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maestrowork
09-14-2005, 05:23 PM
I came across this. Interesting.

http://www.sfwa.org/writing/chadvce.htm

Sarita
09-14-2005, 05:26 PM
Ooo sins, YES! Oh, er- nevermind.

Very informative, Ray. Thanks for sharing.

inexperiencedinker
09-14-2005, 06:19 PM
I've seen this before, and I really like it. I especially like her advice on florid verbs. Now that I have started writing, I pick apart the books I am reading, and noticed one thing that stuck out as a good lesson. Readers don't read about trees.
Example: “The golden spheres of leaves danced merrily in the light afternoon breeze, back and forth. The thick stand of trees covered the winding river that fed their roots and gave them life, taking support in return. The trees….blah,blah,blah.”
I am not talking about scenery setting a tone, or all the other uses, but if it doesn't have an impact on your character, readers notice that. While reading I often wonder, "Why on earth did this author rant about the tree? This isn't doesn't make sense, and he never alluded to it again. What was the point of that? I was mislead!"
But I have never found myself saying, "Gee, I wish the author had become verbose concerning that poplar. I just love poplars. They are the best trees. He should have added more poplars to the story!"
Am I making any sense here? If an author paints a neon sign pointing to a sentence or phrase, I will pay attention. If he doesn't, then I won't. If he DOES, and it was for nothing, I feel like I was led on a wild goose chase because he has the control to lead my concentration and should anticipate my assumptions.
If he needs to make mention of the season, a simple sentence gives me the information without convincing me he is foreshadowing the tree. "The golden poplar leaves swayed in the wind." There. It's fall, breezy, and there are trees. Nothing inferred, or assumed. Just the facts, ma'am.

____________________
I think i need my coffee, that was way to brain wracking to write this early.
Thanks for the link!

Jamesaritchie
09-15-2005, 12:34 AM
Good article, but pay special note to how it ends: CHERRYH'S LAW: NO RULE SHOULD BE FOLLOWED OFF A CLIFF.

Even the rules in this article can and should be ignored when the writing demands it. The "dead" verb rule is especially tricky. There are many times when those are dead verbs, and many other times when those very verbs are not only needed, but far and away the best choice.

maestrowork
09-15-2005, 12:38 AM
My own #1 rule: if you find yourself trying TOO hard to be "good", you're not writing the best you could.

That includes dead verbs, adjectives, show/tell, am/was/were, etc. etc.

Saanen
09-15-2005, 02:09 AM
My own #1 rule: if you find yourself trying TOO hard to be "good", you're not writing the best you could.

That includes dead verbs, adjectives, show/tell, am/was/were, etc. etc.

Excellent point! Get the rough draft down on paper however you can. You can fix the dead verbs, etc. later. That's why it's called a rough draft.

Incidentally, and totally off topic here, how does one pronounce C.J. Cherryh's last name? I'm embarrassed to admit I say "Cherry-Aitch" mentally.

TheIT
09-15-2005, 02:15 AM
I've always heard Cherryh pronounced simply as "cherry". Incidentally, she's the sister of David Cherryh the artist.

azbikergirl
09-15-2005, 02:54 AM
Love her comment about the mirrors. I always groan when the character I'm reading about admires his/her own reflection in an effort to give the reader a physical description.

kristie911
09-15-2005, 09:37 AM
Love her comment about the mirrors. I always groan when the character I'm reading about admires his/her own reflection in an effort to give the reader a physical description.

Ah yes, the dreaded mirror scene...the stuff of cheesy romance novels!

pdr
09-15-2005, 10:39 AM
Grateful thanks for the site, Maestrowork. I don't have time to look at all the good stuff out on the net so I appreciate this board where you guys post urls to things like this. Loved the comments, particularly about florid verbs and School English.

Isn't Cherryh originally Russian or something Balkan and pronounced with more of an Sh as in Sherreh? Whatever she's one of my favourite SF writers. Anyone who can write 'May all your children be sons!' as the worst curse on Chanur gets my vote.

Sharon Mock
09-15-2005, 11:25 AM
Cherryh's Law is the single best piece of writing advice I've ever come across.

Garpy
09-15-2005, 06:23 PM
hmmmm....the mirror thing was sage advice, the rest...well...yeah, fair rules I suppose, but I break them just as much as I adhere to them. The best golden rule I can think of, and stick to rigidly is....

...if it reads good, it IS good dummy.

Jamesaritchie
09-15-2005, 06:33 PM
I've always heard Cherryh pronounced simply as "cherry". Incidentally, she's the sister of David Cherryh the artist.

She was born with the last name of "Cherry," and added the "h" later on, apparently to get rid of the jokes and to make her name more distinctive. But the name is still pronounced "Cherry."

Despite what you see around the internet, her brother is actually the artist David Cherry, not David Cherryh.

Saanen
09-16-2005, 12:13 AM
I'm glad to hear the H is silent--thanks! I really like her writing, and now I can say so out loud without fearing scorn from my mispronunciation of her name. :)

Ray Dillon
09-16-2005, 12:48 AM
NICE!! I've got it bookmarked and will definitely be reading this later. THANKS!!