Update to BBB Listing

AnneMarble · Feb 11, 2009

Because of the changes in the way the Better Business Bureau works, I checked out the BBB listing for PublishAmerica. They now give it a rating of C- (because of numerous complaints). (Too generous but better than nothing.) I don't know if this link works, but they also give more information.

At least people who look them up on the BBB site might think twice before going with them. After all, would you trust your brakes to a garage that got a C-?

Then again, people who think the BBB is the best and only way to research a publisher might not know that a C- isn't good for a publisher. After all, these were the same people who went with them despite the numerous complaints listed on the BBB site.

This led me to ask "How bad does a company have to be to get an F?" So I checked another notorious Maryland business and learned that Watermark Press (Poetry.com) gets a rating of F. They get that rating not only from the numerous complaints and number of serious complaints filed against them but from the failure to respond to complaints and failure to resolve complaints. That makes sense -- they probably have a larger volume than PA because of their advertising alone.

In comparison, the tire center I went to the other day got an A-. All I can say to that is "Hmmmmm." (*Whistles nonchalantly*)

Mel · Feb 11, 2009

Link works. I found this interesting, though.

From BBB

According to the company, "Publish America authors are not consumers."

And yet, it was stated in court by PA ::Willem I believe:: that their authors are the consumers.

veinglory · Feb 11, 2009

Although I must note almost none of the presses I have search for are even listed at BBB. If they listed more of them it would be a useful screening tool.

James D. Macdonald · Feb 11, 2009

Why would any real publisher want to be a member of the BBB?

AnneMarble · Feb 11, 2009

James D. Macdonald said:
Why would any real publisher want to be a member of the BBB?

They rate members and non-members. For example, Penguin Books USA has a satisfactory record with the BBB, and no complaints in the past 36 months. Random House has two complaints, both resolved -- not bad for such a huge company.

Baen Books has no rating, and no complaints in the past 36 months. None of these publishers are members.

Maybe they realized that membership had become a joke because companies like Poetry.com were using BBB accreditation to suck people in, while real publishers were too busy publishing books to become a member. I hope the listings become more useful now. (I might not have ordered so many subscriptions from a certain small SF magazine publisher if I had seen their rating!)

Jp the Ready Writer · Apr 17, 2009

Hello everyone! I'm new to the AW Boards but like so many of you have concerns/issues with Publish America. My question for this thread is . . . Why doesn't the BBB (or any other consumer advocate) do anything when it comes to Publish America. I submitted a case to the BBB 23 Mar 09 and have yet to hear a thing from them. From what I understood, they would submit my complaint to PA and PA had two weeks to respond. I assumed that the BBB would "fact check" and serve as and advocate in my behalf. Perhaps I do not have a full understanding of what the BBB does.

Unimportant · Apr 17, 2009

JP, the BBB deals with consumers who have a problem with a business. If PA sells a book to a buyer and the buyer's not happy with it (the cover falls off, or it's missing half its pages, or whatever) then the BBB will deal with it.

When an author signs a contract with PA to publish his book, that is a business-to-business transaction and thus outside the BBB's jurisdiction.

Ulee_Lhea · Apr 17, 2009

Hey, JP! If you parse through AW's NEPATs (aka the Never-Ending-Publish-America-Threads; there are two, an old and a new), you'll see that several authors have tried to open a case with the BBB in Maryland over PA.

While the BBB doesn't seem to have the authority to do much for authors, it's been good to see that their rating has gone down (though not nearly far enough!)

Jp the Ready Writer · Apr 18, 2009

Unimportant and Ulee Lhea . . . Thanks so much for responding to my post. I understand now. That does shed some light on things and is probably the reasoning behind one of the PA reps stating that a PA author is not a consumer.

Well let me ask this, what recourse does an author have to report/bring attention to their poor business practices. What I mean by that is their intentional tactics that keep the author from speaking with anyone in management concerning an issue . . . responding to emails without identifying themselves by name ( i.e. /signed/ "support", " author support", "text productions", or by a first name only, etc), the way that they bully the author into accepting the product whether they want it or not, and so on?

James D. Macdonald · Apr 18, 2009

You might consider writing to the FTC, stressing PA's false and misleading advertising.

AC Crispin · Apr 19, 2009

I've said it before and I'll say it again. The Better Business Bureau is USELESS to authors who are trying to scope out the legitimacy of a publisher or literary agent.

Witness their refusal to update their listings about PublishAmerica to reflect all the complaints they've received.

Witness their continuing to list Dorothy Deering's literary agency and publishing company as legit on the day that Dorothy and her husband were led away from their offices in handcuffs by FBI agent Clay Mason.

I bet if anyone were to check out Robert Fletcher and his companies on the BBB the listing wouldn't show that there was anything wrong with this man or his assorted literary "businesses."

Don't bother with the BBB when searching for a publisher or literary agent.

-Ann C. Crispin
Chair, Writer Beware
www.writerbeware.com

Jp the Ready Writer · Apr 20, 2009

Thanks James . . . I'll check out the FTC. Also read something today about a couple of successful arbitratons. I would hate to be tied up that long . . .but, guess one has to do what one has to do! :-/

Ulee_Lhea · Apr 22, 2009

It doesn't necessarily take arbitration to get your rights back (Although sometimes it does!)

Kaji would be a case in point. Ask him for the magic word . . .

Arkie · Apr 22, 2009

Ulee_Lhea said:
It doesn't necessarily take arbitration to get your rights back (Although sometimes it does!)

Kaji would be a case in point. Ask him for the magic word . . .

PA in the infomerical on their board states they serve about 20,000 authors and in another place claim to have about 35,000 happly authors. This seems to indicate they have released about 15,000. They surely must have released a large number rather than trying to maintain all those records since the inception of the company in 1999.

Update to BBB Listing

AnneMarble

Nefarious Ghost Fan

Mel

Never be completely back to normal.

veinglory

volitare nequeo

James D. Macdonald

Your Genial Uncle

AnneMarble

Nefarious Ghost Fan

Jp the Ready Writer

Unimportant

doggone

Ulee_Lhea

Fear no darkness.

Jp the Ready Writer

James D. Macdonald

Your Genial Uncle

AC Crispin

Jp the Ready Writer

Ulee_Lhea

Fear no darkness.

Arkie

a reader's ear and a writer's heart