Is publishing really this bleak?

CNmoon · Feb 5, 2010

A dog eat dog world. I've been researching the biz and am searching for a Literary Agent but a feeling of dispair consistently arises. Agents only looking for safe bets, people unwilling to read anything they think would be unprofitable, and the many many scam artist around.

I wonder, how is it when you get pass this little annoyance of finding a publisher? Doors open up when you make a name for yourself but does it ever lose that feeling of being treated like a talented whore?

The law I see around here is "Money flows to the writer" but I wonder what that is worth? I've read of people re-editing their manuscripts several times for it to sell but does that mean they were never satisfied with their work to begin with? Priorities, priorities, priorities; maybe they just needed the money or had a point to prove. I just wonder what was lost?

Going over what I've written here, it comes off as whiny and bleak. I suppose that is the nature of business. "Money flows to the writer because agents and publishers need a writer to sell."

I don't know, maybe I just needed to let out some of the haze. Eh, I'll sweat it out eventually.

"There's no such thing as the real world, its just a lie you've got to rise above."
John Mayer

scarletpeaches · Feb 5, 2010

In answer to your thread title question: no.

Kudos on the John Mayer quote. I love that guy so hard.

Bubastes · Feb 5, 2010

Thanks for echoing what I've been thinking. And for the John Mayer quote. I've been feeling so discouraged lately.

Wayne K · Feb 5, 2010

If I research anything long enough, I'll find a reason not to try.

Chris P · Feb 5, 2010

Wayne K said:
If I research anything long enough, I'll find a reason not to try.

Agreed. "Analysis paralysis" is threatening to kill me, and at some point I'm just going to have to take my best shot and get querying again (once my revisions are done). Anyone who makes it will point to a number of "rules" they broke in the process, either deliberately or innocently. If all of the rules were absolutes, nobody would get published anywhere.

WildScribe · Feb 5, 2010

CNmoon said:
The law I see around here is "Money flows to the writer" but I wonder what that is worth? I've read of people re-editing their manuscripts several times for it to sell but does that mean they were never satisfied with their work to begin with? Priorities, priorities, priorities; maybe they just needed the money or had a point to prove. I just wonder what was lost?

What was lost is generally unnecessary verbiage. In other words, editors wants cuts for a reason, and most of the time that reason is to make your book better. Not worse.

The Otter · Feb 5, 2010

Getting published is very difficult, yes. That's why the two most important qualities for writers to have are persistence and a love of their craft. We work our butts off and pour countless hours of thought and effort into our projects for comparatively meager monetary rewards (unless you're Stephen King or Stephanie Meyers, but most of us aren't.)

That's not just writing though, that's the arts in general. There are plenty of easier ways to make money or get recognition, if that's your goal. If you don't love to write or NEED to write (and I need to write, I'd go insane if I didn't), then there's absolutely no reason to be doing it.

PoppysInARow · Feb 5, 2010

Yeah, there are a lot of scam artists out there, like Publish America. Yeah, sometimes you need to edit endlessly, scraping books and starting all over again befre you find something worth subbing. Yeah, sometimes we get kicked in the teeth a few times.

But that's the nature of the business.

People come with this pre-concienved notion that writing a bok is easy. Publishing is easy. A lot of people think it's just write the book, do a spell check nd you'll be rolling in doe.

It's hard. A lot of people give up because it's so hard, and they're the ones who never get published. And if you always look on the dark side of publishing, you'll get discouraged and quit. But that's life, every business, every aspect of life comes with a dark side. In canada there's something like 38% divorce rate. Does that mean you shouldn't get married just because there's a little over 1/3 chance you might get divorced?

There are nasty things about publishing, but there are great things about it as well. No need to let it get you down.

BigWords · Feb 6, 2010

PoppysInARow said:
A lot of people think it's just write the book, do a spell check nd you'll be rolling in doe.

Sentences which mention spell-checking and yet contain a typo make me smile.

MarthaT · Feb 16, 2010

It certainly is hard at times, but with a positive attitude and hard work, the hard times are easily overcome!

E. S. Lark · Feb 16, 2010

You ever heard of the saying "You must love yourself before being loved?" (something along the lines of that anyway.) Same things goes for writing. You must have confidence in your own work if you plan on being picked up by an agent. if you are excited about your work and know your craft, you will be asked for a partial or a full, but you need to keep trying until you do.

Being published is hard because everyone has a story to tell. If it were easy, the markets would be flooded with books that would likely never get read. There are a few resources I use when looking for agents, but this one is my favorite. When you are ready, browse around and check the individual sites for their specific guidelines.

http://querytracker.net/

Here, have an AW index:

http://www.absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=792

shaldna · Feb 18, 2010

yes. it is.

that's why so many writers are hardened alcoholics.

FOTSGreg · Feb 23, 2010

Writing is a hard, difficult, confusing, and dirty business to try to break into. It's more difficult than getting a job that requires an extensive state and federal background check and a prior top secret and Q-level clearance.

Getting a book published has lower chances than you obtaining that top secret or Q-level clearance.

There are fewer people in the US earning their entire living off of their books than there are needed to man a professional baseball team.

Don't quit your day job.

But ask yourself - if you found your dream job tomorrow, doing something other than writing, could you stop writing?

If the answer is yes, then you need to go after that dream job and forget about this writing dream. It's just a dream.

Writing has to be an obsession, not a means to an end. Writing has to be as much a part of your life as eating and drinking and even breathing. You have to view writing as both your "other" job and your real life.

For example I work at WalMart to mark time and earn enough money to keep a roof over my head and pay my bills.

I write because I can and I'm good at it, but also because it's my life.

WalMart wants my life to be "the Store", but it's not even close. My stories and my writing are my life and nothing else even comes close.

Wayne K · Feb 23, 2010

Well, what do you wanna hear, man? Do you wanna hear that sometimes I think about eatin' a bullet? Huh? Well, I do! I even got a special bullet for the occasion with a hollow point, look! Make sure it blows the back of my goddamned head out and do the job right! Every single day I wake up and I think of a reason not to do it! Every single day! You know why I don't do it? This is gonna make you laugh! You know why I don't do it? Writing! Doin' the job! Now that's the reason!

Captcha · Feb 23, 2010

Wayne K said:
Well, what do you wanna hear, man? Do you wanna hear that sometimes I think about eatin' a bullet? Huh? Well, I do! I even got a special bullet for the occasion with a hollow point, look! Make sure it blows the back of my goddamned head out and do the job right! Every single day I wake up and I think of a reason not to do it! Every single day! You know why I don't do it? This is gonna make you laugh! You know why I don't do it? Writing! Doin' the job! Now that's the reason!

Damn, I know I recognize it...

Lethal Weapon?

kaitie · Feb 24, 2010

Lethal Weapon! Just watched this again a few weeks ago.

sheadakota · Feb 24, 2010

Crazy Mel- gotta love the guy and all that hair

(remember the HUGE cell phones in the movie- make me crack up every time I see it)

Wayne K · Feb 24, 2010

That's the first time someone guessed it.

lucidzfl · Feb 24, 2010

shaldna said:
yes. it is.

that's why so many writers are hardened alcoholics.

James D. Macdonald · Feb 24, 2010

FOTSGreg said:
There are fewer people in the US earning their entire living off of their books than there are needed to man a professional baseball team.

Not 100% true. There are, what, 30 guys on a baseball team? I can name many more writers living off their writing just off the top of my head.

That there are more people earning their living as professional athletes, counting all sports, than there are people earning their living from writing books, that I might believe.

IceCreamEmpress · Feb 24, 2010

FOTSGreg said:
There are fewer people in the US earning their entire living off of their books than there are needed to man a professional baseball team.

Nonsense. I personally know more than 30 people in the US who earn 100% of their income from writing right this minute.

And that's people I know well enough to call on the phone--it doesn't include Stephen King and Stephenie Meyer and Dan Brown and Jodi Picoult and Nora Roberts and Debbie Macomber and James Patterson and Tom Clancy and Michael Chabon and Laurell K. Hamilton and Charlaine Harris and John Grisham and Janet Evanovich and Nicholas Sparks and Danielle Steel and Jennifer Crusie and Michael Connelly and Linda Lael Miller and Peter Straub and Jackie Collins and Dean Koontz and John Irving and Anne Tyler and Anita Shreve and Jan Karon and Stuart Woods and Patricia Cornwell and Tess Gerritsen and Larry McMurtry and other staples of the best-seller list.

And that's just adult fiction. I could give you another 30 best-selling non-fiction writers who have no other day job, and another 30 best-selling writers for young adults and kids who have no other day job.

Your numbers are way off.

Ken · Feb 24, 2010

CNmoon said:
Going over what I've written here, it comes off as whiny and bleak.

... perhaps a bit, but don't let that bother you. We ALL are like that some days, though of course we do our best to hide that from others. Kudos for your honesty. I don't agree with most of what you've said, but I can appreciate where you're coming from on an emotional level. Keep at it and stay strong and you'll have your day, yet

straightshooter · Mar 23, 2010

Went looking for PMA threads - and got this

Actually what I really needed - was to read some of this. I've been writing for 8 years (yeah - just a tick on the universal author clock) and finally got to send the MS to Petter Miller and androids. I was so hopeful, even though the part of my brain that deals in reason said save the happy feet dance. After 5 months of requiring exclusivity, it passed their preliminary read - but on 2nd sweep ( after careful review of the fiction market ....blah blah blah.) I spent 5 days licking my wounds and found the courage the call for some real feed-back. I was informed that 'they don't do that.' "But you had my MS for 5 months and it would be so helpful for me to know where I need to improve..." "Sorry - we're really busy" - couldn't hang up fast enough. I thanked her for her time. It wasn't what I was thinking.
The book is very democratic (very anti republican) - "A cycle of Greed" - fiction based on the health care crisis. Anyone know a far left agent or publisher I could query?
Beyond this immense disappointment - I plan to go off and write something very commercial. Just - please don't make me write the tired 'guy gets murdered and we spend the next 400 pages trying to figure out who killed him. Wow - how original (but that one theme monopolizes 95% of the thriller/suspense shelves in any book store. I think that is what you were talking about. Can anyone say lobotomy?
Any feedback here would be greatly appreciated.
Jill

CaoPaux · Mar 23, 2010

Oh, dear. One of the cardinal rules when dealing with agents is Don't Call. I suggest reading through the Ask the Agent and Ask the Editor forums to get a feel for how they work and how you should proceed.

shakeysix · Mar 23, 2010

from time to time i manage to give something away but i've never sold anything to anybody. still i'm very upbeat about the whole bleeping mess and am actually considering quitting my day job to write full time. --s6

Is publishing really this bleak?

bananaed

Likes metaphors mixed, not stirred

Slave to the Wordcount

Friendly Neighborhood Mustelid

Geekzilla

Editing all the time

The cake is a lie. But still cake.

Today is your last day.

With great power comes

part of the human equation

Back from the dead

Your Genial Uncle

Hapless Virago

Mostly Harmless

blue eyed floozy