A feeling of general PO'd-ness

ToddWBush · Jul 16, 2009

I saw two things this week while on vacation that gave me not only frustration, but a geneal feeling of being p*ssed off at the publishing industry, the spark of hope I have of writing for a living, and at the world itself.

1) James Frey, the liar who faked not only publishers, but The Oprah herself, by making fools of them all still has a publishing contract! His newest novel (this one he admits actually is a work of fiction) is being pushed by B&N and Borders.

2) Lauran Conrad, of "The Hills" and "Laguna Beach" fame (yes, I want to kick my own a$$ for knowing those fact without looking them up), not only has published her first novel, not only admitted on national television that she didn't write it but just "gave them (her publishers) the story and they wrote it", but has a three effing book deal!!!

I've seen people quit clubs and groups because the quality of the membership got so bad it wasn't worth staying a part of it anymore. Has publishing reached that level? Do quick walk-through at your local major bookstore and give some of the crap that gets published a look see. Maybe this is a question for agents, and maybe it's a question that will guarantee that I won't get a deal, but why do you guys continue to sign these guys? Their dialogue sucks, the plots seem like they are made using Mad Libs, and the characters are the same every single book.

Can anyone give those of us who have a speck of talent but refuse to do "writing by Mad Libs" some hope? Anyone? Bueller? Bueller?

James D. Macdonald · Jul 16, 2009

...why do you guys continue to sign these guys?

Because readers pay money for their books.

Readers drive publishing. The reader is king.

MsGneiss · Jul 16, 2009

According to Family Guy, Lauran Conrad is positively brilliant.

jodiodi · Jul 16, 2009

Never heard of Lauren Conrad. Vaguely remember the Oprah guy being talked about, but didn't know his name.

Maybe I should find a celebrity to say they wrote my books so they'll get published.

maestrowork · Jul 16, 2009

If people continue to watch the Hills, the likes of Lauren Conrad will continue to sell books (even though she didn't write a word). It's a business. Welcome to reality.

There are many ways to get published... being a celebrity is one way. Is it a "shortcut"? It depends. Not everyone can get on a show like The Hills.

geardrops · Jul 16, 2009

Writing is an art, but publishing is a business. And we too-often determine ability in the former by success in the latter.

MsGneiss · Jul 16, 2009

I quit being pissed off about inferior books making it to the shelves. Obviously, this is a supply-demand sort of deal, and if people by them, the publishers have the economic incentive to print them. Surely, every editor wants to discover the next Pulitzer winner, but really, they need to make the sales and earn a living. Can't blame them for publishing celebrity books, or controversial authors, even if the writing is inadequate.

bettielee · Jul 16, 2009

Sorry guys.

Celebrity = Sales.

Publishers gotta make money. I'm sure some of them want to vomit for publishing some of this crap but they gotta keep the doors open. It's like George Clooney and the movie industry. He makes one movie for himself and one movie for the box office.

Just write a good book. That'll teach 'em.

and I think there is another current thread about celebrity and book sales, so..

you are not alone... I am here with you...

She sings and she writes. Oh yea.

katiemac · Jul 16, 2009

I'll let the James Frey portion of this OP go, but when it comes to celebrities and their books, it's just an extension of their brand. Conrad (I think) has a television show and a clothing line. And now she has a book. She's the product here, really, not the book. It's not that uncommon and from the perspective of wannabe writers, I get that it's a burn.

But just remember this: The money that Conrad's book brings in will help unknown writers be published.

maestrowork · Jul 16, 2009

dempsey said:
Writing is an art, but publishing is a business. And we too-often determine ability in the former by success in the latter.

No matter how many books Conrad sells, she will not be considered a "writer." Because she didn't even write anything. She's putting her name on a product and the product sells. No more. No less.

At least she's honest about it.

It's kind of like celebrity-brand fashion. Chances are Paris Hilton never lifted a finger designing those clothes, but they sell because Paris Hilton's name's on the label. It's a marketing/product thing. But to call her a fashion designer would be a mistake.

Now, of course, there are celebrities who actually write, and damned good at it, too. Ethan Hawk, for example. Bill Murray also writes very well. If their celebrity status got them published and more easily, I'm not going to hold that against them. I just wish I had that option!

katiemac · Jul 16, 2009

BTW - the story Lauren Conrad sold is pretty much her life story. It's about a girl who grows up in CA and gets a reality show in high school. So, again, it may be "fiction" but it's more the Conrad brand than Conrad getting a book deal.

myrmidon · Jul 16, 2009

You know, I read an interview with Frey, and I have no idea whether it was actually accurate or not, but if it was, then not all of the blame lies on his shoulders.

Again, I don't think we'll ever know the truth of what happened there as everyone has a different take, but for my part, I stopped cursing him when I read that article. It's not that I necessarily believe him, but I do acknowledge that I can't necessarily believe the other things I read either.

As for Conrad (and Frey for that matter) everyone in this thread has said it right - Celebrity equals sales, bottomline. There's no use in comparing ourselves - assuming you're all non-celebrities like me

- to them, it's a waste of time.

If I was going to get mad about someone not worthy getting a giant book deal, I'd be looking towards Alaska and that 7m advance. But the reality is that book will sell like crazy and the publishers know it. We can't blame the publishers here I think - but the readers. As long as we're feeding these celebrities they will continue to feed off us. A twisted little cycle it is

The Lonely One · Jul 16, 2009

ToddWBush said:
I saw two things this week while on vacation that gave me not only frustration, but a geneal feeling of being p*ssed off at the publishing industry, the spark of hope I have of writing for a living, and at the world itself.

1) James Frey, the liar who faked not only publishers, but The Oprah herself, by making fools of them all still has a publishing contract! His newest novel (this one he admits actually is a work of fiction) is being pushed by B&N and Borders.

2) Lauran Conrad, of "The Hills" and "Laguna Beach" fame (yes, I want to kick my own a$$ for knowing those fact without looking them up), not only has published her first novel, not only admitted on national television that she didn't write it but just "gave them (her publishers) the story and they wrote it", but has a three effing book deal!!!

I've seen people quit clubs and groups because the quality of the membership got so bad it wasn't worth staying a part of it anymore. Has publishing reached that level? Do quick walk-through at your local major bookstore and give some of the crap that gets published a look see. Maybe this is a question for agents, and maybe it's a question that will guarantee that I won't get a deal, but why do you guys continue to sign these guys? Their dialogue sucks, the plots seem like they are made using Mad Libs, and the characters are the same every single book.

Can anyone give those of us who have a speck of talent but refuse to do "writing by Mad Libs" some hope? Anyone? Bueller? Bueller?

My opinion:

The industry needs these mass-marketed trashy novels to make money. The noble thing to do (I have no idea if they're doing this) is take some of that profit and make sure the less-popular but more-talented writers have a place on bookshelves.

Prozyan · Jul 16, 2009

James Frey writes a hell of a story, fiction or not. When you have sales numbers like his, you earn a lot of forgiveness for any "exaggerations".

aadams73 · Jul 17, 2009

ToddWBush said:
1) James Frey, the liar who faked not only publishers, but The Oprah herself, by making fools of them all still has a publishing contract!

2) Lauran Conrad, of "The Hills" and "Laguna Beach" fame (yes, I want to kick my own a$$ for knowing those fact without looking them up), not only has published her first novel, not only admitted on national television that she didn't write it but just "gave them (her publishers) the story and they wrote it", but has a three effing book deal!!!

So what? Concentrate on what you can control: the quality of your own work. Comparing yourself to someone else, particularly a celebrity, is futile and a waste of energy. If you insist on being envious/pissed off/whatever, channel it into making your own work better.

Do quick walk-through at your local major bookstore and give some of the crap that gets published a look see.

Bullshit. There are scores of new and excellent books hitting the shelves. And the crap is only crap to you. Someone else may like it. Your tastes are not the only ones that should be catered to.

Kats · Jul 17, 2009

katiemac said:
But just remember this: The money that Conrad's book brings in will help unknown writers be published.

Exactly. Meg Cabot did a blog post about this a while back here (it's near the end of the post).

KTC · Jul 17, 2009

ToddWBush said:
I saw two things this week while on vacation that gave me not only frustration, but a geneal feeling of being p*ssed off at the publishing industry, the spark of hope I have of writing for a living, and at the world itself.

1) James Frey, the liar who faked not only publishers, but The Oprah herself, by making fools of them all still has a publishing contract! His newest novel (this one he admits actually is a work of fiction) is being pushed by B&N and Borders.

2) Lauran Conrad, of "The Hills" and "Laguna Beach" fame (yes, I want to kick my own a$$ for knowing those fact without looking them up), not only has published her first novel, not only admitted on national television that she didn't write it but just "gave them (her publishers) the story and they wrote it", but has a three effing book deal!!!

I've seen people quit clubs and groups because the quality of the membership got so bad it wasn't worth staying a part of it anymore. Has publishing reached that level? Do quick walk-through at your local major bookstore and give some of the crap that gets published a look see. Maybe this is a question for agents, and maybe it's a question that will guarantee that I won't get a deal, but why do you guys continue to sign these guys? Their dialogue sucks, the plots seem like they are made using Mad Libs, and the characters are the same every single book.

Can anyone give those of us who have a speck of talent but refuse to do "writing by Mad Libs" some hope? Anyone? Bueller? Bueller?

James answered your question succinctly in Post #2...but I just have to say:

1) I HATE HATE HATE HATE this guy's writing. I think it's absolutely horrible. I tried to read A MILLION TINY PIECES OF SHIT and gave up...not because of the controversy, but because he's a horrid horrid writer. I can't even believe he's published. IMHO, the man cannot write a sentence.

2) Never heard of her. I'm sure there are scads who have and that they just have to have her book.

Get famous...through controversy or teenybop glam. You'll be all set.

xXFireSpiritXx · Jul 17, 2009

The entire Lauren Conrad thing I have to say pushed me over the edge. She isn't a writer. She is sham just like her entire TV show. I saw an interview with her the other day where she was just so shocked and "never imagined I would ever be a NY Times Bestselling author!"

It makes me sick when you have people like us working our buts off just to get a hair in the door, and she just struts along and slaps her name on a book. No time devoted. No energy spent.

I have to say the LC thing cut deep. I remember watching her interview and bursting into tears. This is all I ever wanted and I work and write and write yet she can just take it without a second thought.

xXFireSpiritXx · Jul 17, 2009

2) Never heard of her. I'm sure there are scads who have and that they just have to have her book.

I just have to point out that just because her name is on it, doesn't make it her book. If she didn't write it then it isn't hers. I give props to the ghostwriter they hired.

Phaeal · Jul 17, 2009

Yeah, crappy books happen, and it sucks. Do the only thing you can do to discourage the production of crappy books: Don't buy them.* Then get back to work.

*Oh, you ARE allowed to sit in the bookstore cafe and snort over crappy books with like-minded friends. But don't buy them.**

** Do put the crappy book back where you found it. The poor cafe staffers shouldn't have to round up all the abandoned crappy books and put them back. Crappy books aren't their fault. Unless they happen to be crappy book publishers on the side.***

*** Which, if the theory that crappy books sell is correct, doesn't seem likely.

seun · Jul 17, 2009

This isn't anything new. Look at Jordan, for example. That talentless pair of fake tits has got her name on roughly a bajillion books and did she write any of them?

Did she fuck.

All we can do is keep writing and keep going for agents.

roonil_wazlib · Jul 17, 2009

ToddWBush said:
Do quick walk-through at your local major bookstore and give some of the crap that gets published a look see.

What bookstore are you going to? My local B&N (because we hip folk abbreviate words that are longer than five letters) has scads of great books and quite a few of them are in the bargain section, too (because, really, not many people are actually going to pay $15 for a 300-page paperback . . . well, not all the time, anyway). Since I started making a bit more money, my book collection has tripled and my dinky little bookcase overflowed to the point where nearly a quarter of my room is now littered with books. And none of them are crap, all of them were bought at - you guessed it - my local major bookstore.

You have to sift through the crap, not skim the surface.

Claudia Gray · Jul 17, 2009

Lauren Conrad's book is making money -- probably mostly from people who otherwise do not buy tons of books. That money flows into the publishing house (mine, as it happens) and makes them more profitable and better able to support other books (no idea whether mine will be one of them, but I hope so). This is just capitalism at work. Why get angry because someone else is making money? It doesn't make it less likely that you'll get published/make money; in fact, by supporting the publishing houses and making them stronger, it makes it MORE likely.

djf881 · Jul 17, 2009

ClaudiaGray said:
Lauren Conrad's book is making money -- probably mostly from people who otherwise do not buy tons of books. That money flows into the publishing house (mine, as it happens) and makes them more profitable and better able to support other books (no idea whether mine will be one of them, but I hope so). This is just capitalism at work. Why get angry because someone else is making money? It doesn't make it less likely that you'll get published/make money; in fact, by supporting the publishing houses and making them stronger, it makes it MORE likely.

I have actually read that the presence of a blockbuster book (like a "Twilight" or a "Da Vinci Code") doesn't drive up total book sales nearly as much as the blockbuster book sells. Which means that the book is cannibalizing the market rather than growing it. Not that the people who buy it necessarily would have been buying anything worthwhile in its absence.

Lauren Conrad's book sales seem to be spurred by the fact that her "novel" is essentially a thinly veiled tell-all about "The Hills," in which she accuses the show of being staged. People apparently care about this.

But Lauren Conrad or not, the bestseller list is always clogged with garbage.

James Patterson, for example, seems not to be an actual person, but, rather, some kind of crap factory, staffed by the minions of Satan.

On a related note, "The Shack," the first novel to combine readers' love of inspirational pseudo-Christianity with the titillating thrill of child-rape/snuff porn, achieved bestseller status because of an arrangement in which the author sold his soul to the Devil. So, whenever you think about how much you hate that guy, you can take solace in the fact that he will have to spend eternity writing James Patterson novels.

Kitty Pryde · Jul 17, 2009

1. If you'd like to hate James Frey a little more, he's got a new four book deal, starting with a YA book called 'I Am Number Four', which hasn't been published yet but will be made into a film by Dreamworks/Michael Bay. http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/content_display/film/news/e3i344418db676344f0ce780fe6c054a278

And yeah, LC is the fakest of fakeness and people eat it up. And she's contributing to keeping the publishing industry alive in a crap economy. But think of all the kids who will try to read for fun for the first time ever because this trifling doofus has a book with her name on it. And think of all the other books they'll pick up after that. Kids reading=all for the greater good of the universe IMO. And just because lousy fake-celebrity books sell doesn't mean there's no market for brilliant inspiring ones as well.

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