Clichés : When do they get to be too much?

You can define cliches with signature characteristics. Like you can't just write about star struck lovers, or magical powers. If you do, there has to be SOMETHING unique about them. Then you can pull it off.
I guess it really depends, and the answer is different for every example. Care to clarify?

Epiphany said:

You can define cliches with signature characteristics. Like you can't just write about star struck lovers, or magical powers. If you do, there has to be SOMETHING unique about them. Then you can pull it off.
I guess it really depends, and the answer is different for every example. Care to clarify?

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Lol Magical powers, huh Sarah?.

But onto relevant notes, yeah, you need to be able to make the cliche have spice to it. It's hard to not have a cliche because whatever you are thinking most likely has been written about, but that's why you have to spice it up. Give it its own flame.

Cliches are cliches because they've been done so many times we instantly understand all the history and cultural baggage that goes with it. We know what star crossed lovers are without anyone having to explain what that is. This hurts a story because it's predictable, and readers are so familiar with it that it feels like they're read it before. Without something new or unpredictable to bring to the story, readers get bored and see things coming a mile away.

Think of it like a movie where you figure out the ending or the big twist halfway through. How exciting is the rest of the movie then?

If the entire plot is based on things readers already know and understand, then there's no reason for them to read the story. If there are a few elements to give them a base of understanding, and then you take the story in a new direction, they'll read on.

It's impossible to say X number is okay, but Y number is too much. It's not the number, it's how you handle them that's important.

Of course, if you're talking about actual cliches in the text, fewer is usually better. The rule of thumb I use, is that if it fits a character and they'd say or think it it's okay. But in the narrative it's just lazy writing and I try to think up something fresher.

If your novel looks like Twilight, there's too many cliches

Well, I never write out an outline, I always dive straight into the story. This helps me to avoid cliché, I don't know if this works for anyone else, but I come up with ideas on the way to avoid over-used ideas. That's how my brain works.

It's-Magic! said:

Well, I never write out an outline, I always dive straight into the story. This helps me to avoid cliché, I don't know if this works for anyone else, but I come up with ideas on the way to avoid over-used ideas. That's how my brain works.

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See I never outline either. I always just let my words flow, but I guess I have limited creativity because I'm picking up cliches that I didn't realize that I wrote. Now I'm stuck on changing them because they are bothering me.

I think that cliches are only bad when they are so distracting that they pull someone out of the story, which is largely a function of how much people care about the character and on how well they fit into the story. If we know that we're being introduced to "the bad boy", but he's really hot, then brilliant! Trudge forward. If we meet the bad boy and that's all he is, just another bad boy, then you're misstepped. If someone slips on a banana peal and it's funny, then great. If someone slips on a banana peal and you think "Oh, god, again? Has that ever even happened in real life?" then you have a problem.

That all may have been obvious. In my opinion, the way to tell if you have a problem or not is to trust your instincts. Put it down for a week, read it again, and if you think it works, then leave it as is. If you really like it, but deep in your gut, you know it's not right, then get rid of it.

Good luck.

Those who don't know their clichés are doomed to re-heat them.

I think that her falling in love with someone she hates, if it's realistic, would be fine.

Since it's another world in another time, you have SO much room to play to make it NOT cliche or to give a cliche a twist.

I think, if you or other readers find themselves rolling their eyes...it's too much cliche and not fresh enough.

LOL at the Twilight... I am reading New Moon and it hurts my eyes. Anyway, I do agree with everyone here... my stories has tons of cliches, (boy who has parents that want to control his life; boy who is the 'chosen one', and must decide which side to help--bad or worse... etc) but as long as you can make some kind of twist/ change it up, you should be good.

Through manga and books, I think I have read just about every kind of scenario that could happen to a person. But that doesn't make them any less interesting if they are unique.

Blackest_Nite said:

The basics of my story:

-MC runs away from the intolerance at her home, but also to find a way to resurrect her brother (she isn't coping very well with his murder)

-MC is turned away from the only people that could possibly help her; shortly after is almost murdered by the man she hired to help her get back home

-her brother's murderer is the main antagonist, and is trying to obtain an ancient heirloom from the MC's family, thus the motive for the murder

-Antag. keeps on murdering family members in attempts to persuade the MC's stubborn father

This story is a WIP, so I don't know everything about it. It is a fantasy set in a more medieval time frame, in another world. I have been debating the whole 'MC falls in love w/ someone she hates' but I fear that it is to be expected. The last thing I want is a boring read.

Thanks for all the advice as well.

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IMO, a little romance probably won't hurt, as long as it feels genuine to your characters/plot & not just thrown in b/c it is "expected." Personally, I have always, and prob will always, love a little romance woven in. But when it is there just to fill that desire in a reader and isn't a part of the story, that's your cliche problem right there.

I think so many ideas have been done before, no one can ever be completely original. All we can do is put a twist on it that's so distinctive that it becomes fresh and the new big hit.

When Stan Lee created The Fantastic Four, all of those powers had been done in the comic books before. There was nothing new about the characters, but what made the book a success is the fact that they were a family, which made them unlike all of the other super hero teams.

I think I've written a great story, but any story with a high school setting is in danger of being a cliche. The types of characters in the book are cliche, but I made it work to my advantage for the purpose of the story.

But I think it's my characterization that sets the characters apart, and I think you have to do the same. I think it's the characters, the relationships, and especially the dialogue that will set you apart from everyone else.

christinalbarr said:

I think so many ideas have been done before, no one can ever be completely original. All we can do is put a twist on it that's so distinctive that it becomes fresh and the new big hit.

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I second that!