Using a famous painting on the cover of a book ..

Captain Jack · Jul 22, 2009

I'm looking for a bit of assistance ..... I would like to use the painting Declaration of Independence by John Trumbull for the cover of one of my novels ... does anyone know where I would go to obtain permission for that? I've searched John Trumbull and found some great historical information but didn't find a reference to his estate or anyone that would represent his works ....

Thanks for your help !!!

(if this was posted in the wrong location please move it as appropriate, thanks)

Kathleen42 · Jul 22, 2009

If a museum or gallery owns the painting, you may have to go through them.

Captain Jack · Jul 22, 2009

Thanks Kathleen .... The actual painting is hanging in the rotunda of the Capitol Building in D.C. .... I suppose I will write there and see if I can find out anything......

Have a Great Day!!!

Captain Jack · Jul 22, 2009

.... I just sent a note to the historical society at the Capitol .... maybe they can steer me in the right direction!!

Namatu · Jul 22, 2009

The people at the Capitol will likely redirect you to the Library of Congress. Information on the image is available at the Library of Congress, including information on rights to the image.

From what the LOC says, most of the content is not subject to copyright, but it is not a blanket statement covering all of the images. You may want to contact someone at the LOC's photographic division to see if they have any suggestions on next steps you can take to determine the copyright status. I advise this, particularly if you want to use this image on the cover of a book, where it'll be much more noticeable than on an inside page.

Captain Jack · Jul 22, 2009

Wonderful!! ... Thanks Namatu, I will do just that!!

Have a Great Day!!

Deleted member 42 · Jul 22, 2009

Is this a self published book? Rights for book images are usually tied to numbers printed. Also you need a high resolution tiff file if possible

Captain Jack · Jul 22, 2009

Yes , self published under my imprint ..... I have a 12800 x 8200 pixel tiff ... plenty big enough for where I want to put it ...

I wrote the Library of Congress .... hopefully they'll steer me in the right direction ... Thanks!!

..here is what the cover would look like ... if I don't get permission to use it I'll paint one of my own ...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v469/Cayman5/ThatsAncientHistoryCoversmall.jpg

ChristineR · Jul 22, 2009

The photograph itself is probably copyright. That would mean you need to go there and take your own picture, which is probably not allowed by the building. Plus it's pretty hard to get a good quality picture of a painting under museum circumstances--dim interior light, under glass.

What you need is a picture of the painting from a book that's more than seventy years old. That you can use freely.

Here's part of a long discussion on Wikipedia about a similar case--the painting may or may not have been considered public domain.

I was going to link you to a Wikipedia discussion about photographs--specifically photographs taken by helpful people who walked into a museum and then uploaded their pictures to Wikipedia and granted all the rights, but I couldn't find it.

Captain Jack · Jul 22, 2009

Thanks Christine ... Interesting stuff there ...

If it becomes too much of a hassle I will just either paint or draw my own .... then I can add my MC in there watching the old dudes signing with his skateboard on his shoulder!! .... I will wait and see what the LofC and/or the Capitol people have to say ...

Thanks again!!

TereLiz · Jul 22, 2009

http://www.loc.gov/preserv/pds/photo.html

Not sure if the loc offers tiffs, but if you can find the image through this site, you can definitely order a repro, for a price. This is the sort of thing I do for my day job for a private research center.

Good luck.

Captain Jack · Jul 22, 2009

Thanks everyone for your help ..... I heard back from the U.S. Capitol Historical Society and they are sending me a photo to use ... I will give credit and all will be cool!!

here was their reply:

Basically all you need is the permission of the organization or photographer from whom you obtain the image of the painting. We have an image that we would be happy to let you use and you would only need to print a credit line with the photograph. Let me know if you are interested and approximately how large you intend printing the image so that I can get you an appropriate digital file image of the painting.

Phaeal · Jul 22, 2009

Slightly off-topic, but I love the part of John Adams (the mini-series) in which John views this painting and gripes about how historically inaccurate it is. I imagine he didn't like his own portrait therein, either.

Gillhoughly · Jul 22, 2009

While there may be no copyright on the painting itself, the photographer who takes a photo of the painting can claim ownership of that particular image.

If you take your own pic of the painting, no problem. You just get permission to use a non-flash camera for the job from the museum.

Deleted member 42 · Jul 22, 2009

Captain Jack said:
Thanks everyone for your help ..... I heard back from the U.S. Capitol Historical Society and they are sending me a photo to use ... I will give credit and all will be cool!!

here was their reply:

Basically all you need is the permission of the organization or photographer from whom you obtain the image of the painting. We have an image that we would be happy to let you use and you would only need to print a credit line with the photograph. Let me know if you are interested and approximately how large you intend printing the image so that I can get you an appropriate digital file image of the painting.

Super. What you want is resolution, Dots Per Inch or DPI, info. Find out from whomever is printing your book what they need.

Also, please please please don't do this part yourself; find someone (there are plenty here on AW) who knows printing and Photoshop to prepare the cover for you.

Please. You don't want people to be able to glance at your book and make a quality judgment about it because of an unprofessional cover.

Captain Jack · Jul 22, 2009

Phaeal said:
Slightly off-topic, but I love the part of John Adams (the mini-series) in which John views this painting and gripes about how historically inaccurate it is. I imagine he didn't like his own portrait therein, either.

Hi Phaeal ..... actually I learned that this painting by Trumbull wasn't of the actual signing of the Declaration but is a depiction of the Declaration being presented to Congress for review .... Maybe that's why he was griping inaccuracies.... well, that, and perhaps Mr. Adams was put off by his choice of silk stockings that day!!

Have a Great Day!!

Captain Jack · Jul 22, 2009

Medievalist said:
You don't want people to be able to glance at your book and make a quality judgment about it because of an unprofessional cover.

...it's professional quality .... I'm a starving artist first ... a starving author second!

Have a Great Day!!

Namatu · Jul 22, 2009

The LOC has a small TIFF file for download, based off of film. You can probably get better resolution from the Capitol Historical Society's photo.

Using a famous painting on the cover of a book ..

Captain Jack

Starving Artist and Author

Kathleen42

crushing on fictional characters

Captain Jack

Starving Artist and Author

Captain Jack

Starving Artist and Author

Namatu

Lost in mental space.

Captain Jack

Starving Artist and Author

Deleted member 42

Captain Jack

Starving Artist and Author

ChristineR

What happened?

Captain Jack

Starving Artist and Author

TereLiz

Necromancer to the stars

Captain Jack

Starving Artist and Author

Phaeal

Whatever I did, I didn't do it.

Gillhoughly

Grumpy writer and editor

Deleted member 42

Captain Jack

Starving Artist and Author

Captain Jack

Starving Artist and Author

Namatu

Lost in mental space.