Can someone please clarify for me . . .

PGK · Jan 7, 2010

. . . the difference between (or at least the definition of) multiple submissions and simultaneous submissions.

This is how I understand it (please correct me if I'm wrong):

Multiple submissions means submitting more than one MS to an editor/agent

or

Submitting the same MS to multiple editors/agents within the same publishing company/ agency.

Simultaneous submissions means submitting your MS to more than one agent/editor in other companies/agencies. In other words, submitting an MS to two different agencies at the same time.

I believe it was the DAW publishing company that stated on their site that simultaneous submissions are not accepted. I believe it was that pub which clarified this (giving me the definition I'm now trying to clarify) as "this means if your MS is under review with another publisher be courteous and don't send us your MS until you have heard from them."

This brings up a second question, but I will not ask it because based on the correct definition of these terms it might be irrelevant.

geardrops · Jan 7, 2010

Multiple Submissions: One Editor, Many Stories

Simultaneous Submissions: Many Editors, One Story

Adam · Jan 7, 2010

As I understand it, multiple submissions means more than one piece of writing submitted to the same publisher/agent at the same time, whereas simultaneous submissions means one piece of writing submitted to more than one publisher/agent at once.

Edit - Dempsey beat me to it, and put it better.

katiemac · Jan 7, 2010

Simultaneous submissions is sending your work to more than one agent/publisher at a time.

Multiple submissions means pitching more than one project at a time to the same agent/publisher.

PGK · Jan 7, 2010

Thank you. This does bring up my second question: Why do some publishers/agents not accept simultaneous submissions and how would they know anyway?
For example with DAW if I sent them my MS and at the same time sent it to Tom Doherty LLC how would DAW know about this? I doubt they communicate with each other and compare notes about the thousands of MSs they receive.
Basically, is it a rule they set like a speed limit (where you can still speed by a cop as long as it's not too obvious) or is it grounded in something more concrete?

Andrhia · Jan 7, 2010

The distinction is that most *agents* accept simultaneous submissions, but few *publishers* do.

This is for the publisher's convenience. If they go through the bother of reading your story, working out where it might fit into their list and schedule, and then make an offer to you, they're going to be very put out to discover you already signed a contract with somebody else.

EclipsesMuse · Jan 7, 2010

What Andrrhia said. Also, from what I have learned on here, (there are actually quite a few agents and publishers who frequent this site), publishers do communicate with one another. As do agents. So if you do a simultaneous submission when asked not to and it IS found out, that can make you look unprofessional with not only that publisher, but others as well.

CaroGirl · Jan 8, 2010

Keep in mind that queries are not submissions. You can query as many agents/publishers as you like. It's when they start requesting fulls and partials that these become submissions. If agent A asks for a full of your ms and you send it, and then agent B asks for a full of the same ms, if you send it to agent B, you've made a simultaneous submission. Courtesy states that you inform agent A about the request and not send the full ms without their knowledge or permission, and vice versa. Agents have a right to know if other agents are also considering your work.

Andrhia · Jan 8, 2010

CaroGirl said:
If agent A asks for a full of your ms and you send it, and then agent B asks for a full of the same ms, if you send it to agent B, you've made a simultaneous submission. Courtesy states that you inform agent A about the request and not send the full ms without their knowledge or permission, and vice versa. Agents have a right to know if other agents are also considering your work.

Hmmm. It's been my understanding that you only need to bring up other agents if one agent is requesting an exclusive, or if an agent has made an offer of representation. In the case of an exclusive you'd need to explain that another agent is already looking at your partial/full (queries don't matter in this instance.) Or if you've received an offer of representation, it's polite to let other agents reading partials/fulls that you've received it, so they get the chance to put your submission at the top of the stack and see if they'd like to make a counter-offer.

I'd be curious to get other opinions on this. Should you report partials and fulls sent out to all interested parties, even if you don't have any offers in hand yet?

CaroGirl · Jan 8, 2010

Andrhia said:
Hmmm. It's been my understanding that you only need to bring up other agents if one agent is requesting an exclusive, or if an agent has made an offer of representation. In the case of an exclusive you'd need to explain that another agent is already looking at your partial/full (queries don't matter in this instance.) Or if you've received an offer of representation, it's polite to let other agents reading partials/fulls that you've received it, so they get the chance to put your submission at the top of the stack and see if they'd like to make a counter-offer.

I'd be curious to get other opinions on this. Should you report partials and fulls sent out to all interested parties, even if you don't have any offers in hand yet?

It's my understanding that asking for an exclusive is the same as saying no simultaneous submissions. What would the difference be there?

DeadlyAccurate · Jan 8, 2010

CaroGirl said:
Courtesy states that you inform agent A about the request and not send the full ms without their knowledge or permission, and vice versa. Agents have a right to know if other agents are also considering your work.

No, not unless they asked for an exclusive. It's courteous not to accept an offer without giving the others reading the full a chance to chime in with their own offer, but you don't have to go back and tell everyone you have another request for a full, and you certainly don't have to ask permission. (It's your book and your career, not the agent's).

CaroGirl · Jan 8, 2010

DeadlyAccurate said:
No, not unless they asked for an exclusive. It's courteous not to accept an offer without giving the others reading the full a chance to chime in with their own offer, but you don't have to go back and tell everyone you have another request for a full, and you certainly don't have to ask permission. (It's your book and your career, not the agent's).

So if an agent's site clearly states "we do not accept simultaneous submissions" you can go ahead and sent a full of your ms to several agents at the same time? Doesn't that ignore the guidelines?

I agree with you about "permission." That was the wrong way to phrase it.

DeadlyAccurate · Jan 8, 2010

Not accepting simultaneous submissions is the same as asking for an exclusive.

I think I see the confusion. The post I was responding to made it sound like you were talking about informing agents every time and not only in the situations in which they said "no simultaneous submission."

CaroGirl · Jan 8, 2010

DeadlyAccurate said:
Not accepting simultaneous submissions is the same as asking for an exclusive.

I think I see the confusion. The post I was responding to made it sound like you were talking about informing agents every time and not only in the situations in which they said "no simultaneous submission."

Sorry, no. I meant in the event they had a no sim sub policy or asked personally for an exclusive. Thanks for allowing me to clarify!

Phaeal · Jan 8, 2010

In my experience, no agents or publishers want multiple submissions. Exceptions are poems and short shorts or flash fic. Some publications (journals, mags) will look at multiple poems or short shorts.

Agents generally are good with simultaneous subs at the query level. Publishers generally are not good with simultaneous subs.

Unless an agent asks for an exclusive, I don't think you have to worry about what other queries, partials or fulls you have out. I do think that once you get an offer, it's essential to inform other holders of partials or fulls, so they can either chime in or not waste time reading your material. Once you accept an offer, I think it would be polite to let query holders know, although I've heard some arguments against it. Basically that an agent might waste less time reviewing your query than in trying to figure out if he's already tacitly rejected it (for the nonrepliers) or not even hit it yet.

Meh, it's easy to overthink this stuff.

Aggy B. · Jan 8, 2010

CaroGirl said:
Keep in mind that queries are not submissions. You can query as many agents/publishers as you like. It's when they start requesting fulls and partials that these become submissions. If agent A asks for a full of your ms and you send it, and then agent B asks for a full of the same ms, if you send it to agent B, you've made a simultaneous submission. Courtesy states that you inform agent A about the request and not send the full ms without their knowledge or permission, and vice versa. Agents have a right to know if other agents are also considering your work.

Some publishers (like DAW and Tor-Forge) say they prefer either a partial or full MS (depending on the publisher) and synopsis, etc. It seemed when I was looking at SF/F publishers that seemed to be becoming more of the standard. (No query, just a submission package.)

Not sure if that's a good thing or not, but there it is.

Can someone please clarify for me . . .

PGK

They put those words in my head!

geardrops

Good thing I like my day job

Adam

Not dead.

katiemac

Five by Five

PGK

They put those words in my head!

Andrhia

EclipsesMuse

Questing

CaroGirl

Living the dream

Andrhia

CaroGirl

Living the dream

DeadlyAccurate

Absolutely Fazed

CaroGirl

Living the dream

DeadlyAccurate

Absolutely Fazed

CaroGirl

Living the dream

Phaeal

Whatever I did, I didn't do it.

Aggy B.

Not as sweet as you think