Card Games

Faide · Dec 1, 2009

Okay, I like card games. I play cards a lot, and thought of adding some card games to my stories.

But the question is, and I'm not quite sure how to phrase it, but I'll try - do you think it's all right to use the good ol' card games that already exist, instead of inventing the gunpowder/wheel/however the saying goes in English all over again?

Maybe not poker, but (and I'm just translating the Norwegian names, as I'm not sure what they're called in English) Idiot, Turn the Eight and American? Perhaps giving them new names? Because I'm not sure if I could invent a completely new card game.

Yeah. What do you think?

MattW · Dec 1, 2009

Faide said:
Maybe not poker, but (and I'm just translating the Norwegian names, as I'm not sure what they're called in English) Idiot, Turn the Eight and American? Perhaps giving them new names? Because I'm not sure if I could invent a completely new card game.

Unless the game is critical to a plot outcome, don't invent much at all, only what you need for flavor.

And, of the name you listed, the first one sounds perfect, and the second is generic enough. The last is probably too specific, but you could use it to be derogatory to another nation/region/group in your story.

Sarpedon · Dec 1, 2009

anyone for a quick game of "Cripple Mr Onion?"

dclary · Dec 1, 2009

Sarpedon said:
anyone for a quick game of "Cripple Mr Onion?"

"Tourniquets null pins!"

Faide · Dec 1, 2009

MattW said:
Unless the game is critical to a plot outcome, don't invent much at all, only what you need for flavor.

Ah, thanks. Several of my characters play cards, so I thought it'd be neat if they had a game or two to play.

Sarpedon said:
anyone for a quick game of "Cripple Mr Onion?"

Me, pick me

Thanks, guys :>

Etola · Dec 1, 2009

I agree with MaxMordon--don't put in more than you need for flavor. Having a completely new game would make the world more immersive, I think, but having a bunch of people sitting around playing, for example, "Turn the Sevens" or "Haber's Gambit" is much more a good example of local color if you only mention the name, and maybe maybe refer to a rule in passing, and leave it at that. If I start getting told the rules in detail, my eyes would water.

So, for example, I would like to read:

"Garnish the Barbarian leaned over to watch the game of Scratch the Eagle being played on the table by a group of Northerners. One of the men was already in spoon, and had anted up his axe; it would be a tight match. He left them to their game, and went to flirt with the cute tavern wench."

As opposed to:

"Garnish the Barbarian leaned over to watch the game of Scratch the Eagle being played on the table by a group of Northerners. One of them was close to winning; by the rules of the game, all he needed was a matching set of one red, one green and one puce card, and he would get double points if at least one of them was the 15 of Foxes. But he wouldn't be able to lay them out anyway until the Freeze Phase."

Of course, if your story gets published and has a large enough fanbase, you can post the rules of Scratch the Eagle all you want on your website, or in a compendium. I just don't necessarily want to be reading a play-by-play in a novel.

Liosse de Velishaf · Dec 1, 2009

I invented a chess-like game for a story (it's actually part of the title), and a mahjong-like game for another. I'm not so clever about cards, though. I'd say the surface flavor adivce already given is pretty much on the money. Unless, you know, you were a World Poker Championship announcer for eighteen years and plan to sell your book through casinos... :roll:

auntybug · Dec 1, 2009

I always remembered an episode of M*A*S*H where they played a combination of chess, checkers & cards so I put something like that in one of my daughters books. I didn't have to write rules for it so it was a fun addition. (Of course my daughter has been trying to invent a game ever since

)

Richard White · Dec 1, 2009

Then again, Ian Fleming wrote an entire chapter in Moonraker about a Bridge game just to show how rotten the villain was. (He was cheating at cards at the club, he must be a bounder).

But, that was also written in the early 60s. Probably not so much in vogue today.

Khimera9 · Dec 1, 2009

Unless this is the way you want two people to conflict each other, don't bother. Otherwise, go for it man!

MattW · Dec 1, 2009

Etola said:
I agree with MaxMordon--don't put in more than you need for flavor.

No respect!

Tanydwr · Dec 1, 2009

A new name is probably less jarring.

For example, Tamora Pierce uses a game called 'Gambler's Chance' in her novel Bloodhound. From the description, this is similar to poker, but that name would never work in her world. The name is invocative of the nature of the game - gambling - and her world. Of course, it helps that the game's invented by one of the characters in the novel.

I also invented 'King's Men', which is basically a form of chess, for one of my own worlds. I've also created a set of cards based on tarot cards (which were originally used for card games anyway), although I don't know if I named any of the actual games.

If you do invent card games, there are two 'world-building' aspects to consider:

1. the suits of the cards and their meanings
2. whether there are any 'magical' references to cards via cartomancy

Other than that, have fun. A flavour's all you need in the novel but, if you're anything like me, suits can be described and analysed in your background notes.

As for rules... well, I struggle with rummy, so poker's right out.

maxmordon · Dec 1, 2009

MattW said:
No respect!

I am as baffled as you, MattW.

Fenika · Dec 1, 2009

Everyone agrees with Max

And I started skimming (sorry, forgive me if I'm repeating), but check the origin of any games you are stealing as some are fairly modern. If you're basing off a culture, more or less, see what they did ofc

BigWords · Dec 1, 2009

Out of curiousity, has anyone encountered Pazaak in Star Wars novels? I know it plays a part in the KotOR games, but is it in other media as well?

JimmyB27 · Dec 2, 2009

BigWords said:
Out of curiousity, has anyone encountered Pazaak in Star Wars novels? I know it plays a part in the KotOR games, but is it in other media as well?

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Pazaak

"Pazaak is a minigame created for the Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic video game, and was also included in its sequel, Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords.

There are two unofficial standalone Pazaak computer games, Pazaak Cantina and PurePazaak. "

Port Iris · Dec 2, 2009

auntybug said:
I always remembered an episode of M*A*S*H where they played a combination of chess, checkers & cards

Double Cranko!

As far as the game goes, I've read many stories with card or dice games that I'm sure are just real games thinly veiled behind a new name and rule variations. As long as the characters respond to events within the game as though they know how to play, little to no explanation of the rules is necessary, unless the game's outcome is important to the plot.

Vomaxx · Dec 2, 2009

My mercenaries play a dice game called "Double Six" and a card game called "Lucky Fifteen". I had to come up with the rules to both, and describe them to characters learning the games. Gambling is an important military pastime.

Smiling Ted · Dec 2, 2009

The important thing about any games you invent is the flavor they bring to your stories.
Each game carries connotations independent of its rules.
Chess represents strategy, tactics, intellectualism, competition.
Poker represents bluffing, emotional control, knowledge of odds.
Go Fish is a children's game.
Bridge is a game for fanatics, whose overtones I don't understand.
And so on.
Know what a particular game represents to your characters, and what you want it to say to your readers, is the most important thing.

Etola · Dec 2, 2009

MattW said:
No respect!

Oops! Sorry... I honestly don't know how that happened either. :Huh:

dirtsider · Dec 2, 2009

Here's some information on Whist - a card game that I remember hearing in Elizabeth Gaskell's books. (Or Jane Austin's, I can't remember.) But I think most people wouldn't probably recognize the game, although it seems to be the forebear of Bridge.

http://www.answers.com/topic/whist

AnnieColleen · Dec 2, 2009

I haven't tried cards, but I have a dice/marbles/ish game that's fairly prominent in one of my WIPs -- marbles, in that everyone brings their own set, winner keeps the loser's dice, and collecting them (by winning, buying, or making) is a big thing. I've tried for a chess-analogue too, but less successfully, I think.

I think it would depend on your world, whether you'd want to keep the name/rules or invent a new one. How close is your world to the society where the card games came from? All else failing, you can always mix/match rules -- there are only so many ways to manipulate cards, after all.

One example that may not help you is Dragon Poker in the MYTH series -- all kinds of rules are mentioned, a few at a time, different each time, but only because the game's supposed to be crazy complex and difficult to play. And, of course, the protagonist gets maneuvered into a high-profile game without having a clue about the rules. But that's also pretty tongue-in-cheeck.

auntybug · Dec 2, 2009

dirtsider said:
Here's some information on Whist - a card game that I remember hearing in Elizabeth Gaskell's books. (Or Jane Austin's, I can't remember.) But I think most people wouldn't probably recognize the game, although it seems to be the forebear of Bridge.

http://www.answers.com/topic/whist

I love whist! I just learned Buck Yuker - it's similar but less cards

dclary · Dec 2, 2009

My characters are all-star Calvinball players.

jhmcmullen · Dec 3, 2009

I once wrote a (non-SF) story which mentioned Three-Handed Euchre, and got a comment from a reader that said, essentially, "I don't know how to play it but it sounds dreadful!"

Which was exactly the situation the narrator was in, so it was all right. (But I've never played Buck Euchre. Have to remember it for the next time my cousin's in town.)

Card Games

Like Dirty Gentlemen

Company Man

Unabashed Mercenary

Like Dirty Gentlemen

Still looking for stars...

teh other evil broad

Stealthy Plot Bunny Peddler

Company Man

Penúltimo

Geekzilla

Hoopy frood

Ah-HA!

Still looking for stars...

Not so new, really

Invisible Writer

teh other evil broad

Unabashed Mercenary