Plagiarism vs Inspiration

There is nothing new under the sun - only your voice and style.

It's knowing the difference between an idea and outright copying. High school vampire romance is an idea, and even if Meyer wanted to she couldn't copyright that. She no more has a monopoly on high school vampire romance than J.R.R. Tolkien had on elves. If the book had exact passages from Meyer's book, that would be plaigarism.

Basically, what the others have said.

Ideas are broad - character type and setting, such as "vampire in high school". It's when you get to the specifics that you have to not copy someone.

Take that "vampire in high school" and make him sparkly and a resident of Forks, and your idea isn't so broad anymore. Silver Kiss and The Vampire Diaries handled the human/vamp love angle for teens a while ago, but neither are like each other or Twilight, so none is plagiarized from another. You could even write a vampire romance with a lead named Edward and it still wouldn't be plagiarism.

Personally, I think there's a lot of Snow White in Twilight. (Beautiful innocent girl, prince charming, crazy woman out to kill her, seven friendly folks in the woods who take her into the family, etc.) That story's so old that no one owns it and it's been used for hundreds of "inspired by" stories.

There's also a matter of accepted lore with genres. Vampires have been around for millenia, and there are certain aspects of them that are basic to the species. Ditto with werewolves, fairies, trolls, orcs, elves, dwarves, evil alien overlords, whatever. Those elements will likely be in most stories about them just by virtue of being part of their accepted make-up. It's no more plagiarism than five people writing that squirrels have four legs and a fluffy tail - they just do, and it's a known fact.

proxy said:

Where does one draw the line? I'm asking this because I see obvious parallels between Logan's Run / City of Ember,
or Battle Royale / The Hunger Games.

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Neither of these concepts are actually new concepts. They have been done many times by many writers. It's all about how the writer executes the story that sets it apart.

Not only that, but I started reading some random vampire YA my sister left on the table, and on page 10 she's in school and meets a hot vampire boy.

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Oh god not another one.

Really? Huh. How is that not plagiarism?

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You can't plagarise and idea. You can only plagarise actual words. And 'hot vampire boy' has been a staple in YA for at least 15 years.

I threw the book and ran away in horror.

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Funny I did that with twilight too.

Anyway, my own WIP is heavily influenced by my favorite novel which is now 20-30 years old. In fact I've taken the same "idea" and have changed it into something else. Is that considered plagiarism?

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No.

The "world" is entirely different. My characters, plot, names, storyline, theme, and even writing style are completely different from the book I've taken some inspiration from, and I've added many more things of my own. Yet the underlying "mechanic" is still there, in the same way that Hunger games is similar to Battle Royale.

Should I be worried at all?

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No

proxy said:

True. I think it was Betrayed that had the main character meet a vampire boy at school, in a science class, and she's forced to sit right next to him. I guess if that isn't plagiarism, I'm good lol.

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In HUSH, HUSH, the schoolgirl protagonist meets the supernatural bad boy love interest in biology class. Apparently it's the only place YA paranormal romance authors remember from their school days.

proxy said:

I started reading some random vampire YA my sister left on the table, and on page 10 she's in school and meets a hot vampire boy. Really? Huh. How is that not plagiarism?

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Plagiarism is using someone else's exact (or nearly exact) words. That's how that's not plagiarism.

Like Terie said, the def of plagairism is (from Websters New Dictionary):use (words or ideas) of another as if your own.

Are you copying word for word another story? Then don't worry about it. Do you have the same characters, same scenes, same climax, and same resolution...but simply changed the names and some words around? No? Then I think you are safe. If we got into an idea of "borrowing" ideas from other works of writing or movies, we would be here all day.

shaldna said:

Funny I did that with twilight too.

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Parametric said:

In HUSH, HUSH, the schoolgirl protagonist meets the supernatural bad boy love interest in biology class. Apparently it's the only place YA paranormal romance authors remember from their school days.

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Someone pointed out to me that the alien love interest and the MC in Roswell are also biology partners.

Kathleen42 said:

Someone pointed out to me that the alien love interest and the MC in Roswell are also biology partners.

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They were, and incidentally there was an issue with DNA, they were looking at thier partners slavia or something, and Max freaked out because he was an alien and he didn't want anyone to find out etc etc (sound a bit like that whole blood scene in twilight biology?)

shaldna said:

They were, and incidentally there was an issue with DNA, they were looking at thier partners slavia or something, and Max freaked out because he was an alien and he didn't want anyone to find out etc etc (sound a bit like that whole blood scene in twilight biology?)

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They were examining cheek cells. Max's were green and not the right shape, so he asked to go to the nurse.

Cyia said:

Basically, what the others have said.

Take that "vampire in high school" and make him sparkly and a resident of Forks, and your idea isn't so broad anymore. Silver Kiss and The Vampire Diaries handled the human/vamp love angle for teens a while ago, but neither are like each other or Twilight, so none is plagiarized from another.

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Loved "Silver Kiss"...read it in middle school. It was the first book that we passed around our circle of friends...we were a little obsessive about it. Haven't thought about it in a long time...

shaldna said:

You can't plagarise and idea. You can only plagarise actual words.

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Well ... actually you can plagiarize an idea.
You can also violate the copyright of an 'idea', though copyright law is harder to violate than the moral restraints against plagiarism.
Or you can just be derivative.

What makes copying 'plagiarism' or 'copyright violation' rather than merely homage or 'influence' or genre convention or everybody following the same literary tradition
is (1) how closely you copy specific elements of another writer's work and (2) how 'original' those elements are, and (3) whether you're being open about it -- as per West Side Story.

If your MC is the large, heroic bearer of a magic sword, engaged in a quest for a magic goblet,
you're just following an old tradition.

If your MC has scaled blue skin and a forked tongue and carries a sword that turns into a serpent and his father was the Cobra God . . .
then it is plagiarism to do the same -- even if no actual passages are copied. Agents have very likely seen the movie or played the video game* and will Not Be Impressed.

Now the OP sees himself as heavily influenced by a book he loves. He has made every effort not to plagiarize.
I don't want to say, "Stop being influenced and write something of your own."
Though I would suggest this when he goes on to Manuscript Two.

Perhaps part of his beta process can be to hand over both the original work and his manuscript for a heads up on any elements that strike too close to the book and need to be revised.



*(This Blue-skinned Cobra God bit is not from an actual video game, but it was influenced by Jane Gaskell's The Serpent.)

As has been said, there is nothing new under the sun.

As such, people are allowed to draw all of the parallels that they want, and that's good, because it allows them to seek out other similar material that may appeal to them.

And sometimes it's fun, because it allows for batshitcrazy fan theories - such as, with my 'verse, the argument can be made that my character is in fact an alternate-dimension copy of Tony Stark (they're both geniuses, rich, technology-inclined and have a huge, powerful, coveted power source in their chest). Did I do this on purpose? No. It is plagiarism? No. Is it fun to listen to? Yes.

proxy said:

...on page 10 she's in school and meets a hot vampire boy. Really? Huh. How is that not plagiarism?

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By the way, thought you might like to see what plagiarism looks like (and 'girl meets hot vampire boy in school' isn't it ).

From my original manuscript:

Over the next few months I got bigger and bigger. It became difficult to keep up with my daily chores. My feet began to swell, so I couldn't stand up for long, but I was still expected to cook and clean. (name redacted) helped as much as she could, but, unlike (name redacted), there was no staying in bed all day for me.

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From the published book:

Over the next few months I got bigger and bigger, making it difficult to keep up with my daily chores. I couldn't stand up for long, as I was very tired, and my feet swelled up, but I was still expected to cook and clean. (name redacted) helped as much as she could, but, unlike (name redacted), there was no staying in bed all day for me.

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Fifty-two percent (52%) of the published book was like this.

The case was settled out of court.

You haven't read the ultimate 'hot vampire boy' until you've read the manga: Vampire Knight.

Awesome.

Terie - that's scary.

How did you find out about it in the first place?

Terie, yikes. I'm also wondering how you found out and where the person got a copy of your material.

shaldna said:

How did you find out about it in the first place?

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It's something I've chosen not to be very public about, so I'm afraid I must respectfully decline to answer this question. I chose that particular passage because it would be nearly impossible to identify the work in question from it.

I think Job has a good point here too.

Although IDEAS are not copyright, spins on ideas can be. So, boy falls in love with girl is an idea. Sparkly vampire boy falls in love with mermaid is a spin on the idea, and that can be considered to be plagarism of an idea.

Plagiarism is pretty definite, using someone else's work and passing it off as your own. But the rest can be much more of a grey area.

Vampires are a good example to mention. People have been writing about vampires for a long time. They're an interesting subject for fiction. A lazy writer will prodcue something derivative, an obvious rip off of other vampire stories. A better writer will put her own spin on the old idea while retaining the factors that make them interesting.

And what's "derivative rubbish" to one person is "a modern exploration of a classic theme" to someone else.

Some ideas just keep coming up over and over, because they are intriguing and writers want to keep returning to those themes. They've read and been influenced by the work of other writers exploring those themes and they want to write about them too. Hopefully with something new to say about them.