A real specific question

[monkeygirl0684]

Hey guys, hope everyone is doing well. I am in a really scary position and I was hoping to glean some info from the more experienced members of this board. I am currently an unagented first time writer (I had to drop the agent I had, wasn't doing anything for me and was truly failing to accompish his end of the agreement with the sending and all) and I have a fantasy trilogy on my hands that I am really proud of. I love writing, and my dream much like millions of others would be to be the next best seller, but my realistic goal is just to live a modest lifestyle off of writing. Even that I know is unlikely, but I figure I should set a high goal. As for right now, I am running out of options as far as agents go, and I want to start querying small presses once I exhaust my list of possible agents. I queried DAW and Tor, but it was pretty obvious that my work was never read by either judging by the way the package came back (On one of the rejections they even put the wrong name of the book, even though it was clearly where they requested it, till this day I can't explain how they goofed) I feel as if smaller presses will be my next choice, but here's the question, and I am SO sorry I gave that longwinded explanation, I just wanted the full scoop on why I feel the way I do. I think the book could do well even though I haven't had much luck in the publishing world with it, I have given the book a little exposure through other venues and I've gotten positive feedback, so I am confident enough in it that should I get rejected by every single one of my options, I will self publish as best as I can.

But, should I self publish, I know I have to sell a high amount of books in a relatively short amount of time to get the attention of an agent. Should I be that lucky and I do get an agent because of my self publishing efforts, will I end up being without any further options anyway? I ask because I have read that agents do not like to submit to publishers that have previously rejected you. Wouldn't the high self published numbers balance the fact that a publisher had rejected you earlier? Thanks a lot for your patience and for actually reading all this! I just don't know if I should just skip the small presses or actually self publish right now. My goal is to get published any way I can, and if I have to sell ten thousand self published copies in under a year to get noticed, then I will try my hardest! :)

[Ella]

NO. Keep submitting. Submit for years. Then look at why it was rejected. Rewrite it. Keep submitting. If it's good, having even a small press pick it up gives you more credibility than POD or self publishing.

My concise one cent. Best of luck!

[James D. Macdonald]

Keep looking for an agent.

Write a new, different, better book. Submit that.

You have lots and lots of publishers still to go with your fantasy novel. Send it out 'til Hell won't have it.

Self-publishing, especially for novels, isn't a good choice.

[triceretops]

Welcome Monkeygirl. Crazy name, but fun. You've just gotten the best advice that you are going to get. Self-publishing is like taking on another full/part time job, and throwing money into it besides. It sounds like you really have something here if you know that you can perfect it and keep sending it out.

This is non-standard and goes against what you're taught here, especially in the UJ thread. But, I have always submitted my novels to small publishers, to purposely solicite rejections with comments. It does work and force me into major rewrites. So in reality I'm using the small pubs as an editing service. I only hit a half dozen or so to see if I'm far afield somewhere. But if it leads to a much better rewrite I'm more apt to have it ready for the medium and larger houses. I DO NOT recommend that everyone do this, but in your case I think you need to bomb the little and indie presses to get some legitimate feedback. Nothing can spur you on more than a nice critique from a editor, who at least has read your entire book.

Also, if I happen to get picked up by a large house I can probably bring an agent in the deal.

The point is to submit, submit, submit.

Triceratops

[Nicholas S.H.J.M Woodhouse]

Ahoy monkeygirl and welcome to AW.

These people sure know their cookies. You came to the right place.

[Canada James]

This is non-standard and goes against what you're taught here, especially in the UJ thread. But, I have always submitted my novels to small publishers, to purposely solicit rejections with comments. It does work and force me into major rewrites.

I like working with small publishers.
#1 - I get a lot of attention.
#2 - I'm getting a great education that I couldn't pay for. (In fact, I'm getting paid FOR it.)
#3 - Did I mention I get a lot of attention?

cj

[KTC]

I agree with all of the above. Self Publishing is not even an option for me. I would never consider it, for various reasons.

[Cathy C]

I agree with everything said. But I will mention that if you plan to "live a modest lifestyle off of writing," you're going to need a lot more than one trilogy. Even after they're published, checks for advances and royalties are few and far between. At a minimum, there is a six to eight month lag between royalty checks, which makes it hard to pay the monthly mortgage and electric bills. You'll need 5-6 books contracted for to start to be able to make a living at it, (and that's ONLY if they're well received by the public.) You might get fortunate and have the next Harry Potter on your hands, of course. Nobody ever knows for sure until it hits the stands.

But for the moment, do as suggested here and get started on the next book and keep sending out the first three until you get a bite. I'd definitely look for another agent, too. If one liked the series, someone else will too.

Good luck!

[Danger Jane]

There's a good agent for you somewhere. If you don't keep submitting, you won't know. It's kind of like wanting to get married but refusing to date.

[victoriastrauss]

As for right now, I am running out of options as far as agents go, and I want to start querying small presses once I exhaust my list of possible agents.There are scads of sf/fantasy-oriented independent publishers, but only a few are commercially viable. If sales and readership are what you want, your small-press options in this field are extremely limited.

Are you approaching agents who specialize in science fiction and fantasy? There's a goodly number of them. One way to locate them is to read Locus magazine--there's a report every month on who's sold what to whom.

Many authors don't manage to break in with their first novel (or series). Do continue to query for your series, but don't stop writing in the meantime--if these books don't sell, your next may.

- Victoria

[sassandgroove]

After reading the never ending publishamerica thread among others, even legit self publishing sounds like a tough row to how. For me, I will (when I have something ) just collect rejections until I get that one glimmer of hope...Keep looking, when you say you are running out of options for agents, where are you looking? This is a huge country, and world, if you're only looking locally ( I don't know where that is for you) I'd say expand your seach area.

[James D. Macdonald]

Why self-publishing is hard:

There are specialists with a great deal of experience who make their livings doing full time what you're trying to do part-time financed out of your own pocket.

[monkeygirl0684]

Thanks a lot you guys, I have been reading this board for a little over half a year and the generosity and kindness you all show here gets me breathless everytime. Truly, thank you very much for taking time out of your day to help me. And to clarify my position for sassandgroove and others, I really have tried a lot of agents. Ms. Strauss, I have looked at sources like Publisher's Marketplace, I bought the Herman book, of course I went through P&E and this forum for any chance of a good agent that represents fantasy. I've gotten very few promising moments (as far as personalized rejections, or requests for more info and the like) I just don't want to have to requery the same agents again, I would hate to have them look at my name and automatically blacklist me. I just thought self publishing would be an option because you always hear of the success stories behind them, G.P. Taylor, M.J. Rose, I think Christopher Paolini started that way as well. Of course you never hear of the tragedies of self publishing, but at least if I self published I would have a somewhat small amount of control in my fate. That's why I was leaning towards it...

P.S. (again) Triceretops, you like dinos, I like monkies! :) Well... until they get mad, then they just do all sorts of horrible things, hehe. Thanks again!