What's the longest you've worked on perfecting a single page?

Nateskate · Oct 23, 2008

Not counting the beginning and the end, which are the two hardest parts of a novel, what's the longest amount of time you've worked on perfecting a single page???

In my case, when I do edits, I edit several pages at a time, but if I can't get the first page right I'll keep coming back to it. And I won't leave until it satisfies me.

I've hit another part of the story where it seems that one out of every five pages requires a hard edit. (Not punctuation or spelling, but reworking)

I'll rewrite it- come back with fresh eyes the next day and find a flaw. I'll rewrite it- come back the next day and something else bothers me, or I'll expand it and realize it needs to have things altered.

It's not writer's block. In fact, some of the end results are more than worth it. Rather, it's kind of like a wrestling match where the page is an unruly opponent, and it's winning. I have to think of a way to do a reverse and to pin it. This is hard work!

The hardest pages have taken me up to two weeks to perfect, maybe more if I kept records.

Clio · Oct 23, 2008

This is so topical for me right now. I have been reworking the first chapter of my WIP. Today, I finally blasted it and now have something readable. But in answer to your question, Nateskate, I can put my hand on my heart and say that Page One has taken me two whole weeks!

I know exactly what you mean about not wanting to move on if something is irking you. I just had to sort that pesky chapter out, and once I did I found that the reworking of Chaps 2, 3 and 4 went like a dream.

Ageless Stranger · Oct 23, 2008

Three weeks. It was one pivotal page and it was hell trying to get it right. I cut it into sections, moved the paragraphs about, played with the words, analysed it until the very sight of it drove me to rage. Then I decided it wasn't really that important and cut it out. The tricks I play on myself. Huh.

kuwisdelu · Oct 23, 2008

Also weeks. Although, I edit as I go, so time spent editing and writing a page are all jumbled up together, so it's hard to tell. Once I'm all done, edits rarely take more than a couple days, but the writing process is full of weeks of editing and rewriting, page by page, paragraph by paragraph, sentence by sentence, word by word.

johnzakour · Oct 23, 2008

No time limits on any pages. Sometimes I don't spend ten minutes on editing a page. Then there are pages on Plutonium Blondie (published in 01) that I still edit (in my mind) when I read them. The thing is you can't let yourself obsess too much or you'll never finish. I guess that's why deadlines were invented to force writers to finally allow their babies to venture out into the world.

kct webber · Oct 23, 2008

I don't think in pages, really, so I have no idea. I think in scenes (which, for me, are usually chapters). But I've spent weeks perfecting a scene--sometimes they are four pages, and sometimes they are fifteen pages.

ChaosTitan · Oct 23, 2008

A few hours, probably, and that's only when the page requires serious rewrites.

Snowbird · Oct 23, 2008

I spent an entire day on my one page introduction.

OremLK · Oct 23, 2008

Getting that intense about the presentation of one small part of your story, I think, is probably more destructive than helpful. I definitely believe you can revise the life out of a passage if you sit there and mess with it too much.

rugcat · Oct 23, 2008

Ageless Stranger said:
Three weeks. It was one pivotal page and it was hell trying to get it right. I cut it into sections, moved the paragraphs about, played with the words, analysed it until the very sight of it drove me to rage. Then I decided it wasn't really that important and cut it out. The tricks I play on myself. Huh.

First page, last page. Especially last page -- that's what you leave the reader with. I've obsessed over every last page i've ever written -- the words have to be just right.

Also, not one page, but with a three or four page scene that's crucial, I've gone over it for hours and hours. There are always a few things in a book that need to be as perfect as you can get them.

Nymtoc · Oct 24, 2008

About six months.

No, I'm not joking.

Feidb · Oct 24, 2008

Not deliberately intended, but so far it's ended up being 14 years and 23 separate edits.

Justin K · Oct 24, 2008

i once spent 4 hours on a sentence, but that included bathroom and food breaks. true story.

tehuti88 · Oct 24, 2008

I think I would drive myself insane if I had to sit there and work on perfecting a page for more than the length of time it takes to write it.

I admit, I'm not normal on this and most people don't try to get it perfect the first time, but if I didn't then I wouldn't be able to keep going. (And I'm not saying my work is PERFECT, just that it's the best *I* can do it.)

I just write the thing, occasionally mulling over how something is going to go or how it should be phrased, then keep going. I should note this is in the writing process and I haven't any idea if it's a "page" or longer or shorter or what, since, as I post my work online, there's no real concept of "pages." Later when I get the time to proofread it, I might mull a bit longer over certain things--for example if I'm unsure of how to spell a foreign word, or if a phrase is truly grammatically correct--then there's the additional time it takes to figure that out, usually by asking someone online or substituting something else if no help is available. Then that's it--unless I find something to correct much later down the line I don't do anything else to it. I'm an obsessive type, and I know I could work on a page forever if I let myself, so I don't.

So I guess the answer is, the longest I spend perfecting a page is about as long as it takes to write a page, however long that is.

Oh. The beginning and ending are usually quite easy for me to write, actually.

It's the middle part near the climax that bugs me!

Telstar · Oct 24, 2008

Nateskate said:
Not counting the beginning and the end, which are the two hardest parts of a novel, what's the longest amount of time you've worked on perfecting a single page???

In my case, when I do edits, I edit several pages at a time, but if I can't get the first page right I'll keep coming back to it. And I won't leave until it satisfies me.

I've hit another part of the story where it seems that one out of every five pages requires a hard edit. (Not punctuation or spelling, but reworking)

I'll rewrite it- come back with fresh eyes the next day and find a flaw. I'll rewrite it- come back the next day and something else bothers me, or I'll expand it and realize it needs to have things altered.

It's not writer's block. In fact, some of the end results are more than worth it. Rather, it's kind of like a wrestling match where the page is an unruly opponent, and it's winning. I have to think of a way to do a reverse and to pin it. This is hard work!

The hardest pages have taken me up to two weeks to perfect, maybe more if I kept records.

Three of four times so far I have had difficulty to complete a passage or a transition or write a scene. That page took me a few hours, often stopped and continued the next day.
I'm a perfectionist but I also know to not overcharge my brain. If I cannot write that damn scene today, I'll take a day break, with walks, movies, reading, etc and get back when I'm again full of creativity.
When it took me really lots of time to finish a page it was during the writing process itself, not during the revision.

In one day, between 1 and 2 hours, I can revise about a dozen book-pages (half in manuscript pagecount), which is my average chapter length.

Besides the beginning, I never had to spend more time.
Now I know that the first chapter will need a new scene or two to portrait something of my MC youth, but that is going to wait for the end of the WIP.

I really hope to not get stuck for more than a couple days for a single page in the second revision...

Phaeal · Oct 24, 2008

Years -- my vow is to never retire a short story or novel unpublished, and so every now and then I'll hit a temporary shelved project and revise it. Recently I revised six short stories I wrote about ten years ago, and three of them have since been accepted. So I say: No statute of limitations on tinkering!

(Yeah, yeah, it wasn't years ON END. When I'm doing a concentrated revision, it can take one-two weeks for a short, one-four months for a novel. No idea of the page rate.)

jgold · Oct 24, 2008

Beginnings are always hard for me, but I usually have endings already written out in my head before I get there.

If there's a scene where I've been spending days--sometimes weeks--that usually means that I've gone off the plot a bit and need to backtrack. It seems to happen once or twice a book, and I end up cutting the whole chapter and starting it over.

There are also times when certain sentences, segments or scenes bother me, but I won't quite know how to fix them until later. I always end up cutting those too, I just need time to get used to the idea.

Nateskate · Oct 24, 2008

johnzakour said:
No time limits on any pages. Sometimes I don't spend ten minutes on editing a page. Then there are pages on Plutonium Blondie (published in 01) that I still edit (in my mind) when I read them. The thing is you can't let yourself obsess too much or you'll never finish. I guess that's why deadlines were invented to force writers to finally allow their babies to venture out into the world.

Lol, that is so true. But I have the luxury in this case that these books were written before I found a publisher. And now I'm working on a few books ahead. But my story changes in the edits, creating a ripple effect. I love the Lord of the Rings, but I never was fond of the interaction of his "salty dog" Orcs. They sounded like salty sailors, and not monsters. I'm shooting for something that our minds can't conceive- someone whose thinking process is foriegn to ours. And to do that, I have to actually formulate motivations, and base their reactions and comments around this.

I find that interactions between the natural and supernatural, the most difficult balance to achieve. I don't want anything to sound like, "Revenge of the Smurfs".

If my Pub demanded book three, it would be a different book altogether. So at some point the edits will stop, and I'll wait for editor feedback. But I so want to get this right. And perhaps because it isn't one book, but a series, getting it right now sets the tone for all that follows.

Nateskate · Oct 24, 2008

Telstar said:
Three of four times so far I have had difficulty to complete a passage or a transition or write a scene. That page took me a few hours, often stopped and continued the next day.
I'm a perfectionist but I also know to not overcharge my brain. If I cannot write that damn scene today, I'll take a day break, with walks, movies, reading, etc and get back when I'm again full of creativity.
When it took me really lots of time to finish a page it was during the writing process itself, not during the revision.

In one day, between 1 and 2 hours, I can revise about a dozen book-pages (half in manuscript pagecount), which is my average chapter length.

Besides the beginning, I never had to spend more time.
Now I know that the first chapter will need a new scene or two to portrait something of my MC youth, but that is going to wait for the end of the WIP.

I really hope to not get stuck for more than a couple days for a single page in the second revision...

I know this happens, where getting stuck is the exception and not the norm, and these are the things which cause me to question whether I'm a natural writer, or simply someone with a story to tell who has stubborn determination to overcome a weakness. Figuring out what works and what is wrong takes too much energy, but that's the only way I know.

There's this realization that great writers can flow without strife, because they are so productive. If they were like me, they'd quit and work at Turkey Hill. (No offense to Turkey Hill- They're mostly lovely people.)

Charlie Horse · Oct 24, 2008

My policy is that if it takes over 30 minutes it just gets cut.

Telstar · Oct 24, 2008

Nateskate said:
I know this happens, where getting stuck is the exception and not the norm, and these are the things which cause me to question whether I'm a natural writer, or simply someone with a story to tell who has stubborn determination to overcome a weakness.

Could it be the story? Not strong enough to make the words flow naturally and effectively?
Did you work with an outline or all improvisation?

I like your threads and I would like to help you

ishtar'sgate · Oct 24, 2008

The only part of the book that gives me grief like that is the very first paragraph. That paragraph will drive me nuts for weeks, even months. After agonizing with it for a week or so, I'll move on but I keep on coming back to it until I'm absolutely satisfied. I could be half way through the book before that happens though. My current wip opens with a lion hunt and it's driving me crazy! I fiddle with it almost every day. One of these times it will be right, but not yet.

Mr Flibble · Oct 24, 2008

Forever.

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Nateskate · Oct 24, 2008

ishtar'sgate said:
The only part of the book that gives me grief like that is the very first paragraph. That paragraph will drive me nuts for weeks, even months. After agonizing with it for a week or so, I'll move on but I keep on coming back to it until I'm absolutely satisfied. I could be half way through the book before that happens though. My current wip opens with a lion hunt and it's driving me crazy! I fiddle with it almost every day. One of these times it will be right, but not yet.

I fretted over openings, because it seemed I'd only get one chance to win an agent, and the opening had to sing.

I'm not sure my first openings weren't good enough, but with so much riding on a small part of the novel, it's easy to perseverate.

What's the longest you've worked on perfecting a single page?

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