Looking for Feedback

Sargentodiaz

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 30, 2007
Messages
1,330
Reaction score
61
Any thoughts/comments/suggestions?

Title The Sailor and The Carpenter
El Marinero y el Carpintero
(A story of 18th Century New Spain)

Genre historical fiction

Word count

promotional-style "quick teaser"
A young English farmer is taken from his home to serve aboard a merchant ship bound for the far northwestern shores of the New World. Washed ashore on a barren land, he is found by an Indian and taken to the priests of the Roman church.

back cover hype
Timothy Beadle sails from Plymouth, England as a cabin boy aboard a merchant brig. After a voyage to the far northwestern shores of The New World, a treacherous blade loosens him from safety lines and he’s washed ashore on a barren land - found by a youth with reddish skin. Priests of the Roman church give him sanctuary from a Spanish prison and, with his new-found Indian friend and two Indian damsels, he sets off behind a diminutive, limping Franciscan friar to expand Spain’s toehold on The Californias.

A brief excerpt from the work

Waves lapped the shore of the Bay of Loreto. The sun ruled the cloudless sky and a few small fishing boats pulled in nets filled with squirming silver and rainbow colors. Timothy saw a few small huts on the large island to the east.

“There are large deposits of salt on the island,” one of the muleteers told him.

Loreto came into sight as they topped a gentle rise with a small cape to their right. Brownish scrub and a few cacti struggled to live in the arid land. Arroyos displayed green in trees and bushes fed by underground water deposited by rare rains.

Father Serra pointed to the white of mission buildings showing against the hills to the west. “That is la Misión de San Francisco Javier, my children. The Jesuits were good of heart when they built it but poor of judgment. They had to close it not long after opening it.”

Timothy tried hard not to suck in breath from the pace of travel of the friar who trudged along, obviously in pain. Jaime, Butterfly and Carlo did not even breathe hard as they had walked long distances all their lives.
Mountains towered to the west, the Sierra Gigante. Timothy saw green vegetation growing upon their upper slopes.

The peal of bells announced noon prayers as they waded the stream that provided the blood of life to the mission and the town.

Oh my Good Lord! Timothy thought, sucking in a breath.

In preparing to cross the stream, Father Serra hiked his habit up to keep from getting it wet and revealed his calf. A large, black lesion surrounded by angry red skin clearly caused his limp - and pain.

Timothy had lived on a farm with many milch cows and had seen his father treat similar skin problems on the animals. There must be a way to ease Father Serra’s pain. How can he be so driven in his beliefs as to not wish to seek relief?


:Sun:
 

Marlys

Resist. Love. Go outside.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 23, 2005
Messages
3,584
Reaction score
981
Location
midwest
Any thoughts/comments/suggestions?

Title The Sailor and The Carpenter
El Marinero y el Carpintero
(A story of 18th Century New Spain)

Genre historical fiction

Word count

promotional-style "quick teaser"
A young English farmer is taken from his home to serve aboard a merchant ship bound for the far northwestern shores of the New World. Washed ashore on a barren land, he is found by an Indian and taken to the priests of the Roman church. ...and? What I'd like to see is some hint of the conflict. Do the priests enslave him? Force him to convert? Is his problem how to get back to England?

back cover hype
Timothy Beadle sails from Plymouth, England as a cabin boy aboard a merchant brig. After a voyage to the far northwestern shores of The New World, a treacherous blade loosens him from safety lines and he’s washed ashore on a barren land - found by a youth with reddish skin. Priests of the Roman church give him sanctuary from a Spanish prison and, with his new-found Indian friend and two Indian damsels, he sets off behind a diminutive, limping Franciscan friar to expand Spain’s toehold on The Californias. Okay, so his goal is clearer here: to help the Franciscans who saved him from prison expand Spanish rule of California. But the central problem of the book still isn't there. What stands in his way? What challenges does he face? What are the stakes if they fail?

A brief excerpt from the work

Waves lapped the shore of the Bay of Loreto. The sun ruled the cloudless sky and a few small fishing boats pulled in nets filled with squirming silver and rainbow colors. Timothy saw a few small huts on the large island to the east.

“There are large deposits of salt on the island,” one of the muleteers told him. [Comes out of nowhere, apparently for no other reason than to add a geographical detail. Give him a reason to say it: Perhaps Timothy could remark on the size of the catch, and the muleteer could say that much of it will be salted for trade. Then it would be more natural to mention that there are large salt deposits on the island.]

Loreto came into sight as they topped a gentle rise with a small cape to their right. Brownish scrub and a few cacti struggled to live in the arid land. Arroyos displayed green in trees and bushes fed by underground water deposited by rare rains. [Omniscient narration, or does Timothy somehow know this? Again, conversation could help: Timothy wonders how anything can live when it's so dry, and someone could tell him about the occasional rains (not sure if they'd know about the underground water or not)?]

Father Serra pointed to the white of mission buildings showing against the hills to the west. “That is la Misión de San Francisco Javier, my children. The Jesuits were good of heart when they built it but poor of judgment. They had to close it not long after opening it.”

Timothy tried hard not to suck in breath from the pace of travel of the friar who trudged along, obviously in pain. Jaime, Butterfly and Carlo did not even breathe hard as they had walked long distances all their lives [Again, POV issue. Does Timothy know this, or are you omnisciently narrating it? Omniscient does get used sometimes, but it's hard to pull off. Plus, if you stay in Timothy's POV, it's a chance to show the reader this new world through his eyes.].
Mountains towered to the west, the Sierra Gigante. Timothy saw green vegetation growing upon their upper slopes. and thought...? Does he wonder why they're green when everything around them is brown? Do they look cool and attractive to him, given the arid conditions?

The peal of bells announced noon prayers as they waded the stream that provided the blood of life to the mission and the town.

Oh my Good Lord! Timothy thought, sucking in a breath. Why? The bells? The stream? If the stream is cold, does it feel good?

In preparing to cross the stream, Father Serra hiked his habit up to keep from getting it wet and revealed his calf. A large, black lesion surrounded by angry red skin clearly caused his limp - and pain.

Timothy had lived on a farm with many milch cows and had seen his father treat similar skin problems on the animals. There must be a way to ease Father Serra’s pain. How can he be so driven in his beliefs as to not wish to seek relief?

Sounds like a really fascinating setting! I think both the teaser and the back-cover blurb need a better sense of plot, though. And watch info-dumping in your narration. I've pointed out a few places in this excerpt where I think the info could come out more naturally. I also think getting a bit more of Timothy's reactions would strengthen your work. You tell us what he sees, but not much about what he thinks of it. All this for him is new, different, wondrous. Make the reader feel his curiosity, his awe and they'll keep turning the pages to experience it with him.

Best of luck with it!
 

Nen

Registered
Joined
Jan 5, 2011
Messages
25
Reaction score
3
Location
Ontario
Website
www.chapterfourfivesix.wordpress.com
Obviously not as detailed as Marlys' suggestions,
but if the story is from Timothy's pov, he might not know the names for the Bay or towns. I saw plenty of arroyos when I lived in NorCal for a year, but I didn't know that's what they were called at first. Maybe a bit more sensory stuff to help with that feeling of discovery- hearing the different sounds that the waves would make on different types of beaches, the sun feeling more intense than back home, and smelling the sage plants on the dry slopes for the first time come to mind, for me...
a bit of compare contrast with what he was used to back in his part of Engrrrrland?
:)
 

alleycat

Still around
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 18, 2005
Messages
72,919
Reaction score
12,276
Location
Tennessee
promotional-style "quick teaser"
A young English farmer is taken from his home to serve aboard a merchant ship bound for the far northwestern shores of the New World. Washed ashore on a barren land, he is found by an Indian and taken to the priests of the Roman church. ...and? What I'd like to see is some hint of the conflict. Do the priests enslave him? Force him to convert? Is his problem how to get back to England?
This is similar to my initial thought. The "teaser" doesn't really go anywhere.

You could just have it " . . . bound for the New World" and use the words saved to tell a little more of the storyline.
 

Sargentodiaz

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 30, 2007
Messages
1,330
Reaction score
61
Obviously not as detailed as Marlys' suggestions,
but if the story is from Timothy's pov, he might not know the names for the Bay or towns. I saw plenty of arroyos when I lived in NorCal for a year, but I didn't know that's what they were called at first. Maybe a bit more sensory stuff to help with that feeling of discovery- hearing the different sounds that the waves would make on different types of beaches, the sun feeling more intense than back home, and smelling the sage plants on the dry slopes for the first time come to mind, for me...
a bit of compare contrast with what he was used to back in his part of Engrrrrland?
:)

It was probably a bad idea to use a scene from so late in the book. He knew he was going to Loreto ahead of time. He had already seen such things.

Thanks for the comment as it shows I need to find a different scene to use.
 

Tom from UK

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 11, 2010
Messages
682
Reaction score
127
Location
London
Website
tomwilliamsauthor.co.uk
Yep. That's exactly what they did with stops at St Helena's, the Faulklands and the Galapagos.
Was that a journey that people regularly did? I ask out of genuine curiosity. I mean Darwin and others did at least most of that and people regularly travelled from Spain to South America and from (for example) Chile to California but it is a very long voyage to make as one journey (even with stops). How long did it take? Did the ship return or was it a one way trip? I'm not doubting you - I'd just like to know.
 

Puma

Retired and loving it!
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 21, 2006
Messages
7,340
Reaction score
1,540
Location
Central Ohio
You know, Tom, that's a very good point. Serra himself landed on the east coast of Mexico (Veracruz) and walked from there. I'd think most of the Spaniards in California did the same. We're talking mid-18th century - about the same time as Cook's voyage. Good point! Puma
 

Rain Gnome

Two Thumbs Up
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 3, 2009
Messages
142
Reaction score
23
Location
Standing in the rain
The Spanish had the largest presence on the west coast of the Americas, and even they unloaded all their treasure at ports in western Mexico, sending them across land to ports in Eastern Mexico, rather than traversing the Cape of South America. If a ship was going from England to California, it would be just as easy (and take the same amount of time) to return home across the Pacific Ocean, because you might only have one shot of making the Cape a year and if you failed you had to wait till next year. Making a complete circumnavigation would take at least 2 years if everything went well. There were traders, privateers and explorers making that journey. William Dampier comes to mind, doing so three times from the 1690s to about 1710. I don't see a problem with the Jesuits taking a ship to San Francisco, because that's what they did.

In the non-fiction, Two Years Before the Mast, the name alone tells how long the journey might take, except that ship made a round trip from Boston to California and in the mid 1800s. Traveling to England is just completing the trade-triangle, and was actually the quickest part of the journey, taking a month or more either way.

Maybe the book will be of interest to the OP, because it's the only book that gives a historical and firsthand historical account of California in its earliest years. As I recall, the town of San Francisco (discounting the Jesuit mission further inland) is only a port of three buildings.

EDIT: Also, the non-fiction Shipwreck, is fascinating and deals with events from 1650. It tells of a padre returning from a cathedral in Peru to Spain aboard two treasure ships (he too crossed by land over Panama). Maybe that would be of interest to the OP. The padre's journal tells that it took from about Oct. 1, 1654 to Oct. 6, 1656 to arrive in Seville, Spain from Peru. However, this included surviving two shipwrecks and an attack against the treasure ship just outside Cadiz.
 
Last edited:

Sargentodiaz

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 30, 2007
Messages
1,330
Reaction score
61
Was that a journey that people regularly did? I ask out of genuine curiosity. I mean Darwin and others did at least most of that and people regularly travelled from Spain to South America and from (for example) Chile to California but it is a very long voyage to make as one journey (even with stops). How long did it take? Did the ship return or was it a one way trip? I'm not doubting you - I'd just like to know.

No, it is a rare journey. Most English ships either traveled to the New England or Canadian shores of North America or, in the case of the East India Company, to India and ports of southeast Asia.

Of course, Sir Francis Drake circumnavigated the globe with stops on the California Coast p many believe his treasure still lies somewhere around Point Reyes - and it's dealt with in my story.

As someone pointed out, most ships avoided Cape Horn. The Manila Galleons left the islands to sail north to cross near the Aleutians, then down the western coast of North America to ports such as San Blas or further south to be transported by land to the Gulf of Mexico.

As for other travel, some ships sailed from San Blas to Loreto, Baja but never further north. Extensive silver mines in Sonora provided loads for galleons sailing south through the Sea of Cortez to San Blas and others.

One of the reason there was little seafaring along the western coast further north is contrary winds and currents. 18th Century ships were difficult to handle and it took about 3 months to sail from La Paz, south around Cape St Lucas, then north to San Diego.

In fact, the crews of two ships were almost wiped out by scurvy and dysentery in the sea portions of the expedition to found San Diego.

Anyhow, all of this is covered in the trilogy at great length. So, when I finally get a publisher for them - BUY 'EM and see for yourself!!!!!
 

Tom from UK

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 11, 2010
Messages
682
Reaction score
127
Location
London
Website
tomwilliamsauthor.co.uk
ll of this is covered in the trilogy at great length.
That's what didn't come over when I skimmed through the stuff you posted. It's an epic voyage and (I imagine) a great story in itself but it's sort of thrown away in the description you give. No one is going to sell this for you - you have to sell it harder yourself.
 

Sargentodiaz

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 30, 2007
Messages
1,330
Reaction score
61
Thanks to all for your comments/remarks/suggestions.
Based on this, I’ve made another try. Tell me how this works.

Title The Sailor and The Carpenter
El Marinero y el Carpintero
(A story of 18th Century New Spain)

Genre historical fiction

Word count 110,000

A 40-word, promotional-style "quick teaser" blurb

From farm to Fo’csle to a far away land; the changes in Timothy Beadle’s fortunes have just begun. The young Englishman joins Spaniards exploring hostile deserts and mountains, confronting naked savages to bring the Californias under their control.

A back cover hype of the work (100-200 words)

Timothy Beadle’s father indentures him to a ship’s captain and he soon is in Mid-Atlantic on his way to the far northwestern shores of The New World. Padding the deck and climbing the rigging is exhilarating to the young English farm boy. The captain is a fair, God-fearing man who ensures Timothy also learns reading, writing and arithmetic. Strange islands and naked savages fill Timothy with curiosity and wonder.

Fate has more changes in store for Timothy. Holds filled with rich furs, the ship sails for home. But, a vicious cyclone hits and Timothy ends up on the shore of Spanish California with a young Indian bending over him. After the village medicine woman treats him, Timothy’s taken before grey robed priests who welcome him. They even step in and offer sanctuary when a local official tries to imprison him as a pirate.

Jaime, the Indian boy, dreamed of Timothy’s arrival months before. Both sense the blood bond that ties them together and unite in an effort by Father Junipero Serra to expand the Catholic faith and Spain’s control of the Californias.

A brief excerpt from the work (no more than 300 words)

Jaime dreamed that night. Visions held great meaning to his people. Jaime had not dreamed since death had taken away his world. As he slept, he walked along the shore of a great body of water. Curling waves came ashore, sudsy foam swirling around his bare feet. Many peculiar things lay upon the fine grains of stone, some of them made of brittle substances in whites and blacks. They looked like the shell of a tortoise but somehow different.

Many birds swirled in the air, raucous screams filling his ears. The big black and white ones the Spaniards called gaviotas were familiar as he had seen them in his home mountains. In the distance, the rolling water washed a pile of boulders swarming with creatures. They had strange flat things where their legs should have been. Whiskers spiked from their muzzles and they barked. But not like any dogs he had ever seen.

Voices told him how strange it was that a great storm had come at that time of the year. They normally came in the time before things got cooler. Los ciclónes often dropped great amounts of rain, causing floods in the arid mountains.

He saw something strange and hurried towards it. An ocelot lay on the ground, but one unlike any he had ever seen - it was white with light brown spots. He could see it lived but seriously hurt. Then, the creature turned its head and stared at him - with pale blue eyes!

Jaime awakened.
 

Puma

Retired and loving it!
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 21, 2006
Messages
7,340
Reaction score
1,540
Location
Central Ohio
lv - This really should have been posted in SYW, Query letter hell. The people there deal with type of question all the time. I suggest you ask one of the mods to move this thread for you. Puma
 

angeliz2k

never mind the shorty
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 24, 2008
Messages
3,727
Reaction score
488
Location
Commonwealth of Virginia--it's for lovers
Website
www.elizabethhuhn.com
Unless I missed something, I'm not sure what the point of these bits are, LV.

It isn't really a query letter--it's not the right format. You as the author wouldn't have anything to do with the back cover copy, so why did you write that up? And the "quick-teaser" is for . . . what? These are things taken care of by the publisher once you're published. So what is the purpose of these bits? And really, this should be in SYW, where feedback is given and received.

Then again, maybe I did miss something here.
 

Sargentodiaz

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 30, 2007
Messages
1,330
Reaction score
61
I was just trying them out for feedback/.

See the 1st five pages in SYW.
 

Sargentodiaz

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 30, 2007
Messages
1,330
Reaction score
61
I'm stunned at the message. It's not spam and I will respond when I can.
 

lisaw243

Registered
Joined
Jan 23, 2011
Messages
3
Reaction score
0
Location
tucson, arizona
How interesting. Wish someone would find me like that.
I wish you all the luck in the world. try everything, every site every possible name, every page, EVERYTHING, it has taken me 30 years to get this far, almost there, hopefully. good luck and never give up