Athiest "Lore" in Novels

[ArcadiaDarrell]

For my own amusement I like to sprinkle in jokes and references to atheist "lore" in my writings. I try not make it overt due to my persistent fear of lynching. For instance in my last book I have a group called Doomist that are obsessed with pineapple and their god is a purple oyster.

I figure other groups have books that push their ideals, therefore I can be playful with mockery of proselytizing literature.

Is any one else overt or subtle about their atheism in their writings? Does it even come up?

Edit: Yes, I misspelled the title. Luckily I have already cried and cut myself for the offense so hopefully we can all move on now.

[Sarpedon]

I think its better to keep a neutral tone on religion in writing. Characters should be religious or not based on their own situations and inclinations, not the author's.

I keep a sharp lookout for the creep-ins. Unless you are writing something to be deliberately satirical.

[Maxx]

Is any one else overt or subtle about their athiesm in their writings? Does it even come up?

I find the best thing about atheism is that it allows me to have a wide range of religious experiences, so my atheism appears in my stories as relatively intense religious events.

[ArcadiaDarrell]

I keep a sharp lookout for the creep-ins. Unless you are writing something to be deliberately satirical.

Most of what I write is satirical, and I really doubt that most people are going to have a clue regarding the significance of a purple oyster and pineapple. Its more for those who are already in on the joke.

[richcapo]

I find the best thing about atheism is that it allows me to have a wide range of religious experiences, so my atheism appears in my stories as relatively intense religious events.Same here. My atheism frees me up to play with religion and magic like they're silly putty. Since I believe in nothing, I have no qualms about abusing the hell out of a mythology. I can drag God through the mud, marry Kaballah and cannibalism, have Lucifer rape Jesus, have Jesus rape Lucifer, have the Greek gods return, have Christ return, have ... etc., etc., etc.

I can do whatever I want because I have zero faith in anything.

_Richard

[Kitty Pryde]

It's "atheist". A+the+ist. It's not "athiest". It's not a superlative.

[Zoombie]

I wrote a book about an atheist and his guardian angel writing a revised bible, with an occasional cameo from his openly gay (closeted unicorn) best friend. The antagonists included a ninja, a load of heavily armed scientologists, Satan, Lord Xenu, some zombies, a hyper-dimensional house cat, and the physical avatar of entropy!

I was pretty subtle about the whole thing :D

[fireluxlou]

I didn't know we Atheist's had a lore? I'm confused.

[zornhau]

I think it's probably more interesting to portray religion as if real, but with no cosy fudging to bring it up to date with more liberal times.

Matthew Stover wrote a wonderful novel called Jericho Moon (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Jericho-Moon-Matthew-Stover/dp/0451456785/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1301992307&sr=1-1-spell), where a Celtic warrior princess and a motley band of Greek heroes help defend Jericho against the rampaging Israelites.

The cool thing is that he portrayed the God of the Israelites as real and exactly as depicted in the OT, complete with massacres and tests of faith.

It was a great - "OK, so suppose the Bible is literal truth, what would it be like?"

Mostly, though, it was a damn good adventure story.

[ArcadiaDarrell]

I didn't know we Atheist's had a lore? I'm confused.

Oh sure. It mainly involves mocking judeo-christian beliefs. The real question is are you a follower of the Flying Spaghetti Monster (http://www.venganza.org/) or the Invisible Pink Unicorn (http://www.invisiblepinkunicorn.com/ipu/home.html)? There's probably more but those are the big ones.

[Queen of Swords]

Matthew Stover wrote a wonderful novel called Jericho Moon (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Jericho-Moon-Matthew-Stover/dp/0451456785/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1301992307&sr=1-1-spell), where a Celtic warrior princess and a motley band of Greek heroes help defend Jericho against the rampaging Israelites.

I enjoyed that book a lot. And yes, the OT god was a superb adversary because of the way Stover portrayed him.

[veinglory]

I am not sure way it is more in interesting to portray religion as if it is real. In fiction anything can be real, no religion, religion as we know it, religion as if to was real, real gods but no religion etc etc. It all has the potential to make a good story.

[Zoombie]

That's the basic idea of my previous book's idea: What if every single form of religion was real?

Well, the world would be a very very strange place.

[fireluxlou]

Oh sure. It mainly involves mocking judeo-christian beliefs. The real question is are you a follower of the Flying Spaghetti Monster (http://www.venganza.org/) or the Invisible Pink Unicorn (http://www.invisiblepinkunicorn.com/ipu/home.html)? There's probably more but those are the big ones.

Cthulu baby ;). I forgot us Atheists have meetings on Fridays where we plot the downfall of civilisation, did you look at the minutes at the last meeting? :P

[ArcadiaDarrell]

Ooo! and I forgot about the suborbital teapot, too!

^I did read them, and I gotta say I just don't believe that nipple clamps will be particularly effective on Rush Limbaugh. That's just my opinion though.

[Max Vaehling]

Oh sure. It mainly involves mocking judeo-christian beliefs. The real question is are you a follower of the Flying Spaghetti Monster (http://www.venganza.org/) or the Invisible Pink Unicorn (http://www.invisiblepinkunicorn.com/ipu/home.html)? There's probably more but those are the big ones.

Don't forget the Celestial Teapot (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celestial_teapot), though I'm not sure it's a deity.

Personally, despite being the athiest Atheist, I actually follow God (http://www.twitter.com/god). On Twitter.

[Max Vaehling]

As for the original question, religion doesn't appear much in my stories. Neither as a crackpot belief system nor as an explanation of anything. I think the less you rely on religion to achieve anything, the better you serve Atheism's evil scheme to take over the ... ahem, the better you advocate Atheism.

I do like authors playing with religions as either all true or all equally false, and of course I enjoy authors playing with religious lore and creating fun new stuff from it. But in my own stories, as in my lfe, religion is pretty much a non-entity, nothing I think about much, certainly not enough to feel the need to make stories about it.

Actually, that's not entirely true. It used to be a non-entity, but religious people have been pushing the topic enough for me to a) think about it more than I would otherwise, and b) commit to Atheism rather than my original agnosticism.

Also, I do enjoy poking fun at flat-earthers and book burners. But it hasn't surfaced much in my fiction (yet).

[veinglory]

To me 'atheist lore' would be an ancient tradition of an atheist culture, rather than a parody of religion.

[seun]

That's the basic idea of my previous book's idea: What if every single form of religion was real?

Well, the world would be a very very strange place.

It already is. ;)

[ConChron]

Is any one else overt or subtle about their atheism in their writings? Does it even come up?


It's there all the time since what I write in a way reflects on how I look at the world. It's not a main theme, it's not even something that I mention, it's just there.

[The Unseen Moon]

Well, this is a new one on me. First you have to define what atheist "lore" supposedly is.

[Dawnstorm]

Well, take a look at this (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-14135523). It's currently going through Austrian media. Mr. Alm makes an atheist victory out of this, while the police say the regulations are actually fine with head gear, which makes Alm counter that - as that's indeed the law - the official information from the ministry is wrong (which means a discrimination of atheists without even legal backing), and so on.

So: should Pastafarians wear a pasta strainer on their driver's licenses or not?

[The Unseen Moon]

Pastafarianism is not atheism.

[Dawnstorm]

Pastafarianism is not atheism.

Well, no. But it's the sort of "lore" that the OP talks about. And the incident is most certainly about the discrimination of atheists, at least from Mr. Alm's point of view. He had to take a medical examination to see if he's sane enough to drive. That - in itself - shows that "pastafarianism" is insider knowledge (or "lore"): the authorities didn't get it (and it seems they still don't).

And this is why I find this sort of stuff ineffective to achieve any goals. It communicates mostly in-group, while the out-group is baffled.

Atheists aren't (and have never been) a coherent belief-group. As soon as the theists aren't looking, we quibble amongst ourselves. Practically the only possible lore "atheists" can have is based on the common foe. And even then, that doesn't mean we all have to agree, or that every atheist is a pastafarian.

[benbradley]

There's a new movie "The Golden Compass" named after a book of that name in which the MC is an out atheist. It appears to be getting a good bit of attention, but from what little I've heard, it's not just sprinkled with "athelst lore," it uses an atheist sledgehammer.

I think its better to keep a neutral tone on religion in writing. Characters should be religious or not based on their own situations and inclinations, not the author's.

I keep a sharp lookout for the creep-ins. Unless you are writing something to be deliberately satirical.
I have to admit there's something to this. It's "authorial intrusion" and it often or usually spoils the story.
Pastafarianism is not atheism.
Technically it night not be, but for practical purposes it has become a popular faux-religion among atheists (and I haven't heard of anyone who believes it as a REAL religion), such as this one:Austrian driver allowed 'pastafarian' headgear photo

An Austrian atheist has won the right to be shown on his driving-licence photo wearing a pasta strainer as "religious headgear".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-14135523

ETA: Now I see it was that story that prompted the reference, but I stand by what I said.

[quicksand]

Pastafarianism is not atheism

Yes it is.

It's a satirical set of claims made ironically by atheists as a way of illustrating the absurdity of religious belief. Thus, it's nothing but a rhetorical tool employed by atheists.
There are no sincere pastafarians, there are only atheists employing a rhetorical device.

[veinglory]

Nevertheless, at face value it is deism.

[BenPanced]

Yes it is.

It's a satirical set of claims made ironically by atheists as a way of illustrating the absurdity of religious belief. Thus, it's nothing but a rhetorical tool employed by atheists.
There are no sincere pastafarians, there are only atheists employing a rhetorical device.

Cite?

[benbradley]

Cite?
Let's put it this way - all the Pastafarian writing I've seen or heard of is tongue-in-cheek, so if there ARE sincere Pastafarians, there are few of them. If anything needs a cite, it would be the existence of a sincere Pastafarian.

And there may well be non-atheists writing as Pastafarians, but again this would be unusual and is what would need a cite, not that all Pastafarians are actually atheists.

The Church of The FSM originated (or perhaps "came out" into the public, according to the website) with an open letter to the Kansas School Board (Google search) (http://www.google.com/search?q=Kansas+School+Board). You can find the letter at the second link, and more info on Pastafarianism here:
http://www.venganza.org/about/

If you need more cites, I'm sure The Fount Of All Internet Knowledge known as Wikipedia has something about it.

[The Unseen Moon]

Cite?

The Flying Spaghetti Monster (FSM) is the deity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deity) of the parody religion (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parody_religion)[1] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pastafarianism#cite_note-cepa-0)[2] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pastafarianism#cite_note-usatoday-1) the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster or Pastafarianism[3] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pastafarianism#cite_note-nytimes-2) (a portmanteau (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portmanteau) of pasta (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pasta) and Rastafarian (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rastafarian)). The "Flying Spaghetti Monster" first appeared in a satirical open letter (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_letter) by Bobby Henderson in 2005, written in protest against the decision by the Kansas State Board of Education (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_evolution_hearings) to permit the teaching of intelligent design (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligent_design) as an alternative to evolution (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution) in public schools.[4] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pastafarianism#cite_note-Telegraph-3) In the letter, Henderson parodied the concept of intelligent design by professing belief in a supernatural creator (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creator_deity) that closely resembles spaghetti and meatballs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spaghetti_with_meatballs). Henderson further called for Flying Spaghetti Monsterism to be allotted equal time in science classrooms alongside intelligent design and evolution.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pastafarianism

[veinglory]

IMHO it is obviously a satire and has been since inception

[The Unseen Moon]

Getting back to the topic, I still would appreciate knowing what atheist lore is and some specific examples of it.

[benbradley]

This isn't "atheist lore" as the OP meant, but a common saying is "there are no atheists in foxholes."

[The Unseen Moon]

Common among the religious but no the atheist. There really are atheists in foxholes who don't change their minds at the last minute.

So that would be religious miscommunication.

[quicksand]

I still would appreciate knowing what atheist lore is and some specific examples of it. Since atheism is really just a component of the Enlightenment, you can import all that stuff.
If you want 'lore', go back to Aristotle, Francis Bacon, Galileo, and Darwin.
Research the Enlightenment.
Look into famous skeptics like Harry Houdini and James Randi.

That's about as close as you'll get to 'atheist lore.'

[Buffysquirrel]

I seem to remember a while ago there was some attempt to codify what atheists believe, and separate the real atheists from the dilettantes. It was all nonsense. And then there are the people who believe that Dawkins is some kind of atheist guru rather than an annoying guy who gives them a bad name.

[Max Vaehling]

I seem to remember a while ago there was some attempt to codify what atheists believe, and separate the real atheists from the dilettantes. It was all nonsense. And then there are the people who believe that Dawkins is some kind of atheist guru rather than an annoying guy who gives them a bad name.

I think what you're referring to isn't a serious attempt at anything but a South Park episode. The one where Cartman wakes up in a dystopian future governed by atheist cults fighting over the true interpretation of Dawkins' Word?

[benbradley]

Heh. Instead of the Synoptic Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Juke and John, we could have the Agnostic Gospels of Richard, Daniel, Sam and Christopher. :)

[Buffysquirrel]

I think what you're referring to isn't a serious attempt at anything but a South Park episode. The one where Cartman wakes up in a dystopian future governed by atheist cults fighting over the true interpretation of Dawkins' Word?

Lol, I wish it had been South Park. Probably wasn't more than a little flurry here in the UK that didn't reach a wider audience.