The "I love you" moment

Maidenfine · Jan 2, 2010

My writers group includes a lot of romance writers. And they've talked about the fact that in a romance, the two main characters should not say "I love you" until the last possible moment that you can manage it. Because that's generally the end of the story/book. My question is, if I'm writing fantasy, does that rule apply? Or can two characters profess their love to each other sooner than that, since the romance is basically a side plot?

kaitie · Jan 2, 2010

My first thought is why not, but I think it depends on how important it is and what not. I know personally that I always enjoy the tension leading up to it, especially if I really want the characters together. I love reading and thinking, "Oh man is he finally going to say it!" and things like that. I'm also always intrigued by characters who love one another but who won't say it for whatever reason, but I'm probably kinda weird like that. I'd guess it depends on how much time you want to spend building the relationship and what purpose it serves in the story.

Chasing the Horizon · Jan 2, 2010

I have two fantasy novels with strong romance sub-plots. One has the 'I love you' moment in chapter 5 (of 18 total chapters) and the other in chapter 10 (of 16 total chapters). I'm not big on angst or characters who deny their feelings until you want to hit them over the head just so the author can create cheap conflict.

I have plenty of conflict without the characters angsting over their feelings. It's all well and good that they love each other, but that's all going to be for naught if the villains succeed in killing one or both of them.

I think your writing group is taking a limited view of romance too. I've read quite a few romance novels where the characters admit their love somewhere before or around the halfway point, and then spend the rest of the book trying to overcome villains and obstacles which are keeping them apart or threatening to kill them. This is my preferred formula for romance, actually. Less angst, more externalized fighting.

RainbowDragon · Jan 2, 2010

In romance it's the end of the book when the main characters come together. In fantasy, there can be more to the story.

I think it's fine to have such a moment earlier on in other genres.

Chasing the Horizon · Jan 2, 2010

RainbowDragon said:
In romance it's the end of the book when the main characters come together.

But they can still admit their love earlier in the book, if the thing keeping them apart is an external force.

Libbie · Jan 2, 2010

Right -- the end of the book is when the characters are happy with their relationship (in romance.)

In fantasy, there are different expectations from readers. It's fine to have your characters admit their love much earlier, and even end up in a happy relationship much earlier. The main focus of the book will probably not be the romantic tension in the relationship, but some other conflict. The romance will be a subplot.

Maidenfine · Jan 3, 2010

Thank you guys. I'm working on revisions and I actually hadn't remembered that my characters ever said it at all. But there it was, a little over halfway through and it just made me wonder if that was an okay place for it. I might move it anyway, but at least now I won't be moving it just to fit some sort of "rule" about where it should be. Since that rule doesn't apply here (and apparently doesn't apply at all).

evol_reed · Jan 3, 2010

In my fantasy novel, which has strong romance elements, the characters declare themselves in the middle of part two of a four part book. Due to plot developments the angst and yearning is kept up throughout most of the tale, even after the "I love you" moment.

MGraybosch · Jan 3, 2010

Maidenfine said:
Or can two characters profess their love to each other sooner than that, since the romance is basically a side plot?

My characters professed their love in the first third of the book.

MGraybosch · Jan 3, 2010

Chasing the Horizon said:
But they can still admit their love earlier in the book, if the thing keeping them apart is an external force.

I don't think it's necessary to keep them apart. Perhaps the protagonist continues his struggle precisely because he loves somebody.

Lady Ice · Jan 3, 2010

Maidenfine said:
My writers group includes a lot of romance writers. And they've talked about the fact that in a romance, the two main characters should not say "I love you" until the last possible moment that you can manage it. Because that's generally the end of the story/book. My question is, if I'm writing fantasy, does that rule apply? Or can two characters profess their love to each other sooner than that, since the romance is basically a side plot?

If the romance is a side-plot, you can make it last as long as you want that thread to last. It can often be good relief from the main action- either a comic romance or just a sweet 'aww' romance. If it is the burning passion of the century, you need to drag it out a bit longer as the stakes are higher; although saying that, burning passions would normally need to be linked to the main plot to work.

Sotalia · Jan 3, 2010

Maidenfine said:
My writers group includes a lot of romance writers. And they've talked about the fact that in a romance, the two main characters should not say "I love you" until the last possible moment that you can manage it. Because that's generally the end of the story/book. My question is, if I'm writing fantasy, does that rule apply? Or can two characters profess their love to each other sooner than that, since the romance is basically a side plot?

=D

Knowing what I do about your storyline, my opinion is that you're fine on the placement of the "I love you" moment. The moment is one catalyst to the climax, not the climax itself, nor the resolution. So, personally, I find its placement to be appropriate.

Ervin · Jan 5, 2010

kaitie said:
My first thought is why not, but I think it depends on how important it is and what not. I know personally that I always enjoy the tension leading up to it, especially if I really want the characters together. I love reading and thinking, "Oh man is he finally going to say it!" and things like that. I'm also always intrigued by characters who love one another but who won't say it for whatever reason, but I'm probably kinda weird like that. I'd guess it depends on how much time you want to spend building the relationship and what purpose it serves in the story.

Totally agree here.

I've heard plenty of hate on these forums on the concept of two characters denying their feelings, but I personally like that alot, and let's face it, so does most of the non writing population[citation needed]

In a non romance book you just have to decide how long you want to make it. If you like the drama and tension it creates, push it to the last word for all anyone should care.

Sai · Jan 5, 2010

This thread reminds me of a book by Loyd Alexander 'The Remarkable Journey of Prince Jen.' Every chapter would end with little author's notes (for example, after the good guys achieve some minor victory, the chapter might end with 'If you want to end this book with happy ending, stop reading here'). After the chapter where Jen and his love interest finally admit to themselves and everyone else how they feel, the note at the end of the chapter says something like 'If you were looking for romance story, stop here while the lovers are still together and content. But if you want a fantasy story...' I'm paraphrasing, but basically the book still had a lot of plot to go even after the two leads got together.

LOG · Jan 5, 2010

Romance does not necessarily have to be about the discovery of romance. It could be a story about two people who start off already loving one another, and then their relationship due to X variable. Then go from there.
In fantasy, whether the romance is a second-hand thought, or integral to the main plot, you can do it however you feel is best. Resolve the romance halfway through if that's what you want to do. Following a formula is hardly an inspiring writing process...

Lady Ice · Jan 6, 2010

If you're going for an unorthodox plot, I- shock horror- would write the romance as fairly formulaic, if it's a side plot. You don't want to draw too much attention away from the main plot but the reader needs some sort of relief and something 'cosy' might suffice.

hammerklavier · Jan 6, 2010

How about if one says "I love you" before he means it, then back peddles, driving her away, then decides that he truly does love her and must try and win her back?

The best thing is to be realistic (or better yet, believable) and not to follow some "rule" because some other writer said it was a good idea.

Rhoda Nightingale · Jan 8, 2010

I agree that it depends on how important the romance is to the story, in terms of how early you throw in the L word, but I'd like to add that it's hinged on your characters and how they develop also. Are they the kind of people who place a lot of stock in those three little words? Do they need to say it at all? Did one of them have a former relationship that was somehow wrecked by one of the people saying "I love you" too early, or too late?

When it doubt, talk to your characters. That's what I usually do.

Roly · Jan 8, 2010

For some reason I hate for my characters to actually say the phrase "I love you." It just doesn't sit well with me. My work is primarily fantasy-ish and plot driven, so I feel like I'm stopping the flow of the story just to get that phrase out there so it can start up again. But that's just me...

Maidenfine · Jan 8, 2010

It wasn't so much that it feels out of place. I wrote the novel during NaNoWriMo, so I was very much in tune with my characters. They said it when they would say it. But after a luncheon with my writers group where they'd been talking about "rules" of romance plots, I wondered if it applied in other genres. I may move it just because that scene leads right up to my midpoint, so I need to be sure it's placed right. But if it gets moved, I actually think it'll happen sooner (or at least, more stuff will happen after it).

Thank you everyone for chiming in. It feels like a silly thing to have even worried about now.

thethinker42 · Jan 8, 2010

Maidenfine said:
My writers group includes a lot of romance writers. And they've talked about the fact that in a romance, the two main characters should not say "I love you" until the last possible moment that you can manage it. Because that's generally the end of the story/book.

I guess in that sense, it depends on the conflict. In most of my romances, "I love you" comes into play near the middle or a little after...but the conflict usually revolves around some other reason for them not to be together, so adding "I love you" to the mix actually complicates things rather than resolving them. I can also think of at least three of my romances in which they never actually say it, but it's known...the characters just can't quite articulate it (makes sense in context).

Just depends on what the story requires. If "I love you" resolves the story, then you don't have to deliberately time it for the end of the book...the story should naturally end. If there's more story after "I love you" is said...then, there's more story.

AlterEgox5 · Jan 8, 2010

I agree with many. I believe with fantasy it's a bit more flexible since the romance, while it may be strong, isn't the main focus. Ironically, my current WIP falls into this category. My male MC doesn't say it until a ways into the book, but events don't really allow for a loving moment so female lead just glosses over it. It isn't until several chapters later that they actually both say it to each other in a much more passionate moment.

And then, of course, they say it again during the resolution and have a great smooching time.

MGraybosch · Jan 9, 2010

AlterEgox5 said:
And then, of course, they say it again during the resolution and have a great smooching time.

Or make a battle cry of it, the way I have my heroine do when she charges the entity that has taken over the main character's body.

Meech · Jan 11, 2010

I agree with Chasing the Horizon who said:

I'm not big on angst or characters who deny their feelings until you want to hit them over the head just so the author can create cheap conflict.

I agree but I would say I just feel good old fashioned HATE when characters deny their feelings until the last moment. I don’t like it! I always end up feeling like “Well WHY should they be together at ALL then…if it’s SO HARD to know that they care about each other?” I’d prefer it be more realistic. Saying they feel for each other but love is so strong. Or just decided they haven’t known them long enough to know. Not deny anything. I hate all that I’ll never fall in love stuff. It’s so common and I’m sick of it. I’ve THROUGHLY enjoyed books where they end up together in the 5th chapter and the book carries itself with plot.

Not saying I haven't read good books that DO that. In my opinion I enjoy a book more when that isn't what is holding everyone back. Not every character has to be against marriage. Or not every character feels like marriage is a trap. I'd like to read a book where the character is unsure and has low self esteem. A woman who jumps at any man who shows her the least bit of attention.....and............*writes this all down* I'M TOTALLY GOING TO WRITE A BOOK WITH a character like that! *hurries off*

p.s. I'm also sick of MISUNDERSTANDINGS!!!!!!!!!!!!

Kaiser-Kun · Jan 11, 2010

My characters don't profess their love. They rather show it with small, subtle details. I was surprised when Bettielee told me she could feel romantic tension between two of them, and I haven't even started writing about it.

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