Why do the old stories contain so much tragedy?

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By old stories I mean tales from places such as ancient Greece, medieval Europe, Africa, and Feudal Japan.

Look at the older myths in most cultures, and they seem to be quite heavily comprised of tragic stories, usually involving lovers in some form.
Feudal Japan has quite a few, as does Greece.
The original Brother Grimm tales are also quite morbid.

Do you think there's a reason so many cultures have such folk tales?
 

Omega423

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its because tragedy sells. i mean, would you read a story that talks about someone walking through their mundane life working in a cubical and pushing papers? To quote Maynard James Keenan, "we all feed on tragedy it's like blood to a vampire."
 

ChaosTitan

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Think about the time periods you mentioned--long before modern medicine, modern technology, sometimes even modern weaponry. Life was hard. And short. Children died young. Women died often in childbirth.

Tragedy was part of their daily lives.
 

mscelina

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Because civilzations up to the Industrial Revolution had different standards of life. They glorified heroism in battle--which always led to tragedy. They learned to develop stories that would help to explain things they didn't understand--like volcanic explosions or the changing of the seasons. Life expectancies were much lower. Disease ran rampant. Medicine was primitive and usually based more on superstition than science. In the Judeo-Christian beliefs, suffering was necessary to gain Heaven and the blessing of God.

You've heard about 'write what you know?' well, that's what they did. They wrote about what they knew--and that was, nine times of ten, tragic.
 

CACTUSWENDY

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I think that any era has the thirst for this type of stuff. Even now days look what sells. The horror, the shoot em up bang bang, the slash/gore, anything with conflict that gets out of control. We seek this stuff out like a kid does candy. lol Books, TV and Movies all fill that lust in us. The really sad part is that real life is also feeding us the same brutal stuff. I guess one day we might all get desensitized and nothing will be left to fill the void. IMHO
 

BigWords

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I guess one day we might all get desensitized and nothing will be left to fill the void. IMHO

Not sure if it's true or not, but there was a story years ago about New York newspapers - before the city got cleaned up - having so many homicide reports coming in that they gave up printing who had been shot, etc.
 

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Ah, but tragedy does not equal horror, gore or violence. Originally a comedy, for instance (like the Greek comedies) was not a funny story, simply a story which ended happily, while a tragedy ended sadly, as in the lovers did not get each other in the end (or like Romeo and Juliet they died).

I think it's because a tragedy, a story with an "unhappy" ending, speaks to something deeper in us. It rings more true than a story where they live happily ever after. We know that's simply not the case, most of the time. Life is not a series of happy endings.

And the stories, at least the Greek ones, were often about something else than what they appeared to be on the surface - comments on society, etc.

The folk tales, as in the Brother Grimm tales, are also often tales about archetypes which help us deal with difficulties in our own lives. Bruno Bettelheim has written some very good books on this. He has these theories which I can't shortly explain here (or even remember very well...) about how a child can deal with it's negative emotions towards it's mother through stories with wicked step-mothers, like Snow White etc. They were not just stories for entertainment. They were old tales that had been passed on orally for generations, containing old, deep truths. They were projections of desires and wishes and reflections of reality. They were not meant for children, not before The Brothers Grimm wrote them down, anyway. Their stories were indeed aimed at children.

Oh I am rambling again... I can never explain things properly.
 

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Think about the time periods you mentioned--long before modern medicine, modern technology, sometimes even modern weaponry. Life was hard. And short. Children died young. Women died often in childbirth.

Tragedy was part of their daily lives.

Modern weaponry cuts short so many promising tragedies.
 

Straka

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Think about the time periods you mentioned--long before modern medicine, modern technology, sometimes even modern weaponry. Life was hard. And short. Children died young. Women died often in childbirth.

Tragedy was part of their daily lives.

Think that's the kicker right there. A lot of hardship. I was reading about "Stonewall" Jackson's life. He watched his sister die of typhoid fever when he was 2 years old. His dad died when he was young, his mom got remarried to a man who didn't like the step children. She died then and Jackson was ran away to his uncle... Jackson's older brother died of tuberculosis when he was 20...and so forth and so on.

And that was just 150 years ago.

In this day and age I know people in their late twenties who haven't lost a grandparent yet.
 

dclary

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The heart of any good story is conflict. No one writes happy stories because no one wants to read happy stories (unless you're in the picture book/early reader genre).

Tragedy is an easy fount for conflict.
 

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By old stories I mean tales from places such as ancient Greece, medieval Europe, Africa, and Feudal Japan.

Look at the older myths in most cultures, and they seem to be quite heavily comprised of tragic stories, usually involving lovers in some form.
Feudal Japan has quite a few, as does Greece.
The original Brother Grimm tales are also quite morbid.

Do you think there's a reason so many cultures have such folk tales?

When I studied mythology many, many moons ago, this question came up. What the professor said was something along the line of "People remember stories better than lectures."

The discussion that followed explained that myths explained the world and its consequences. It taught people, through dramatization, how their society worked, what was expected of them, and gave "reasonable" explanations to things people didn't otherwise comprehend.

I mean, look at a lot of the "fairy tales". Back in those days, fairies were evil things working for the devil. Only the good child, the people who obeyed came out ahead. If you didn't live by the standards, horrible, unspeakable things happened to you. Morality lessons.

In ancient Greece and Egypt, hubris was the most terrible sin a person could commit. They believed that every man had a role to play in the world, and woe be to the ones who tried to move out of that role. To the ancient Greeks, the heroic legends were cautionary tales not to step out of your place in life because if the gods took note of you, then BAD things happened for you and yours.

There's a purpose to the tragedy, I think. It's like finding an urban legend nowadays that has a happy ending. Doesn't serve the purpose of what the story.
 

Moonfish

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No one writes happy stories because no one wants to read happy stories (unless you're in the picture book/early reader genre).

I like reading happy stories, if by that you mean stories with a happy ending. I hate stories where I have invested myself in the MC and then everything goes to hell on the last pages.
I also write the same type of stories.
 

Vincent

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Hey, them Greeks had comedies too.
 

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In this day and age I know people in their late twenties who haven't lost a grandparent yet.

Brief derail... my step-mom, who will be [I think] 54 this year, hasn't lost her grandmother yet, either. She's ninety something. Didn't get arthritis until her 80s, although her hearing has been shot for decades. The doctor keeps telling her to slow down and she's like "he's trying to make me an old woman."
 

dclary

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I like reading happy stories, if by that you mean stories with a happy ending. I hate stories where I have invested myself in the MC and then everything goes to hell on the last pages.
I also write the same type of stories.

No, I love happy ending stories too. What I mean, are stories where nothing bad happens.

Clifford The Big Red Dog is an example.
 

Mr Flibble

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Bad things happen in Clifford the Big Red Dog too!

That Cleo always gets them into trouble

As for the OP:
The discussion that followed explained that myths explained the world and its consequences. It taught people, through dramatization, how their society worked, what was expected of them, and gave "reasonable" explanations to things people didn't otherwise comprehend.

This. Which also ( IMO ofc) explains a lot of religious teachings / texts too.

Besides. peace sells, but who's buying?
 

DavidZahir

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For one thing, tragedies have among the post powerful impacts and are retained by the audience that much longer.

For another, many such tales are intended as "warnings" or "lessons".

For still another, many myths and legends can be seen as attempts to understand the inherent tragedies in life (such as death, pain, the random nature of so much strife, our own foolishness, etc.)
 

sunandshadow

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My theory is, real life is all suspense and no resolution, which is very unsatisfying for a mind which is trying to understand causality so it can file parts of the world away as "understood and no longer need to be worried about". So there are two ways of resolving any kind of tension - constructively or destructively. That guy who always annoys you might fall in love and stop being annoying to please his beloved, or he might annoy the wrong guy and get himself killed. Both are satisfying in totally different ways. The constructive resolution is more cheerful, while the destructive one is more dramatic and often more deeply final.
 

johnnysannie

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In this day and age I know people in their late twenties who haven't lost a grandparent yet.

I was blessed to have one of my grandmothers until 2006 when she passed away at the age of 93. She was my last grandparent that I lost - I began losing grandparents at the age of nine.

My children - 13 year old twins and an 8 year old - have lost both of their grandfathers, one five years ago, one this past January.

Life was hard when the older tragedies were written but it isn't always a bed of roses in the 21st century either.
 

Ardent Kat

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As other people have said, it's not just the environment at the time but the purpose of fiction at the time. Fables and fairy tales are mostly morality and behavior lessons. Stories weren't told purely to entertain, but to instruct (which is why so many are for children) and to caution against wild living and rash decisions (think of the stupid and rash decisions that lead to many Shakespeare tragic endings.)

Going even farther back, writing was pretty much only to record fact and pass on traditions. The concept of a poetic turn of phrase and lavish description was still peripheral, which is why ancient writings sometimes read a little dry.

The whole empathetic protagonist and relatable situations is a more modern construct. (But thank goodness for it!)
 

Higgins

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Life was pretty crappy back then, so tragedy was the norm, not the exception.


I wonder if the preponderance of tragedy from the past isn't partly the result of the fact that comedy requires a better common understanding of the world so that tragedy translates forward into other contexts and is kept and remembered and comedy just isn't funny in a new context.
 
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