Do Historical and Mainstream cross over?

Libbie · Aug 6, 2009

Hi, guys

I am starting to make my list of agents to query at the end of the month. I've noticed in book stores that historical fiction is shelved with mainstream/literary. Is this an indication that agents who represent "mainstream/literary" might be interested in taking a look at a historical novel?

What say you? Thanks!

RichardB · Aug 6, 2009

Libbie said:
Hi, guys

I am starting to make my list of agents to query at the end of the month. I've noticed in book stores that historical fiction is shelved with mainstream/literary. Is this an indication that agents who represent "mainstream/literary" might be interested in taking a look at a historical novel?

What say you? Thanks!

The way I look at it, 1% of the agents who specialize in your genre are going to respond to your query; 0.1% of the agents outside your genre will respond.

There are ten thousand reasons they will take to reject you, so picking this one (or any other) as a filter just seems silly.

Besides, "mainstream/literary" to me just means "for an audience that likes to read good books". Pick your targets based on the agent's SUBJECT affinities. If she likes books about boats, why wouldn't she like a book about boats set in 1850?

-Richard,
who talks like he knows what he's doing but has never gotten beyond "Dear Author...",
and yet is reworking his query list--
towards every agent who likes boats,
and treasure,
and mysterious lady doctors,
and great big bloody fight scenes,
and even woodcarving.

Libbie · Aug 6, 2009

Aha. Very helpful advice. Thanks!

DeleyanLee · Aug 6, 2009

Libbie said:
I am starting to make my list of agents to query at the end of the month. I've noticed in book stores that historical fiction is shelved with mainstream/literary. Is this an indication that agents who represent "mainstream/literary" might be interested in taking a look at a historical novel?

"Mainstream" means it doesn't fit into a genre rack that the bookstore already has a label for. In many bookstores, it's also called "general fiction".

This does not mean that Historical Fiction is not a genre with its own agents and editors. It only means that the bookstore doesn't stock enough Historical Fiction to give it its own rack. The vast majority of Historical Fiction written today isn't what the Literary folks are looking for, though there is a good deal of Literary Fiction that is historically set.

Personally, I'd focus my attention on those agents that DO state they rep Historical Fiction or all forms of fiction. I'd save the Mainstream agents for a lower tier, after I've exhausted the specialists who have the right contacts in the business to know who's buying what.

Good luck.

Doogs · Aug 6, 2009

DeleyanLee said:
This does not mean that Historical Fiction is not a genre with its own agents and editors. It only means that the bookstore doesn't stock enough Historical Fiction to give it its own rack.

I'm curious about this point - in everyone's experience, is an actual historical rack more common or more rare?

I've never seen one in a Barnes & Noble or Borders (where they're always thrown in with general fiction). It's been a few years, but I don't think Chapters (= Canadian version of B&N/Borders) has one either. Our local independent bookstore has a HF section, but from my experience that kind of segmentation seems rare in the actual physical world of a book retailer.

Shadow_Ferret · Aug 6, 2009

I dont believe I've ever seen a special stand alone historical fiction rack, unlike the History non-fiction section. As Del said, its usually stuffed in Mainstream or General.

And also as Del said, query the heck out of those agents that DO say they take historical first.

lkp · Aug 6, 2009

I've never seen an HF rack. And I would query an agent who seems to represent general fiction.

Libbie · Aug 6, 2009

DeleyanLee said:
Personally, I'd focus my attention on those agents that DO state they rep Historical Fiction or all forms of fiction. I'd save the Mainstream agents for a lower tier, after I've exhausted the specialists who have the right contacts in the business to know who's buying what.

Good luck.

Yeah, that's what I was thinking I'd do. Thanks!

pdr · Aug 7, 2009

As...

Donroc will also tell you, American Agents who list historical sometimes only mean Historical Romance so check carefully!

Raspberry · Aug 7, 2009

lkp said:
I've never seen an HF rack. And I would query an agent who seems to represent general fiction.

There are in Germany and I think in the UK also (correct me, when I'm wrong). So - yeah - they do exist.

RichardB · Aug 7, 2009

pdr said:
Donroc will also tell you, American Agents who list historical sometimes only mean Historical Romance so check carefully!

Hear, hear! That's why I said what I did in my first reply. For too many agents, "historical" only means "it is set in Victorian England and somebody's bodice gets ripped". To avoid this I have been describing my book as an adventure novel set in the 9th century.

Imagine if all books set in the present day were lumped together into one category called "contemporary". Calling a work "historical" only sets the time period. It could be a romance, an adventure, a comedy, thriller, women's fiction etc.

But it seems that there is a conventional understanding of what the genre "historical fiction" means. It is set in the past but not too far back, it has romantic elements but is not (usually) trashy, etc. In the same way, "Western" as a genre means something more specific than "historical fiction set in the American West of 1850-1890". As Western writer Puma will tell you, there are specific conventions for the western genre including chaste romance and "family friendly" language. Deadwood wouldn't qualify.

lkp · Aug 7, 2009

Raspberry said:
There are in Germany and I think in the UK also (correct me, when I'm wrong). So - yeah - they do exist.

Oh what fun to have all the HF in one place!

Raspberry · Aug 7, 2009

lkp said:
Oh what fun to have all the HF in one place!

It is. The bookstore won't separate further subgenres for historicals, but you can sift through the rack quite conveniently.

donroc · Aug 7, 2009

I have encountered agents who list among their genres Historicals respond by saying they do not represent Historicals. It is best to look at their stables before querying. It may be a case where one of their established writers of contemporary fiction has published the odd HF and they will not take on an unknown in that category.

Libbie · Aug 7, 2009

Thank you for all the advice, everybody! I think I'll start with donroc's suggestion to check through the stables of various agents and see who's representing work that's similar in tone and time period to my own.

You are all the bestest!

Deb Kinnard · Aug 8, 2009

RichardB, go ahead & sell this book so I can read it. I love the setting and there's too little set in the pre-Conquest years, so count me in as a customer.

Sign me, "still working on selling the novel set in the 973 Welsh marches..."

BardSkye · Aug 9, 2009

Most of the bookstores I've been in here shelve historical fiction with mainstream or sometimes fantasy. They often have a "Historical" shelf, but that's mainly devoted to non-fiction.

PastMidnight · Aug 9, 2009

To be honest, I've gotten a better response from agents who say only they're looking for anything "mainstream/literary" than those who specifically say they're looking for "historical". My advice is to query widely. By all means, include those who say they're looking for historicals, but query widely. Just because they don't rep anything similar, doesn't mean they haven't been searching high and low for a fantastic historical.

Zelenka · Aug 10, 2009

The only place I remember seeing a 'historical' section set aside in a bookshop I think was in Murder One in London, which specialises in crime fiction and had a section for 'historical crime'. I don't think I've ever seen a historical section elsewhere, not in the larger bookshops like Borders and Waterstone's anyway. I actually came across the problem just before going on holiday a couple of weeks back, trying to pick up something interesting and late Victorian whilst I was away. Very difficult if you have to look through every book on the general fiction shelf. (I suppose if you knew of specific titles or had recommendations it's not so bad, but that was a last minute whim shopping trip.)

Puma · Aug 10, 2009

Hey Jess - Long time, no see. Welcome back! Puma

Libbie · Aug 10, 2009

Great. Thanks again. I've been perusing the Writer's Market listing of literary agents and keeping a list of those who represent historicals or those whose descriptions of what they're looking for might apply to my novel. Hopefully when I start researching the list online I'll gain some more clarity.

RichardB · Aug 10, 2009

Libbie, suppose you travelled back in time far enough that "God's Wife" was a contemporary novel (and for the purposes of this exercise it doesn't matter if "publishing" back then meant "find a lot of clay tablets and stylii"). How would you classify it? Adventure? Mystery? Thriller? Romance? Then also seek agents who represent those books--and especially those who handle both that style and historicals.

vsrenard · Aug 25, 2009

I looked for agents based on the types of books I thought fit in the same category as mine. If you look in the acknowledgments page of a book, the author usually thanks her agent. This is how I built up the first tier of agents I queried to. Most represented historical fiction; some represented general fiction with no specific mention of historical.

Libbie · Aug 25, 2009

Thank you, vsrenard and RichardB. Very helpful advice!

DeleyanLee · Aug 25, 2009

RichardB said:
Hear, hear! That's why I said what I did in my first reply. For too many agents, "historical" only means "it is set in Victorian England and somebody's bodice gets ripped". To avoid this I have been describing my book as an adventure novel set in the 9th century.

Are you sure this is current information? The days of the bodice rippers in Romance was the 1980's. The dominant genre in paperbacks was Romance (I believe that's still true today) and the dominant subgenre was Historical bodice rippers.

The bodice ripper died out in the early 90's. Historical Romance is gasping for breath for the last few years, just as Contemporaries were for about 20 years while Historicals ruled.

Agents have been savvy about this change in Romance. Presently, agents looking for Historical Romance (there are a few) say they specialize in Romance and list Historical as part a subgenre.

You have me wondering how current your information is.

Unless, of course, you're counting books like "The Other Boleyn Girl" as a bodice ripper, of course. I might not be able to argue that one with you.

Do Historical and Mainstream cross over?

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