In your historical era, how would someone prove their identity?

Saint Fool · Dec 7, 2008

Just curious since photography, fingerprinting and ID cards haven't been around that long. I'm thinking that for the majority of human existince, identity would have depended on having some one who could say "yes, I know that person and I'm willing to swear that he is who he says he is." And to be believable, the witness would have been someone who had some position of authority - a priest, school teacher, judge, etc.

Of course, people often carried papers to identify themselves - diplomats, couriers and freed slaves come to mind. Position in society was often its own identification - that's Lord so and so - lives in the big house up on the hill - goes off and sits in Parliament when it's in session. And I suppose a uniform was its own id - looks like a soldier, must be a soldier.

So if your character(s) had to produce proof of identity, what would they use? Or could they do it at all?

Palmfrond · Dec 7, 2008

This is one of the really great things about writing historical novels. Not long ago, it was entirely possible for someone to disappear from one identity and reappear not far away as someone completely different (change clothes, put on a good act, and voila, you're Lord Thisandthat). It makes for very interesting plot devices.

donroc · Dec 7, 2008

No birth certificates in 17th century Spain, but then most did not travel beyond 25 miles of their home town.

Forgeries were common in Spain during the era of the Inquisition to prove one's limpieza de sangre, purity of blood untainted by Jew, Moor, or recent converts. That certificate required two pure-blooded witnesses.

It would have been relatively easy to assume a false name. Sephardic Jews who fled Spain and arrived in the United Provinces had several to as many as many as 15 aliases. They contiued to do business with Spain and Portugal under several names, even serve in the armies, and live in Amsterdam with a Jewish name.

Yes, one is free in HF to have characters assume false identities and be believable.

Williebee · Dec 7, 2008

Proof of identity could come from forged documents, or a forged "vouchsafe" from a person of standing in the community.

Slip into town weeks ahead, find the right person and make a deal, whether it is for money, or because you've convinced them that your cause is just, or at least mutually beneficial. Slip back out.

Come to town later with your claims of identity, and when challenged, call forth your vouchsafe. (I think I used that word correctly.)

Sometimes it happened because your papers gave the word of someone far away, that someone in town trusted. That's basically how banking worked in the early days of the American West.

willfulone · Dec 7, 2008

Scars from battles (if applicable). Beauty beyond compare and talked on (if applicable).
Paintings of people of note. Notarity of person via lore.

There were ways I suppose. Since I write historical fictional romance, I add something to the person (eyes of two colors, etc) that make them unique and memorable to all they come across. Thus, in mine, the proof is not difficult.

Good luck!

Christine

Saint Fool · Dec 7, 2008

This just came to mind - my maternal grandmother and her older sister were middle class Irish Catholic and then the two of them emigrated to the US at the turn of the century. Until one of her grandchildren got into geneology, her six children thought that she was British and High Church Anglican. And no, we haven't a clue as to why that happened.

My main character's x-dressing is aided by a false reference given by someone who believes he is innocent of the crime he's been accused of committing.

funidream · Dec 7, 2008

In reading runaway slave/servant ads from 18th century Colonial America, physical characteristics, personality characteristics and clothing are all descibed in detail.

- large scar in the shape of a half-moon
- has a burned hand
- speaks in stutters
- stoops much in his shoulders, has a surly down look,
- apt to grin when spoken to

In eras when clothes were mostly made to order, difficult and expensive to replace, I can see where they might be useful in determining or identifying a person's station in life. I would be hard to pretend to be Lord Someone or Squire Soandso, without the proper attire.

Inarticulate Babbler · Dec 7, 2008

funidream said:
In reading runaway slave/servant ads from 18th century Colonial America, physical characteristics, personality characteristics and clothing are all descibed in detail.

- large scar in the shape of a half-moon
- has a burned hand
- speaks in stutters
- stoops much in his shoulders, has a surly down look,
- apt to grin when spoken to

In eras when clothes were mostly made to order, difficult and expensive to replace, I can see where they might be useful in determining or identifying a person's station in life. I would be hard to pretend to be Lord Someone or Squire Soandso, without the proper attire.

I'm writing in the American Revolution, about the Continental Marines and Navy, and there's record of a man (Peter M'Tegart) that went AWOL, and his marine captain put out a reward for him in the Philadelphia newspaper. It described what he was wearing, that he was a darker skinned Irishman, his height and the clothes he wore.

MaryMumsy · Dec 7, 2008

Saint Fool said:
This just came to mind - my maternal grandmother and her older sister were middle class Irish Catholic and then the two of them emigrated to the US at the turn of the century. Until one of her grandchildren got into geneology, her six children thought that she was British and High Church Anglican. And no, we haven't a clue as to why that happened.

Most likely because at that time being Irish and/or Catholic were impediments to advancement in society. I'm old enough to remember the brouhaha over John Kennedy being Catholic when he ran for president. They didn't mind too much that he was Irish because he was rich, but being Catholic was regarded with suspicion by a lot of Protestants. In my own family the surname spelling was changed between 1910 and 1920 (based on census records). I think because the name was very German, and there was virulent anti-German sentiment during WWI.

MM

Snowstorm · Dec 7, 2008

Hmm, I'm spinning around writing an historical novel. Great question. Possession of a family bible isn't necessarily PROOF, but some may accept the family tree written in it. Some letters addressed to the bearer. A photo (from mid-1800s or later of course) with the person's name written directly on the plate or on the insert card. None of the may prove the person's identity though, but in past times that might have been sufficient.

tehuti88 · Dec 8, 2008

Most of my characters are from pre-modern times (ancient Egypt and pre- or early-contact American Indian cultures), so basically, the only way they could prove their ID is the way you mentioned, somebody else vouching for them. If somebody were to not have anybody who knows them well left alive, or if they were to have gone missing at an early age and show up again much later when they can't be physically recognized, then it'd be a problem, I assume.

But that's what all-knowing gods and spirits are for!

I'm guessing there could be other, less reliable ways, like seeking old tattoos or scars or distinctive physical markings and such, but that's about it. Oh, that, and familiar resemblance.

OpheliaRevived · Dec 17, 2008

That would depend, of course, on what kind of person we were talking about. An enobled individual could easily prove who he was, while a peasant had little to go on, save testimony.

Doogs · Dec 17, 2008

Also depends on if we're talking about whether the person wants to identify themselves or avoid being identified.

Severian · Dec 17, 2008

I think proving physical prowess in single combat would prove identity fairly well. Conan the Barabarian, for example, could have used that very effectively.

Ariella · Dec 17, 2008

An interesting historical example of identity theft is the sixteenth-century case of Martin Guerre, a French peasant who left his wife for seven years and returned home to discover that another man had taken his identity.

There's also a brand new book out about Giannino di Guccio, a fourteenth-century Tuscan who believed that he had been switched at birth with the crown prince of France. He apparently spent much of his life forging documents and trying to convince various nobles, soldiers and merchants to take him seriously. I haven't read this book yet, but it looks fascinating.

SeaMonster · Dec 29, 2008

By the late eighteenth century, the British did have birth certificates--but they were very easy to forge!

Broadswordbabe · Dec 30, 2008

Seal rings were used to prove that documents came from a certain person/authority from very ancient historical times - possession of a seal ring (or theft of same) could maybe be a way of proving identity - but I should imagine, since they were quite important, they'd be pretty carefully guarded.

Doogs · Dec 30, 2008

Broadswordbabe said:
Seal rings were used to prove that documents came from a certain person/authority from very ancient historical times - possession of a seal ring (or theft of same) could maybe be a way of proving identity - but I should imagine, since they were quite important, they'd be pretty carefully guarded.

Yep. The period I'm writing about - the Second Punic War between Rome and Carthage - actually has an incident where Hannibal uses the signet ring of a slain Roman consul to issue false orders. Didn't work out because the Romans were able to spread word that the consul was dead and any orders bearing his seal were to be ignored.

Of course, what percentage of a population would even have access to/need of a signet ring?

DeleyanLee · Dec 30, 2008

Severian said:
I think proving physical prowess in single combat would prove identity fairly well. Conan the Barabarian, for example, could have used that very effectively.

That's the way that Javert recognizes Val Jean in Les Miserables, FWIW.

I'd think it would also depend on how suspicious the culture was, whether or not proof would be even requested--depending on the situation. Someone shows up in the appropriate attire and says he's something reasonable, some places and eras might not question it. People tend to believe without a reason to suspect, after all.

I'm thinking of the film Sommersby where Richard Gere's character takes the identity of the guy he shared a cell with after the Civil War. It's been years, people's memories fade, and he's definitely not the same man but he gives them reason to ignore that fact and accept him as the man he claims to be. It's a very well done story (though I'll warn people of the bittersweet ending right now).

funidream · Dec 30, 2008

Occupation and requisite skill might be an identifier.

Re: physical characteristics - I think it was in Sommersby, one of the telltale clues pointing to the imposter was the fact that the returned husband's feet were smaller than the form the shoemaker had on file.

Sargentodiaz · Dec 31, 2008

Most common people never traveled far from home so ID wasn't needed.
Upper class on the other side had many sources of identifying themselves such as signet rings mentioned or other heraldic style symbols. Showing their status was very important to them.
Also, remember how King Richard hid himself as a commoner to escapt Prince John. Who looked at or paid attention to commoners other than their family.

Deb Kinnard · Jan 5, 2009

My just-sold novel was set in 1353 England, my WIP is set in 979. By the high Middle Ages, the English used something called the "view of frankpledge" in which local people had to account for their neighbors and their actions. Any stranger would have to call on his frankpledge group to vouch for his identity. In 979 it was a little looser structured but you would still need someone reliable to give oath that they did (or didn't) know you.

VeggieChick · Jan 20, 2009

funidream said:
Occupation and requisite skill might be an identifier.

Re: physical characteristics - I think it was in Sommersby, one of the telltale clues pointing to the imposter was the fact that the returned husband's feet were smaller than the form the shoemaker had on file.

Yes, I was going to mention Sommersby as well. That's a good example of how there were no actual means of proving who somebody was: They accepted him because his wife said it WAS him, and who could know better?

Zelenka · Jan 20, 2009

VeggieChick said:
Yes, I was going to mention Sommersby as well. That's a good example of how there were no actual means of proving who somebody was: They accepted him because his wife said it WAS him, and who could know better?

I've never seen Sommersby but I'd heard it was based on the Martin Guerre case (which was the first thing I thought of for this thread too, though it's not my era or setting...)

HeronW · Jan 20, 2009

For the military/religious--secret passwords, hand signals, badges, tattoos would identify someone but again--can be copied.

In your historical era, how would someone prove their identity?

Saint Fool

Palmfrond

cereal killer

donroc

Historicals and Horror rule

Williebee

Capeless, wingless, & yet I fly.

willfulone

I am a zebra...

Saint Fool

funidream

Inarticulate Babbler

Pissin' Everyone off, 1 at a time

MaryMumsy

the original blond bombshell

Snowstorm

Baby plot bunneh sniffs out a clue

tehuti88

Mackinac Island Fanatic

OpheliaRevived

Real Men Have Gills

Doogs

Severian

Ariella

...

SeaMonster

Broadswordbabe

I'd rather be a cat.

Doogs

DeleyanLee

Writing Anarchist

funidream

Sargentodiaz

Deb Kinnard

VeggieChick

Zelenka

Going home!

HeronW

Down Under Fan