Unsympathetic mc's

Maxinquaye · Dec 24, 2009

I'm struggling to think of novels where the MC is presented as an unsympathetic "fucktard" when he's introduced.

One of the challenges I've set myself for my new WIP is to write about Edward. Here's the first impression:

Edward Jones sat perfectly still in the bench opposite to the social services woman - who wrote something in a dossier. Her name was Agnes, he knew. Her last name … he didn’t really care to know, though he should know it since she had been responsible for him for the last six months.

She probably recorded some observed trivia about her charge's uncooperative silence on this entire journey, or she scribbled down some annoyed remark that she would not have new data to feed into her little computer models of how lost little delinquent crooks should behave and feel. It would be colourful diagrams from some fashionable psychological model that circulated between social workers.

He kept his eyes focused on a little screw about one meter to the right of Agnes; in the glued joint between two of the fake panels on the cabin wall; did not look out the window at the countryside that thundered past - to the thunk-kathunk-beat of train wheels against railway joint. He did not look out through the door into the passageway where passengers’ moved in waves to get to or away from the shop wagon.

A wasp walked around the screw, and Agnes didn't notice it. The insect took a few steps toward her, then returned to the screw, then moved back toward her. It dithered like that for several minutes. Edward kept his focus on it throughout that time.

For fucks sake, Edward thought, sting the bitch then won’t you?

It goes downhill from there. Please ignore the problems - it's just a first draft.

I'm trying to create a bad impression, but on the other hand I don't want to reader to think "Pfft, have a nice life punk" and put down the book. What I want to do - the challenge - is to keep the reader interested, and at the same time have the reader want to grab the wretched punk by the collar and give him a "stern talking to".

Anyone have any ideas for books where this is done?

Missus Akasha · Dec 24, 2009

Well, I really don't see a fucktard displayed in the little snippet you have, but at least for me, getting inside of his head made me laugh a bit, especially towards the end.

I like characters who are a bit of an ass.

Where exactly are you trying to go with the story?

Maxinquaye · Dec 24, 2009

Well, I'm trying to set up Edward to be disliked, maybe even intensely, but not so much that he's outright offensive to the reader. It's a balance.

Just wondered if that had been done in other books.

Missus Akasha · Dec 24, 2009

Oh, there are lots of books out there.

Many of the books on the shelves today have unsympathetic main characters, but from what I've seen, the majority of them are geared towards females -- like Gossip Girl for instance.

I haven't read too many books with an unsympathetic male main character though, but the idea sounds refreshing. :3

Maxinquaye · Dec 24, 2009

Oh noes. I'm writing to a trend.

I'll make him... a saint instead

Missus Akasha · Dec 24, 2009

Lol,

what about a saint by day and a fucktard by night? Personality switch!

Red-Green · Dec 24, 2009

I would say the MC in the book that got me an agent is definitely unsympathetic. Unrepentant multiple murderer on death row, and plenty of people have loved the character. He's rude, crude, uneducated, violent, and really darkly funny.

Point is, your MC doesn't have to be likable. He just has to be compelling.

JamieFord · Dec 24, 2009

Take a look at A Feast of Snakes by Harry Crews.

All of the characters are despicable. The prose is vivid, the characters ghastly, it's like a long, slow train-wreck, and you can't help but peek between your fingers at all the carnage.

Kalyke · Dec 24, 2009

Unfortunately, I see a kid (assumed) under the control of a state worker to be somewhat sympathetic. I can understand his not liking her or remembering her last name. I think that the "sympathy" rule does not really mean the characters need to be nice, they have to be understandable. Wasn't "The Talented Mr. Riply," and the MC in "Crime and Punishment," fairly bad eggs?

Toothpaste · Dec 24, 2009

Watch House.

Lyv · Dec 24, 2009

The first unsympathetic main character I think of is Cass Neary from Elizabeth Hand's Generation Loss. The author describes her as "your prototypical amoral speedfreak crankhead kleptomaniac murderous rage-filled alcoholic bisexual heavily-tattooed American female photographer." She's not wholly unsympathetic, but she's pretty unlikable throughout. And I loved the book. I recommend it to anyone grappling with an unsympathetic main character.

Good luck!

katiemac · Dec 24, 2009

the MC in "Crime and Punishment," fairly bad eggs?

I wouldn't call Raskolnikov a bad egg, exactly. He wrestles with moral dilemmas constantly and commits the murder because he thinks it will help a lot of people, himself included. Murder doesn't seem like the mark of a good egg, but there is a lot more sympathy happening with Raskolnikov than unlikeable characters.

virtue_summer · Dec 24, 2009

I actually felt the kid in the quoted passage was sympathetic. I assumed his anger was the result of some negative experiences in life, plus the fact that having to be in the system is often a negative experience for a kid in and of itself. I wouldn't expect a kid in a situation like that to behave or to feel like a saint.

Canotila · Dec 24, 2009

Personally I am inclined to feel sympathetic for folks dealing with social services on any level, especially minors. That tells me he probably doesn't have an ideal home life at any rate.

Empress by Karen Miller has a pretty unsympathetic MC. I mean, she starts out a little sympathetic due to her circumstances...sorta. There are some major red flags that the character is just not right in the head. As the book progresses you just see what a crazy beyotch she is, and you end up wanting someone to pop her head like a melon by the end.

Maxinquaye · Dec 24, 2009

Death and murder aren't really unsympathetic traits, or Dexter wouldn't work. No, an MC can kill pretty much indiscriminately. Where you get into trouble is with intangibles: if the MC betrays another character that the reader likes, you get a big minus on the "sympathy" account. If the MC likes to inflict pain for power-trips, then it's another minus. It's all a balance, if you want to keep realistic.

Just wondered if there was any truly unsympathetic MC-books, and not just "lovable rogue"-books. Thanks for the suggestions. I'll check them out.

Red-Green · Dec 24, 2009

I always cite Lolita. Humbert is a truly despicable character, but he's compelling.

Melville · Dec 24, 2009

In my experience, genre fiction leads (particularly M/T/S) tend to be likeable, or at least worth sympathizing with, if they need to carry a series...

... but unlikeable mc's are plentiful in great literature.

Think of Ignatius Reilly in A CONFEDERACY OF DUNCES or Sebastian Dangerfield in THE GINGER MAN... yikes!

Linda Adams · Dec 24, 2009

How about Stephen Donaldson's Thomas Convenant series? The main character is very bitter.

Maxinquaye · Dec 24, 2009

Linda Adams said:
How about Stephen Donaldson's Thomas Convenant series? The main character is very bitter.

Very good suggestion. But when I read those books I wanted to throttle the MC after a few chapters. I just read him as whiny. I never finished the series. But I'll re-read them.

Albannach · Dec 24, 2009

Linda Adams said:
How about Stephen Donaldson's Thomas Convenant series? The main character is very bitter.

Bitter? He's a blanking rapist. He lost all my sympathy and my readership.

Edit: And, yes, a WHINY rapist.

Kitty Pryde · Dec 24, 2009

A couple things could make this kind of unlikable guy sympathetic: his tragic upbringing (and given that he's a kid and a warden of the state, I assume it's at least mildly tragic), and something that he can care about. The more you hint at either one of these, the more he will be sympathetic, though remaining basically 'bad'. Also having some type of ethical system, however warped, is good.

He's putting me a little bit in mind of Locke, from The Lies of Locke Lamora. He's a crazed sociopathic criminal orphan, and pretty much of a douche, but his backstory is darker than dark and his loyalties are extremely strong. He works as a sympathetic antihero--nastier than a lovable rogue (and mostly unlovable).

kaitie · Dec 24, 2009

Toothpaste said:
Watch House.

Yup, House and Gene Hunt were my first two thoughts. They also have really different strategies, though, for keeping the viewer interested, I think.

I think the trick is showing enough depth to the character that you know either that there's reason behind it or that it's a front (or even just that there is a capability for good in there somewhere).

I've read quite a few unsympathetic main characters. I know I mention this one a lot, but have you read the Bartimaeus trilogy? The main character is a boy who basically becomes progressively more of a dick throughout the story. I know that personally I didn't particularly like him at all. The thing was, I wanted him to be redeemed. I wanted him to see the error of his ways, I knew he was capable of it. That was enough to keep me reading even when he was being completely despicable.

From your first paragraphs, I would have assumed that this was a troubled, probably a bit insecure boy. That actually worked in your favor because even if something goes wrong there and he acts like an ass, I had the impression that there was more to the story. I just think it's important to keep that depth there. Maybe occasionally have him do something to make the reader wonder if there's more to the boy than just being an anti-social prick.

theantisplice · Dec 24, 2009

OP: I found Edward sympathetic in that excerpt. Yeah, he sounds hardened and mean, but for the amount of time he's lived in state care I think he's allowed a good dose of bitterness. I lived in foster care as a teen, and during and after that time I thought thing of that nature, as well as far worse. So far, I pity your character for the things that are causing these thoughts.

Maxinquaye · Dec 24, 2009

Thanks all for your suggestions.

To derail my topic, there is a fascinating tendency going on here though. You're all archetyping Edward into your own experiences. There's a lesson in there for all writers.

The brief snippet all give you even a backstory of Edward, that you're filling in without my help. Here's the great lessen about characterisation and the reader, I think. Even with very few details, you're building Edward yourself without my intervention. I find that terribly fascinating.

colealpaugh · Dec 25, 2009

JamieFord said:
Take a look at A Feast of Snakes by Harry Crews.

All of the characters are despicable. The prose is vivid, the characters ghastly, it's like a long, slow train-wreck, and you can't help but peek between your fingers at all the carnage.

That's a wonderfully evil book, Jamie. I recall a very dark-humored English teacher giving me a copy.

Gotta love one of the two-star Amazon reviews: "I was really looking forward to reading this book in hopes that it would bring back warm memories of the South that I know and love. Not what I got."

I felt the same way when I picked up the Exorcist to read to my kids at bedtime.

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