Aliens and citizenship

Thomas_Anderson · Jan 1, 2009

Sufficiently advanced aliens would develop their own citizenship and wouldn't be bothered if they weren't accepted by humans, and would live with other aliens. However, what about less advanced alien civilizations? If we had the Faster than light/wormhole travel through the stars, and they're still like we are today, or less, maybe even still in something like a stone age. Yet, they're still as intelligent as humanity, just not as advanced.

How do you think advanced humans would treat an alien race like that?

Also, amongst the non-sapient animal kingdom, some animals are smarter than others. What if there was an alien race that, while sapient, the smartest among them would be considered mentally handicapped by human standards. How would we treat them?

Dommo · Jan 1, 2009

Assuming humans are anything like they are now, we'd probably take full advantage of them like we've done to primitive peoples. Assuming intelligent life is truly rare however, and we might approach things differently since we might utilize the opportunity to try to create peers for ourselves(even if it involves some genetic manipulation/breeding). The universe will be a lonely place if us humans are all that we see.

dclary · Jan 1, 2009

I hope Galactic Geographic continues to post pictures of the topless six-boobed women of Ulthar IX.

Dommo · Jan 1, 2009

As long as they have green skinned chicks, I'll be down for it.

dpaterso · Jan 2, 2009

Thomas_Anderson said:
Sufficiently advanced aliens would develop their own citizenship and wouldn't be bothered if they weren't accepted by humans, and would live with other aliens.

That is one huge gooey assumption of a statement!

Earth citizenship is highly valued throughout the cosmos. That's why they come here. In their probe ships.

-Derek

HeronW · Jan 2, 2009

If we're advanced enough to have FTL, the fact of genetics would make us all Terrans. Ambassadors would be free to travel unless they're asshats and become persona non gratis. There might be immigration issues for non-terrans based on adaptibility, health-requirements, special needs, and likely purists yelling 'Earth for Earthlings'. For less developed aliens, promises of quick money, scamming us or we use them as a slave labor force since, 'they're not human'.

Then there's ethics and customs, bio-hazards and religious differences. Those ignorant on all sides will suffer. European smallpox wiped out much of the indigenous Americans, often deliberately as infected blankets were given to the Indians as 'gifts' of welcome.

All sorts of possibilites.

Zoombie · Jan 2, 2009

What Heron said...but I'd prefer that we call ourselves Earthicans.

Smiling Ted · Jan 2, 2009

Zoombie said:
What Heron said...but I'd prefer that we call ourselves Earthicans.

Over-sized dirt-colored men?
Octopus-eyed monsters?
Hideous primate invaders?

Just trying to look at it from the aliens' point of view.

Mr Flibble · Jan 2, 2009

Given normal human behaviour we'd probably try to either eat them ( taste like chicken? We could farm them!), hump them or kill them.

Yes I am feeling cynical today.

Smiling Ted · Jan 2, 2009

IdiotsRUs said:
Given normal human behaviour we'd probably try to either eat them ( taste like chicken? We could farm them!), hump them or kill them.

Yes I am feeling cynical today.

OR...
OR...

Sell them things.
I have darling little "Made On Earth" Keychain here.
Set with sparkling Diamonelles in a genuine faux-platinum setting.
And when you blow on it...see?...the little charms play the Martian National Anthem.
Only 5.95. Act now.

MargueriteMing · Jan 2, 2009

HeronW said:
Then there's ethics and customs, bio-hazards and religious differences. Those ignorant on all sides will suffer. European smallpox wiped out much of the indigenous Americans, often deliberately as infected blankets were given to the Indians as 'gifts' of welcome.

All sorts of possibilites.

Microbial life forms are often specialized to a particular species. That's why your cat doesn't catch cold when you do, or get the measles, or mumps, or chicken pox, yada yada yada. It is actually unlikely that a virus encountered in another biosphere would be able to take advantage of human proteins in order to replicate itself.

MargueriteMing · Jan 2, 2009

IdiotsRUs said:
Given normal human behaviour we'd probably try to either eat them ( taste like chicken? We could farm them!), hump them or kill them.

Yes I am feeling cynical today.

I don't know, we refuse to drill for oil to protect polar bears who aren't even endangered. We're kind of silly, sometimes.

One thing is certain, though, humans will put the survival of our own species above the survival of another, if we see them as a threat. Of course, another intelligent species will know this, and will have the same attitude about us.

Mr Flibble · Jan 2, 2009

I don't know, we refuse to drill for oil to protect polar bears who aren't even endangered. We're kind of silly, sometimes

Then again, there's bush meat. And dolphins...All that's missing there is the humping. Oh wait, there was that guy got done for sexually assaulting a dolphin.

We might not kill them if they are cute and / or fulfil some function. Or have bigger weapons than us.

ooooh maybe there would be a war between the Save Our Cuddly Aliens Brigade and the Society For Shooting Everything, Edible Or Not.

Higgins · Jan 2, 2009

Thomas_Anderson said:
Sufficiently advanced aliens would develop their own citizenship and wouldn't be bothered if they weren't accepted by humans, and would live with other aliens. However, what about less advanced alien civilizations? If we had the Faster than light/wormhole travel through the stars, and they're still like we are today, or less, maybe even still in something like a stone age. Yet, they're still as intelligent as humanity, just not as advanced.

How do you think advanced humans would treat an alien race like that?

Also, amongst the non-sapient animal kingdom, some animals are smarter than others. What if there was an alien race that, while sapient, the smartest among them would be considered mentally handicapped by human standards. How would we treat them?

As long as you can recite the Alien Pledge-of-Allegiance in Alien the Aliens will think you are cute:

I pledge Alliance to the Stars
and the weird little guys from there
and all their strange letters
and the two little tags
that stick out when they feel ill
like ears
and are very sensitive.
Don't touch them unless you
are willing to be friendly all afternoon.

Higgins · Jan 2, 2009

Higgins said:
As long as you can recite the Alien Pledge-of-Allegiance in Alien the Aliens will think you are cute:

I pledge Alliance to the Stars
and the weird little guys from there
and all their strange letters
and the two little tags
that stick out when they feel ill
like ears
and are very sensitive.
Don't touch them unless you
are willing to be friendly all afternoon.

Mentally handicapped Aliens? I just don't get how
that would work. What difference would it make how they scored on a human IQ test? Why would they even take the test? And what exactly do they do that seems idiotic to us? Do their spaceships have a high accident rate? Perhaps they are using somebody else's spacdeships or they are suicidal by nature or ill (the tags come out and you know they are unwell) or it is their way of showing they are happy to see you. I don't see how you can conclude they are "handicapped" whatever that means to an incipient suicidal lunatic piloting a spaceship of non-human design.

Higgins · Jan 2, 2009

MargueriteMing said:
I don't know, we refuse to drill for oil to protect polar bears who aren't even endangered. We're kind of silly, sometimes.

One thing is certain, though, humans will put the survival of our own species above the survival of another, if we see them as a threat. Of course, another intelligent species will know this, and will have the same attitude about us.

Perhaps our new-found friends the handicapped aliens put their own survival last on the list of things to look out for....or for which they look out last...though perhaps that is the essence of their handicap: what they put last on the list of things for which they should look out last should actually be the same as first on the list for which you look out first. It's an alien problem. That's why they are so alien. And so stupid.

Higgins · Jan 2, 2009

Higgins said:
Perhaps our new-found friends the handicapped aliens put their own survival last on the list of things to look out for....or for which they look out last...though perhaps that is the essence of their handicap: what they put last on the list of things for which they should look out last should actually be the same as first on the list for which you look out first. It's an alien problem. That's why they are so alien. And so stupid.

Not to mention -- what about that encounter with Polar Bears?
Wwe can imagine a handicapped alien recounting it to his fellow handicapped aliens:
AlienA: There I was with our host and he pointed at the Polar Bear and said, "Those are not endangered!"
AlienB: Indeed. I wonder at that.
AlienA: Thereupon, the bear killed him.
AlienB: So the Earth Man was right!
AlienA: He was right and the bear made a meal of him to prove it.
AlienB: An excellent experience.
AlienA: I'm glad we came here. It is the place where I have felt most stupid.
AlienB: And I believe you have suffered for it.
AlienA: Truly: the bear struck me a great blow and damaged my left tag so that it is no longer obtrusive when errect.
AlienB: So I have noticed. It looks more stupid than you can imagine.
AlienA: You say the kindest things. Put your muffs on my tags.
AlienB: With most stupid pleasure!

Thump · Jan 2, 2009

Dommo said:
As long as they have green skinned chicks, I'll be down for it.

As a representative of all green-skinned females of the universe, allow me to thank you for your support.

Albedo · Jan 2, 2009

Zoombie said:
What Heron said...but I'd prefer that we call ourselves Earthicans.

The word 'Terran' is banned from my writing. How that Star Trek abortion could ever replace the fine "Terrestrial" is a mystery. Similarly, there's no wishy-washy calling the Moon 'Luna' in my future.

Thomas_Anderson · Jan 3, 2009

Isn't Luna what Earth's moon is called though? Lots of planets have moons, wouldn't calling it 'the moon' be a bit confusing if there are many moons to choose from?

Also, the term Terran was around long, long before Star Trek was even conceived.

Albedo · Jan 3, 2009

Luna is Latin for Moon, but I write in English, not Latin. I guess I can call it the 'capital-M moon' to avoid ambiguity.

Calling it Luna is based on the misconception that it has no proper name, unlike the other satellites in our solar system: Moon IS its proper name, at least in English. It's the same with the Sun "Sol" and Earth "Terra". The last is the one that annoys me the most, hence no "Terran" adjective. I can't think of anything that would make us all start calling Earth Terra instead as soon as the 22nd century. Is it meant to be a form of political correctness?

MattW · Jan 4, 2009

And I'm proud to be an Earthican,
where at least I know I'm free
And I won't forget the clones who died
who gave that right to me.

Nivarion · Jan 5, 2009

maybe he means mentally handy capped like where they will follow your laser light pointer right into the wall.

just like the dog.

dclary · Jan 5, 2009

Albedo said:
The word 'Terran' is banned from my writing. How that Star Trek abortion could ever replace the fine "Terrestrial" is a mystery. Similarly, there's no wishy-washy calling the Moon 'Luna' in my future.

We are humans. Our planet of origin doesn't change our race.

Why is it that regardless of the planet they're born on, we call all vulcans "vulcans?" --do we think that humans will be allowed to change their call-sign by their planet of birth?

Jovians, martians, and earthlings are fine -- if you're talking 3 different species. But if we're going to move beyond the solar system, we need a name that transcends any one planet.

We are humans. And that's just fine by me.

dpaterso · Jan 5, 2009

I wrote "Solarian" on my Galactic Citizenship Application Form, and put "Sol III" as Planet of Origin. The Squid clerk floating in the desk-globe rejected "Tellus" and "Tellurian" as options, which surprised me somewhat. Being a Squid, of course, it refused to furnish anything approximating an explanation. When I demanded same it vanished behind a cloud of purple ink, thus ending our conversation. Rude!

-Derek

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