THE DREAMER

[citymouse]

I think it appropriate today to recall these words.

Come let us slay the dreamer and see what becomes of his dream.
C

[AMCrenshaw]

:)

An amazing figure to follow.



AMC

[citymouse]

Lupus est homo homini. Ain't that the truth!
C

[Norman D Gutter]

Okay, for the sake of others as well as myself, I'll show my ignorance.

From where does your quote come?

What is your purpose in posting it on the Christian writing board at AW?

[citymouse]

Try Genesis 37.
Sorry to be so short. It's snowing and I have a plane to meet in Philly.
C

Okay, for the sake of others as well as myself, I'll show my ignorance.

From where does your quote come?

What is your purpose in posting it on the Christian writing board at AW?

[AMCrenshaw]

MLK used it in his speech, I think.

[Guffy]

Genesis 37:19-20 Joseph's brothers conspire to kill him before they finally decide to sell him into slavery in Egypt. Joseph had dreams from God, but today it refers of course to MLK try this website http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/mlkihaveadream.htm

[Norman D Gutter]

I know well the story in Genesis about Joseph and his dreams. And of course I know the MLK speech. But how does the original post connect the two? I suppose "slay the dreamer" might refer to King's assassination. But I don't see the connection. And at the web site you linked, Guffy, I searched for the text in the original post and didn't find it on that site.

[AMCrenshaw]

It's useless to kill the messenger once the messenger has already relayed his or her message.



AMC



Or, if you're more 1984, I dare ye to martyr Him!!

[III]

I guess I'm with NDG in my confusion. Maybe it's because 1) Joseph's dreams were literal dreams of him ruling over his brothers (and those brothers were rightly angry with him) whereas MLK's dreams were figurative of a harmonious future. 2) Joseph's brothers did not actually kill him whereas MLK was actually killed. 3) Joseph's dreams didn't inspire others to action, nor was he a martyr for a cause.

If I'm inferring correctly, the OP was basically saying "they thought they would kill MLK's dream of a racially united America, but they didn't because we now have a black president."

Sorry if this all seems nitpicky but this entire thread was pretty confusing.

[citymouse]

III, your inference is correct. Frankly I though it was pretty clear. I was moved by the confluence of events and the poetry one often finds in the Bible. That is where I was coming from.
C


...If I'm inferring correctly, the OP was basically saying "they thought they would kill MLK's dream of a racially united America, but they didn't because we now have a black president."

Sorry if this all seems nitpicky but this entire thread was pretty confusing.

[Norman D Gutter]

C:

See, much of the country doesn't get or celebrate that holiday. My company doesn't give us the day as a holiday. It was another work day, same as usual, and so I went to work and never never thought about the day. I read your post, and it made no sense. You have those words in italics, which implies they are a quote of something, but you did not give the attribution. And I saw no reason why that should be in the forum about Christian writing.

So, no, it wasn't clear. Later on, when I realized it was MLK Jr. day, it sort of made sense. Although the quote (if it is indeed a quote and not something you made up) still isn't certain to me. It doesn't quite match Genesis 37:20, although it's close and it's probably what you mean. Even so, I didn't make the connection to MLK Jr.

It fact, it almost sounds like, from the orignal post, that you are in agreement with that quote, rather than saying it for irony. Are you in agreement with it, or did you post it for irony?

Had you a more descriptive title for the thread, it would have been clearer.

NDG

III, your inference is correct. Frankly I though it was pretty clear. I was moved by the confluence of events and the poetry one often finds in the Bible. That is where I was coming from.
C

[citymouse]

I'm feeling at bay here. There was nothing sinister in my thoughts.

My italicized text is a paraphrasing I have often heard and should be viewed against the backdrop of the confluence of today's events. I italicized the text because it is not a direct quote nor is not my own, however I cannot recall where I first heard it so with a nod for words I cannot attribute I italicized them. No, it is not something I made up but even if it was, so what?
As for posting in this forum goes, I'm a Christian and a writer and my thought came from a heart felt thrill of our times. It was and is my sharing. If I was less than clear, I apologize for that.
C

C:

See, much of the country doesn't get or celebrate that holiday. My company doesn't give us the day as a holiday. It was another work day, same as usual, and so I went work and never never thought about the day. I read your post, and it made no sense. You have those words in italics, which implies they are a quote of something, but you did not give the attribution. And I saw no reason why that should be in the forum about Christian writing.

So, no, it wasn't clear. Later on, when I realized it was MLK Jr. day, it sort of made sense. Although the quote (if it is indeed a quote and not something you made up) still isn't certain to me. It doesn't quite match Genesis 37:20, although it's close and it's probably what you mean. Even so, I didn't make the connection to MLK Jr.

It fact, it almost sounds like, from the orignal post, that you are in agreement with that quote, rather than saying it for irony. Are you in agreement with it, or did you post it for irony?

Had you a more descriptive title for the thread, it would have been clearer.

NDG

[Norman D Gutter]

citymouse:

Yes, I understand that, with explanation, what you were saying was clear. But as writers, we must make our words stand on their own. While we shouldn't spoon-feed our readers or be condescending, we have to be clear enough that the audience will understand. Very simply, a different thread title would have been sufficient. Perhaps: Tomorrow proves they couldn't kill King's dream" would have been all you needed for the biggest ignoramous on AW to understand it.

As for posting in the Christian forum, while it possibly would have made more sense in P&CE, I don't see that as a big problem after the explanations, since King was a minister of the gospel and since his speech included significant spiritual references.

NDG

[Guffy]

citymouse, I got the reference and felt that it was very appropriate. I to am thrilled with the events of today and its coming so close to MLK's holiday.

[Sean D. Schaffer]

I didn't get the reference to Dr. King, but I can see where he would have used it, he being a preacher. :)

I loved his words, and something that constantly comes to mind (forgive me please if this is not exact) comes from his "I Have A Dream" speech:


"I dream of a day when men will be judged not by the color of their skin but by the content of their character."


Those words mean a lot to me, not because of the color of my skin, but because I know what it's like to be judged by looks rather than by who I am.