Advice on film rights and beyond....

Howler · Dec 8, 2010

Hi all,

I am new here and in need of serious advice...

If anyone can help me with the following, it would be GREATLY appreciated:

I am a published graphic novel author, with a literary agent. A major entertainment agency has come forward to shop my book (series actually) to Hollywood.

I told my literary agent (who deals with the film agent for me) that I would like to be involved with the film production; possibly as "creative consultant" or "executive producer" (Wishful thinking?). I would just like to retain some level of creative control.
My agent said that when a film studio buys the rights to my book that's typically as far as I go. It's highly unlikely that I'd be involved any further.

My agent said it might be possible to negotiate but that it would really put a damper on making the deal with the film studio.

How do I stay involved? How do I benefit from a movie based on my book?
How do I position myself for script approval?
How do I retain a percentage of the film's sales?
How about when the DVD comes out, do I not get any percentage from that?
How about a percentage of merchandising? Toys, video games etc?
How do I secure these things?

Any advice on this would be extremely helpful.

Thanks!

nmstevens · Dec 8, 2010

Howler said:
Hi all,

I am new here and in need of serious advice...

If anyone can help me with the following, it would be GREATLY appreciated:

I am a published graphic novel author, with a literary agent. A major entertainment agency has come forward to shop my book (series actually) to Hollywood.

I told my literary agent (who deals with the film agent for me) that I would like to be involved with the film production; possibly as "creative consultant" or "executive producer" (Wishful thinking?). I would just like to retain some level of creative control.
My agent said that when a film studio buys the rights to my book that's typically as far as I go. It's highly unlikely that I'd be involved any further.

My agent said it might be possible to negotiate but that it would really put a damper on making the deal with the film studio.

How do I stay involved? How do I benefit from a movie based on my book?
How do I position myself for script approval?
How do I retain a percentage of the film's sales?
How about when the DVD comes out, do I not get any percentage from that?
How about a percentage of merchandising? Toys, video games etc?
How do I secure these things?

Any advice on this would be extremely helpful.

Thanks!

Generally, things like royalty and residual payments come contractually through the particular deal your agent makes with whoever buys the rights to your work. This is going to be a big, complicated document and will generally involve your getting some kind of payment, above and beyond the initial payment for the rights. That is, you'll get paid a certain amount for ancillary distribution like cable, broadcast, foreign, DVD, etc.

In addition, this deal would also address the question of sequels, currently in existence and yet to be written, of the right to use characters in this work (for which you'd also be paid -- and paid every time a character from your work is used), and things like that.

Ancillary merchandising -- things like toys -- unless *you* have trademarked the characters themselves -- that is, their specific names and appearance as part of your work, and they have to license those things from you (for which they'd have to pay) -- it's highly unlikely that you'd get paid a percentage of that kind of income.

It's not usually covered -- but given that this is based on a graphic novel, the question may come down to whether the appearance of the toy is based on how the character appears in the movie (which they own) or how it's graphically represented in your graphic novel (which you own. That's something worth talking about with your lawyer and perhaps making clear in the contract -- who owns the rights to the particular *visualization* of characters, costumes, etc. as distinct from the story.

As far as things like script approval, unless you are J. K. Rowling, you will not get it. You are not J. K. Rowling.

As for staying involved - really unless you manage to get involved with somebody who actually wants you to stay involved (as opposed to somebody who tells you that they do -- they'll all *say* that) there's no way to do it.

That is, there's no way to *make* somebody involve you who doesn't want to. If you really try to make the contract compel your involvement in some draconian ironclad way -- you'll find that nobody will go along with it, because at this point, you're a complete unknown which means that, even though you may have written a graphic novel worth optioning or buying, and you *may* be a completely reasonable person, there's no way to know whether you might be a nut who's going to disrupt everything and make the process of making a movie a nightmare or worse.

That's the reason why they can't give somebody like you script approval. There may be production reasons, or reasons having to do with codes or reasons having to do with getting the movie made that compel them to make certain decisions in relation to the script.

So it may be -- we have to cut location X, because we don't have the money, or cast so-and-so -- because it's the only way to get the money.

And they can't have nutty graphic artiste saying no to the change or to the casting decision - because it would kill the movie.

Nobody is going to move forward, essentially placing a multi-million dollar investment at the mercy of you -- *you* being a completely unknown quantity.

So you just have to be willing to let go of certain things -- key among them being that, if you're lucky, they may let you visit the set and they may let you read the script at some point -- but that's going to be just about the most involvement you're likely to have beyond the initial sale.

If you have more, consider yourself very lucky -- and exceptionally lucky, because if you manage to get your graphic novel optioned and then sold and then actually produced, that alone will place you among an amazingly small and fortunate minority to begin with.

NMS

Stijn Hommes · Dec 9, 2010

J.K. Rowling had the luck that they started making the movies while she was still writing the series. Not giving her any creative control could've lead to the filmmakers cutting vital material they didn't know was vital at the time.

I'm not sure how it worked for the South African movie Spud, but in that case the author was on the set quite often as well. He gave support to the actors and helped them understand their characters.

In the end the director and producers make the decision how much a creator is involved. You'll be paid for merchandise and DVD sales since that is a typical part of such contracts. Creative control is typically given away when the contract is signed. You have to find out if you can live with that.

Personally, I'd love to be involved in the creative process of a film of my work, but I'd sign in a heartbeat if I know the right people are connected to the project even if I don't get a say in anything.

Howler · Dec 9, 2010

nmstevens said:
Generally, things like royalty and residual payments come contractually through the particular deal your agent makes with whoever buys the rights to your work. This is going to be a big, complicated document and will generally involve your getting some kind of payment, above and beyond the initial payment for the rights. That is, you'll get paid a certain amount for ancillary distribution like cable, broadcast, foreign, DVD, etc.

In addition, this deal would also address the question of sequels, currently in existence and yet to be written, of the right to use characters in this work (for which you'd also be paid -- and paid every time a character from your work is used), and things like that.

Ancillary merchandising -- things like toys -- unless *you* have trademarked the characters themselves -- that is, their specific names and appearance as part of your work, and they have to license those things from you (for which they'd have to pay) -- it's highly unlikely that you'd get paid a percentage of that kind of income.

It's not usually covered -- but given that this is based on a graphic novel, the question may come down to whether the appearance of the toy is based on how the character appears in the movie (which they own) or how it's graphically represented in your graphic novel (which you own. That's something worth talking about with your lawyer and perhaps making clear in the contract -- who owns the rights to the particular *visualization* of characters, costumes, etc. as distinct from the story.

As far as things like script approval, unless you are J. K. Rowling, you will not get it. You are not J. K. Rowling.

As for staying involved - really unless you manage to get involved with somebody who actually wants you to stay involved (as opposed to somebody who tells you that they do -- they'll all *say* that) there's no way to do it.

That is, there's no way to *make* somebody involve you who doesn't want to. If you really try to make the contract compel your involvement in some draconian ironclad way -- you'll find that nobody will go along with it, because at this point, you're a complete unknown which means that, even though you may have written a graphic novel worth optioning or buying, and you *may* be a completely reasonable person, there's no way to know whether you might be a nut who's going to disrupt everything and make the process of making a movie a nightmare or worse.

That's the reason why they can't give somebody like you script approval. There may be production reasons, or reasons having to do with codes or reasons having to do with getting the movie made that compel them to make certain decisions in relation to the script.

So it may be -- we have to cut location X, because we don't have the money, or cast so-and-so -- because it's the only way to get the money.

And they can't have nutty graphic artiste saying no to the change or to the casting decision - because it would kill the movie.

Nobody is going to move forward, essentially placing a multi-million dollar investment at the mercy of you -- *you* being a completely unknown quantity.

So you just have to be willing to let go of certain things -- key among them being that, if you're lucky, they may let you visit the set and they may let you read the script at some point -- but that's going to be just about the most involvement you're likely to have beyond the initial sale.

If you have more, consider yourself very lucky -- and exceptionally lucky, because if you manage to get your graphic novel optioned and then sold and then actually produced, that alone will place you among an amazingly small and fortunate minority to begin with.

NMS

Excellent information. Thank you very much! Are there any books on the subject you might be able to recommend? I am having difficulty finding anything that helps me learn what I can expect beyond the sale.

I sincerely appreciate your taking the time advise me.

Howler · Dec 9, 2010

Stijn Hommes said:
J.K. Rowling had the luck that they started making the movies while she was still writing the series. Not giving her any creative control could've lead to the filmmakers cutting vital material they didn't know was vital at the time.

I'm not sure how it worked for the South African movie Spud, but in that case the author was on the set quite often as well. He gave support to the actors and helped them understand their characters.

In the end the director and producers make the decision how much a creator is involved. You'll be paid for merchandise and DVD sales since that is a typical part of such contracts. Creative control is typically given away when the contract is signed. You have to find out if you can live with that.

Personally, I'd love to be involved in the creative process of a film of my work, but I'd sign in a heartbeat if I know the right people are connected to the project even if I don't get a say in anything.

Great stuff! Thanks very much!

The entertainment agency came on board for representation just a few months after the release of the first book in the series. My next book comes out in the summer of 2011, the third the following year and so on.

So the series has a long way to go before it's complete. That could give me some leverage. I hope...

I am just trying to figure out if I should wait until I have more recognition for the book or eat the soup when it's hot, you know? If a major film studio makes an offer now, would it be smart to say "no" and wait until I have more "power" over my "product" or take what I can get????
There's always a possibility that "power" may never come, but the sales for the book have been excellent. My publisher is in early discussions to extend the series.

Thanks again for the great advice!

WriteKnight · Dec 9, 2010

Cross the bridge when you come to it. Meanwhile - read up on 'bridges: their construction strengths and weakness' - Sorry for the metaphor but seriously, you will have to wait until an offer comes along and deal with it. There are so many variations on how an offer can be structured - that it is pointless to say "You should do THIS and ONLY THIS" at the present time.

Howler · Dec 9, 2010

WriteKnight said:
Cross the bridge when you come to it. Meanwhile - read up on 'bridges: their construction strengths and weakness' - Sorry for the metaphor but seriously, you will have to wait until an offer comes along and deal with it. There are so many variations on how an offer can be structured - that it is pointless to say "You should do THIS and ONLY THIS" at the present time.

Thanks for your input. I told my lit agent that I'd like to speak with the film agent personally, get an idea of who this person is that's now representing my book to Hollywood. He is a major film agent who works with one the biggest entertainment agencies in the world. I realize that I am in an extremely lucky position right now. Things have moved very quickly since the release of my first book.
According to my lit agent, he loves my series and is thrilled to represent it, and the chances he'll sell it to a major film studio are extremely high because he himself is very high profile. GREAT! I am thrilled to hear that, but I'd like to talk to him and understand how he's pitching my series. You know?
I would like to share my thoughts and ideas with him, I would like to share my expectations of the sale of the film rights etc.

She said she would set the meeting up, but that I should be open and ready to hear the "realities" of a film deal. That comment kind of annoyed me a little.

I don't want to find myself intimidated or smooth talked into selling my film rights and earning nothing else. You know? It's important that I learn as much as I can now, so that when I do "cross that bridge", I'll be well informed and not some sucker.

I feel very strongly that this series is primed for success in many market places. Video games, toys, cartoons etc. I am motivated to push and make this series as successful as I can. But I also have this tightly clinched fist of concern that I'll be, for lack of a better word, ripped-off.

Everyone's advice here in these forums thus far has been golden. I am not having much luck finding answers anywhere else.

nmstevens · Dec 9, 2010

Howler said:
Thanks for your input. I told my lit agent that I'd like to speak with the film agent personally, get an idea of who this person is that's now representing my book to Hollywood. He is a major film agent who works with one the biggest entertainment agencies in the world. I realize that I am in an extremely lucky position right now. Things have moved very quickly since the release of my first book.
According to my lit agent, he loves my series and is thrilled to represent it, and the chances he'll sell it to a major film studio are extremely high because he himself is very high profile. GREAT! I am thrilled to hear that, but I'd like to talk to him and understand how he's pitching my series. You know?
I would like to share my thoughts and ideas with him, I would like to share my expectations of the sale of the film rights etc.

She said she would set the meeting up, but that I should be open and ready to hear the "realities" of a film deal. That comment kind of annoyed me a little.

I don't want to find myself intimidated or smooth talked into selling my film rights and earning nothing else. You know? It's important that I learn as much as I can now, so that when I do "cross that bridge", I'll be well informed and not some sucker.

I feel very strongly that this series is primed for success in many market places. Video games, toys, cartoons etc. I am motivated to push and make this series as successful as I can. But I also have this tightly clinched fist of concern that I'll be, for lack of a better word, ripped-off.

Everyone's advice here in these forums thus far has been golden. I am not having much luck finding answers anywhere else.

I'm sure that your agent wasn't intending to annoy you -- but really to make you understand that there really are -- I mean *really* are realities that have to do with the movie business and the sales and optioning of literary properties, and that however enthusiastic this movie agent may be about your material, if you start talking about stuff like "being involved" and "creative control" -- you had better expect a great big dose of "it ain't gonna happen."

Now, depending on the agent, you may get that medicine delivered with a spoon full of sugar or without -- but get it you will, because that's just reality.

But you really should take your agent's advice and please do listen, because the whole world of movies and movie rights is just a world unto itself and it really does have its own rules and its own language and you need to bring a certain set of realistic expectations to it -- which will likely be very different from those that come from writing a book, or a graphic novel or a play -- and also very different in reality from what you may have read in very rosy "we were all just so wonderfully collaborative" accounts of these things.

"Give us your book, here's a bunch of money and two tickets for the premiere. See you around," is generally closer to reality. You may get more, but you certainly shouldn't go in expecting more.

As for waiting -- you always have that option, but there's always a risk. If you say no to a deal now in the hope that your work will gain steam and become bigger later -- well, it may become bigger and the offers may follow.

Then again, it may not become bigger and this offer may be the best deal you'll get. Even if it *does* become bigger, enthusiasm in Hollywood is a funny thing and something that everybody was hot to buy last year that didn't sell, for whatever reason -- when it comes around again, it sort of has the whiff of failure about it. Suddenly nobody wants to touch it.

Sometimes that change of fortune can happen in the blink of eye. Everybody wants to buy it on Thursday -- but somehow or other the deal doesn't close by Friday. It goes cold. Next thing you know, the project that everybody was crazy about on Thursday, by Monday, is just dead. Nobody wants it.

So there's a certain "bird in the hand" sense that perhaps should guide your thinking -- unless the deal is really bad and your agent, if he's any good, isn't likely to jump at ten percent of a really lousy deal.

NMS

Howler · Dec 9, 2010

nmstevens, you are a gem! You've given me a lot to think about. Good, sensible advice.

If I sell the rights, will it state in the contract what "type of film" it might be? Meaning, how do I avoid it becoming an embarassing, cheap Sci-fi channel Saturday night movie?

That would be very painful...

I would hope that the contract would make it clear, in some way, that it would be a feature film for cinematic release, or whatever...and not some corny tv movie.

You know what I mean?

nmstevens · Dec 10, 2010

Howler said:
nmstevens, you are a gem! You've given me a lot to think about. Good, sensible advice.

If I sell the rights, will it state in the contract what "type of film" it might be? Meaning, how do I avoid it becoming an embarassing, cheap Sci-fi channel Saturday night movie?

That would be very painful...

I would hope that the contract would make it clear, in some way, that it would be a feature film for cinematic release, or whatever...and not some corny tv movie.

You know what I mean?

Part of that is going to come down to who you sell it to. And relying on the know-how of your agent is going to be central to that. But what it really comes down to is this.

The people who makes the really cheap "sci-fi" channel movies do it for next to nothing and, as a rule - they pay next to nothing. In fact, they rarely do book adaptations, unless they're in the public domain.

If your movie agent is as you indicated he was, he's going to know who the real players are and he's not going to want to get you into business with those low rent guys.

On the other hand, ultimately, there's this other thing that can happen, when books are bought for a lot of money by major studios and everyone goes into a project with the best hopes and the highest expectations and the result is an truly enormous and unbelievable disaster. A mess of epic proportions. A "Wild, Wild West" type mess. A movie you watch with jaw hanging, not quite believing how it could possibly have happened.

Yet no one set out to make these movies terrible. In fact, people often spend tens of millions of dollars on them. Really, they do all want them to be good movies. Good, at least in the sense of being successful movies that reach an audience that likes them.

The fact is, movies are enormously complicated things and countless things have to go right for them to succeed -- and often -- as with great engineering disasters, when you go back and unfold them, you find that numerous things need to go wrong -- and often do go wrong -- that turn them into the disasters that they end up being. A badly chosen director, a bad casting choice, a script that isn't ready -- or a writer or a producer or an exec or who knows who making a lethal story choice that just poisons the thing and it never quite recovers.

And there's nothing that anybody can put in a contract that can stop those things from happening.

NMS

Hillgate · Dec 11, 2010

The fewer links between original and final visions the better: a talented writer/director with laissez-faire producers/financiers is a great combination, but if you're selling a script then unless you or your agent have super-clout you will probably find yourself barred from set. However, if you get paid then I wouldn't worry too much - you just do what everyone else does and tell them the suits wrecked your amazing vision. If the film's great, tell everyone you're glad the film-makers followed your vision to the letter

Howler · Dec 13, 2010

nmstevens said:
Part of that is going to come down to who you sell it to. And relying on the know-how of your agent is going to be central to that. But what it really comes down to is this.

The people who makes the really cheap "sci-fi" channel movies do it for next to nothing and, as a rule - they pay next to nothing. In fact, they rarely do book adaptations, unless they're in the public domain.

If your movie agent is as you indicated he was, he's going to know who the real players are and he's not going to want to get you into business with those low rent guys.

On the other hand, ultimately, there's this other thing that can happen, when books are bought for a lot of money by major studios and everyone goes into a project with the best hopes and the highest expectations and the result is an truly enormous and unbelievable disaster. A mess of epic proportions. A "Wild, Wild West" type mess. A movie you watch with jaw hanging, not quite believing how it could possibly have happened.

Yet no one set out to make these movies terrible. In fact, people often spend tens of millions of dollars on them. Really, they do all want them to be good movies. Good, at least in the sense of being successful movies that reach an audience that likes them.

The fact is, movies are enormously complicated things and countless things have to go right for them to succeed -- and often -- as with great engineering disasters, when you go back and unfold them, you find that numerous things need to go wrong -- and often do go wrong -- that turn them into the disasters that they end up being. A badly chosen director, a bad casting choice, a script that isn't ready -- or a writer or a producer or an exec or who knows who making a lethal story choice that just poisons the thing and it never quite recovers.

And there's nothing that anybody can put in a contract that can stop those things from happening.

NMS

Sad truths...

I know that I have to stay connected in some way after the film rights have sold. What would you recommend I do? What 3 things would you try to retain once the negotiating begins?

How do you suggest I go about the negotiating so that I don't hurt or kill the deal?

Howler · Dec 13, 2010

Hillgate said:
The fewer links between original and final visions the better: a talented writer/director with laissez-faire producers/financiers is a great combination, but if you're selling a script then unless you or your agent have super-clout you will probably find yourself barred from set. However, if you get paid then I wouldn't worry too much - you just do what everyone else does and tell them the suits wrecked your amazing vision. If the film's great, tell everyone you're glad the film-makers followed your vision to the letter

Ha! May be I should contact Alan Moore for advice!

nmstevens · Dec 13, 2010

Howler said:
Sad truths...

I know that I have to stay connected in some way after the film rights have sold. What would you recommend I do? What 3 things would you try to retain once the negotiating begins?

How do you suggest I go about the negotiating so that I don't hurt or kill the deal?

There are standard things that any good agent will always try to negotiate and generally will be able to negotiate -- but what you have to understand is that what your agent is negotiating for on your behalf is generally -- money.

That is -- they make a sequel - you get money. They turn it into a TV series, you get money. They spin off a character into another movie, you get money. DVDs, foreign sales, TV sales -- you get money.

What he will *not* negotiate, unless by some bizarre chance your work, between now and the time the negotiations take place becomes overwhelmingly, monumentally successful -- is any kind of creative control or involvement on your part.

Even if he were to negotiate your right to write a first draft of the screenplay -- which some writers sometimes manage to get into the contract, from the point of view of the producers, they just consider that to be extra money that they have to spend.

They'd just give you the money and while you were busily working on your draft of the screenplay, they'd be working up the list of the *real* screenwriters that they'd be bringing in to pitch to write the *actual* screenplay for the movie, which would commence the minute that your screenplay crossed the transom, followed by a very polite phone call explaining how wonderful it was but how they feel that they really need to bring in another writer to "polish" it -- but thanks so much for bringing your special vision to your really wonderful -- etc., etc., etc. -- in other words, we love you -- get lost.

Now, sometimes they'll bring in a director who really loves the book and he wants to "collaborate" with the writer -- but don't kid yourself, because there are egos, there are super-egos, and then there are directors, and any collaboration with anybody and a director ends exactly at the point where the director's opinion says X and your opinion says anything other than X.

Because whatever your opinion may be, even in respect to your own book, if the director thinks it's X -- X is what it is, and X is what it's going to be and if you think otherwise, then maybe it's time for you to get a first class ticket back to wherever the heck you came from and you ought to start working on your next book where there isn't anybody hanging around telling you what not to write.

You see, I know that they always call it a collaborative artform -- but in some ways it is -- but not really.

That's because partners collaborate. You can have writing partners and the resulting script is a real collaboration. But it's not like that on a movie set. When you've got someone in complete charge, it's not so much as collaboration as - an absolute dictatorship - you work for him and he's the boss. If you both agree, that's great. If you disagree, we all pretty much know which way it's going to go.

Before there's a director, it's a producer or an exec -- and you can either both agree or it's his/her way -- or you're out. And once the director comes in -- ditto. You can agree, or it's his way -- or you're out.

Now, I have a very good friend who's a producer and what he's always said -- and it's really true -- is that you can get anyone to accept any idea that you want in Hollywood -- so long as you can make them think that it was their idea.

But that's not always so easy. And in any case, that's generally a problem for a screenwriter, not for the writer of the underlying material. When you're a screenwriter, you already know (or learn after a short time) that you're expendable and will probably be replaced before the movie gets made -- if it ever does.

I'm sorry if I've gone on for awhile - I guess this is just taking a long time to answer your brief question, but the answer really is that there's no way, short of being immensely successful and having the leverage that that brings, of being able to have any kind of influence, and even in that case, the amount of influence that you can bring to bear is limited.

You really must simply resign yourself to taking all that dirty money, smiling at the premiere (whatever the result may be), and going on about your business.

And if you can't live with that -- don't sell the rights to your material.

NMS

Howler · Dec 15, 2010

nmstevens, thank you very much for taking time the time to advise me. It all makes perfect sense. Good or bad, you've helped put this whole thing into perspective for me.
I sincerely appreciate it.

Onward and upward...

Jamesaritchie · Dec 23, 2010

Your agent is probably correct. The thing to remember is that no matter what sort of film is made, cheesy or not, your graphic novels will still be exactly as you wrote them. Hollywood can't change your novels. Nor does one film always mean the end of the road.

Advice on film rights and beyond....

Howler

nmstevens

What happened?

Stijn Hommes

Know what you write...

Howler

Howler

WriteKnight

Arranger Of Disorder

Howler

nmstevens

What happened?

Howler

nmstevens

What happened?

Hillgate

On location

Howler

Howler

nmstevens

What happened?

Howler

Jamesaritchie