think it's fair to say that if you don't get royally f*cked in your first deal then you are one of the extremely rare, extremely lucky ones.

If you DO get a first deal though, you will get less f*cked on your second, and at some point, maybe on film 6, you might even be the one doing the f*cking.

Is that worth waiting for?

Yes.

Click to expand...

I would just like to make the point that if you are dealing with a guild signatory company that they most definitely do *not* have the option to take your name off it. Under guild rules -- that is, rules to which the producer agrees, final credit assignment is a matter determined by guild rules, not by the producers. The way it works, if there are multiple writers on a produced movie is that every writer who submitted a version of the script received a preliminary notice of final credits -- that is, the final credits the way the producers want them to read. And if, at that point, any of the contributing writers disagree, they have the right to submit the matter to guild arbitration. Then everybody involved gets to submit statements and the relevant drafts of the script and the guild sets a panel of arbitrators to read the material in question and the arbitration committee decides how the final credits will read.

And just for the record, it isn't at all uncommon for a producer to option a work, hire a writer, or writers to do additional rewrites *prior* to buying the underlying work. I've had that happen more than once. And sometimes the underlying work was purchased and sometimes it wasn't.

And if it's not, they end up in the odd position of "owning" a rewrite of an underlying work that they don't own.

But that's actually not at all unusual, because producers will frequently option a book and hire a writer to write a script, try to sell the script. It doesn't work out. The option on the book lapses -- what's the status of the script?

The script is in nowhere land. In some sense they own it, but since they no longer have any rights to the underlying work, there's really nothing they can do with it, or will ever be able to do with it -- unless the contract they have regarding the initial option states that if the material is ever bought by anybody else, the "anybody else" has to come back and compensate them for their development costs.

Then they get paid back for all the money they spent -- but as for those various drafts -- they're still nowhere. Nobody will use them. Nobody will look at them.

As with so much of the work of writers, they just become history.

NMS