So... incest?

Wryen · Jun 9, 2010

It's between a girl and her father and has been happening for years. The girl has become so twisted because of it that she actually thinks of her father as more of a boyfriend.

It's not the focus of the novel- we don't even find out about it until near the end- but it is a very important aspect of it. There's even the possibility that the story may go in a different direction where the man doesn't even end up being the girl's father. Either way, there will at least be a time in the story where there seems to be incest.

Is that acceptable in YA?

Marzipan · Jun 9, 2010

Yep, not only that but it has been done before. Read Tender Morsels. The dad even forces her to have a graphic abortion twice.

eventidepress · Jun 9, 2010

Identical by Ellen Hopkins features father-daughter incest too

Momento Mori · Jun 9, 2010

Cassandra Clare's Mortal Instruments trilogy has incest between brother and sister as a key plot point through all 3 books and it made the NYT bestseller lists.

MM

kaitiepaige17 · Jun 9, 2010

Anything can go in YA, something people need to be comfortable with. Basically, if you (or anyone) thinks that something may not be acceptable in a YA novel, it IS.

Shady Lane · Jun 9, 2010

No problem.

wandergirl · Jun 9, 2010

also check out SUCH A PRETTY GIRL by Laura Wiess.

Kats · Jun 10, 2010

I just bought a book called Forbidden about a brother and sister who fall in love (haven't read it yet though).

shaldna · Jun 10, 2010

Momento Mori said:
Cassandra Clare's Mortal Instruments trilogy has incest between brother and sister as a key plot point through all 3 books and it made the NYT bestseller lists.

MM

hmm. sort of. we all knew how it would work out though.

Personally I was kinda disapointed.

Momento Mori · Jun 10, 2010

shaldna:
Personally I was kinda disapointed.

Yeah, me too. In fact, I thought that Clare bottled it because the outcome was telegraphed and I never quite believed the reaction of either character to what was going on (and the whole "I'm a monster!" thing got real old, real fast). However, it does show that you can have incest front and center and not have to worry about impact on sales.

MM

Lydia Sharp · Jun 10, 2010

kaitiepaige17 said:
Anything can go in YA, something people need to be comfortable with. Basically, if you (or anyone) thinks that something may not be acceptable in a YA novel, it IS.

This.

And father-daughter incest is more common than I think some people realize. So if it's happening to children/teens in the real world, then why shouldn't we write about it?

shaldna · Jun 10, 2010

Momento Mori said:
In fact, I thought that Clare bottled it

me too. this is pretty much exactly how i felt. i would have had much more respect if she had gone with it all the to the end.

Wryen · Jun 10, 2010

Thanks for the answers. It's nice to know that I don't have to hold back at all. It's never good to try to hold back while writing.

ether · Jun 10, 2010

This was a question I was afraid to ask. I'm glad someone had more courage than I did to ask it!

2Wheels · Jun 10, 2010

kaitiepaige17 said:
Anything can go in YA, something people need to be comfortable with. Basically, if you (or anyone) thinks that something may not be acceptable in a YA novel, it IS.

Er, no. Not if you want to get published, that is.
It's always safer to ask. There are some subjects that will get you kicked out of this forum (and justly so), and there are some which will even get you kicked out of very liberally-minded (for want of a better term), adult only sites. The borders of what is acceptable in YA may be broader than a lot of people think, but there's still a lot of stuff out there beyond the borders ... where hopefully it will remain.

Marzipan · Jun 10, 2010

Er, no. Not if you want to get published, that is.
It's always safer to ask. There are some subjects that will get you kicked out of this forum (and justly so), and there are some which will even get you kicked out of very liberally-minded (for want of a better term), adult only sites. The borders of what is acceptable in YA may be broader than a lot of people think, but there's still a lot of stuff out there beyond the borders ... where hopefully it will remain.

Dude, I think it is pretty clear we are not talking about the ultra-taboo here.

2Wheels · Jun 10, 2010

Indeed, but to some, incest constitutes ultra-taboo, which is possibly why the OP asked the question.

kaitiepaige17 · Jun 10, 2010

2Wheels said:
Indeed, but to some, incest constitutes ultra-taboo, which is possibly why the OP asked the question.

There are books out there about incest, so such topics can be published. Whether or not parents want their YAs reading such things, that's another story, but we aren't talking about that here. What is taboo? Incest, rape, suicide, sex changes, heavy drug use, prostitution, GLB relationships (sad, but still true) yet many, MANY novels with such content have been published. It's not unpublishable. If writers didn't include such material, YA books wouldn't speak true to the YA generation today, which is what teens want to read about: themselves.

Lydia Sharp · Jun 10, 2010

kaitiepaige17 said:
If writers didn't include such material, YA books wouldn't speak true to the YA generation today, which is what teens want to read about: themselves.

You took the words right out from under my fingertips. But just to clarify to the OP, it's always okay to ask if you're not sure.

Jorge A. · Jun 10, 2010

Someone should really make a book titled: "So...incest?" I have scanned through the forums many times; that post title always catches my eye.

Elysium · Jun 10, 2010

Jorge - Lol. It is a really eye-catching thread title.

To answer your question, yes it is acceptable in YA. As a lot of other people said, YA depicts the lives of teens and I'm sure there girls out there who are in romantic relationships with their fathers.

We live in a world where things that were taboo before, aren't now.

DrummerGirl · Jun 10, 2010

Just jumping on here a little late

I read Sleeping Dogs by Sonya Hartnett when I was fourteen, and couldn't put it down. It was a YA novel.

The main plot point was incest between a brother and sister and just that alone provides a lot of conflict and tension and mixed emotions in me. it still resonates with me today, that book, remembering how it made me feel when I read it

Andddddddddddd, I just watched the Australian film, Beautiful Kate, recently which has this awesome incest storyline that's completely haunting and you-just-cant-look-away and it totally breaks your heart.

Anyway, I guess my thoughts are: it's a really compelling premise and there's so many ways it can be done. Especially if you can blur the lines or morality, which makes the stakes/tension even higher.

Edit: Oh! Oh! Just remembered Flowers in the Attic! hahahahaha. Who didnt read them? I'd probably cringe if I had to re-read that book, but in high school lots of people were reading it - even the non-reader-y type kids, probably just for the incest, haha

eyeblink · Jun 10, 2010

DrummerGirl said:
Andddddddddddd, I just watched the Australian film, Beautiful Kate, recently which has this awesome incest storyline that's completely haunting and you-just-cant-look-away and it totally breaks your heart.

It's out in British cinemas on 30 July, so I'll see it then - otherwise I'd have blind-bought the Australian DVD which is out now. I've heard very good things about this film.

Momento Mori · Jun 11, 2010

2Wheels:
Indeed, but to some, incest constitutes ultra-taboo, which is possibly why the OP asked the question.

And I think that the list of YA books posted here establishes that the minority who consider incest to be ultra-taboo have not succeeded in such books being released or, indeed, be successful.

MM

Vince524 · Jun 11, 2010

I don;t think it's a no no, but it will depend on how it is handled. How graphic is it? Is it glorified? If it shows the girl as a victim and the reader isn't being told it's acceptable, then I don;t see a problem. Although I have seen a few agents that say they don;t want that stuff.

So... incest?

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