Vanilla?

Brindle Chase · Dec 11, 2008

I hear this term used alot. I get the impression that it is often used to rate the "spice" level of an erotic story, correct me if I'm wrong.

But what I don't get is if there an actual definition, or, as I have observed, it seems to fluctuate greatly between readers, organizations, publishers, editors and agents?

To me, vanilla would be stereotypical romance novels that actually include the sex scenes, but shy from any details. They are typically male hero bangs wanting heroine where the foreplay is the centerpeice and the missionary finale barely warrants a single sentence of descript.

Non-vanilla would be everything else. IMHO. How about you? What's vanilla to you? Is there an official site that claims they are the end all to this question?

scarletpeaches · Dec 11, 2008

What's vanilla to me, eh?

Um.

I write this post with the codicil that my tastes, while not wild, aren't typical, either.

Vanilla, to me, is heterosexual, lights off, missionary position only. Functional sex, with no added 'spice'.

As to what that 'spice' may be, well...you can wonder about that, or PM me, guys. :e2brows:

When it comes to shying away from details, I don't think that's exactly it. I think vanilla applies to what the characters do as opposed to how you write the way they do it.

I mean, the sex scene I wrote was graphic as all hell (just ask thethinker42 about the effect it had on her. In fact no, ask her husband...) but the sex act itself was pretty run-of-the-mill.

The next chapter, however...

WackAMole · Dec 11, 2008

scarletpeaches said:
Vanilla, to me, is heterosexual, lights off, missionary position only. Functional sex, with no added 'spice'.

Yeah, what she said

scarletpeaches · Dec 11, 2008

WackAMole said:
Yeah, what she said

I hate vanilla, don't you?

Brindle Chase · Dec 11, 2008

scarletpeaches said:
I mean, the sex scene I wrote was graphic as all hell (just ask thethinker42 about the effect it had on her. In fact no, ask her husband...) but the sex act itself was pretty run-of-the-mill.

The next chapter, however...

I totally agree. Run of the mill can be written with ALOT of zest and be searing hot. To me, it doesn't have to include bondage, menage, etc... Missionary only could be spicy... depends on how its written and to me, that's what earns the label "vanilla" or not.

WackAMole · Dec 11, 2008

scarletpeaches said:
I hate vanilla, don't you?

Oh yes, I very much hate vanilla.

scarletpeaches · Dec 11, 2008

When I posted before, I meant the scene I wrote was typically vanilla. Heterosexual and...no, wait, they changed position. And the lights were on.

But anyway...it was kinda tame in comparison to what I could have had them get up to, but it was - again, going by someone else's opinion - shmexay in the extreme because of the way I wrote it.

So the act was vanilla. I hope the writing style wasn't.

By the same token, I could write a gang bang full of bondage, anal, parakeets and chocolate sauce in such a way that it sent you to sleep, so the act would be spicy but the execution...not.

Chapter nineteen, I am really looking forward to writing you...

HeronW · Dec 11, 2008

perfunctory, passionless, and pointless :}

AmandaAcidic · Dec 11, 2008

scarletpeaches said:
When I posted before, I meant the scene I wrote was typically vanilla. Heterosexual and...no, wait, they changed position. And the lights were on.

But anyway...it was kinda tame in comparison to what I could have had them get up to, but it was - again, going by someone else's opinion - shmexay in the extreme because of the way I wrote it.

So the act was vanilla. I hope the writing style wasn't.

By the same token, I could write a gang bang full of bondage, anal, parakeets and chocolate sauce in such a way that it sent you to sleep, so the act would be spicy but the execution...not.

Chapter nineteen, I am really looking forward to writing you...

I officially want to read your stuff

scarletpeaches · Dec 12, 2008

Well...if thethinker42 needs some me-time after reading it, it must be hot.

sunandshadow · Dec 12, 2008

Vanilla is everything that isn't kinky. Het, any position that doesn't require equipment, no audience or threesomes, no anal but oral is probably fine, no spanking, or anything bdsm, they would probably let some mild bondage sneak in there.

thethinker42 · Dec 12, 2008

scarletpeaches said:
Well...if thethinker42 needs some me-time after reading it, it must be hot.

Never happened.

Lies.

ALL LIES.

*goes off to read chapter 18. Again.*

thethinker42 · Dec 12, 2008

Vanilla is definitely subjective. Hetero, minimal kink if any (i.e., a scarf around wrists or a blindfold), no positions that may require physical therapy or paramedics if done wrong, etc.

Personally I don't think there's anything boring about vanilla. In fact, it can be HOT. And the kinkier/crazier stuff can be lame, boring, or worse. Whatever floats your (or your character's) boat.

veinglory · Dec 12, 2008

I don't see it as subjective or particularly derogatory. It is just a word used to mean one man, one woman, sex without any kink or unusual elements--most likely missionary-man-on-top with a focus on direct intercouse.

thethinker42 · Dec 12, 2008

veinglory said:
I don't see it as subjective or particularly derogatory. It is just a word used to mean one man, one woman, sex without any kink or unusual elements--most likely missionary-man-on-top with a focus on direct intercouse.

Definitely not derogatory, but I do think it can be subjective to a certain extent...a swinger would define "vanilla" much differently than a monogamous couple...someone who's into BDSM would define it differently than someone for whom having sex with the lights on is considered wild.

scarletpeaches · Dec 12, 2008

Word.

My last lover was a man in his 30s and I suggested a few things I thought were pretty tame but apparently he and I had different ideas of what was vanilla...

Oh well, his loss.

veinglory · Dec 12, 2008

I still don't think it is subjective. People who do lifestyle or kink know that it would not be described as vanilla. Vanilla is MF penetrative basics, not basics of every scene and person. Or at least that's what it means in submission guidelines.

thethinker42 · Dec 12, 2008

veinglory said:
I still don't think it is subjective. People who do lifestyle or kink know that it would not be described as vanilla. Vanilla is MF penetrative basics, not basics of every scene and person. Or at least that's what it means in submission guidelines.

Fair enough. I do think there are some subjective aspects of it, but in general, I think you're right.

I've known some people (especially in the lifestyle) who think anything that doesn't involve kink or extra people is vanilla, others who have different standards. BUt in general, you're probably right, it's more or less the same across the board.

Mother Raven · Dec 15, 2008

thethinker42 said:
Definitely not derogatory, but I do think it can be subjective to a certain extent...a swinger would define "vanilla" much differently than a monogamous couple...someone who's into BDSM would define it differently than someone for whom having sex with the lights on is considered wild.

As someone fairly familiar with BDSM, I would like to add that Vanilla will usually include sexual intercourse. BDSM is often the main event with no sexual intercourse.

I consider "Bedroom bondage" kinky foreplay and closer to Vanilla than the St.Andrew's cross and flogger in the basement dungeon.

Does that help?

ELMontague · Dec 15, 2008

The curiosity is killing me. What is the St. Andrew's cross and flogger?

ELMontague · Dec 15, 2008

You gotta love the internet. You mean a whipping post and cat of nine tails. Got it. That is more kinky than a little bedroom bondage.

2Wheels · Dec 23, 2008

Vanilla can also (from the lifestyle perspective) refer to an 'equality' of relationship, for lack of a better term. Non-vanilla often utilises the dominant/submissive aspect, that may very well not even include anything sexual. As some have noted, you can't be a dominant if someone won't submit to you, and vice versa, so there is still a kind of equality even then.

Just for you ElMontague, go look up the term "switch"

ELMontague · Dec 23, 2008

nothing but a little fun, eh?

Wayne K · Dec 24, 2008

Mother Raven said:
As someone fairly familiar with BDSM, I would like to add that Vanilla will usually include sexual intercourse. BDSM is often the main event with no sexual intercourse.

I consider "Bedroom bondage" kinky foreplay and closer to Vanilla than the St.Andrew's cross and flogger in the basement dungeon.

Does that help?

yes. And are you single?

Diana W. · Dec 30, 2008

LOL! I was wondering when someone would get around to asking that! :roll:

Vanilla?

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