Submitting same story to two mags?

Boo Radley · Aug 19, 2008

I know that most all of the submission guidlines I've read so far want something unpublished, one even mensions nothing submitted to another publication.

My question is, is it a good or bad idea to submit the same story to a few magazines that fit the genre and if one of them decides to publish it just let the other magazines know? From the guidlines I've read so far most magazines take at least a couple or few months to get back to you. Thats an aweful long time to wait!

Adam Israel · Aug 19, 2008

This topic's been kicked around a few times, and different people have different philosophies on it.

In my opinion, you should never send the same story to more than one market at the same time unless all of the markets in question explicitly state in their guidelines that they accept simultaneous submissions.

Editors do not want to go to the effort to read a story, consider it, try to find a place for it in their schedule, and offer to publish it, only to find you've sold it elsewhere. That will earn you a black mark on their list forever. And editors talk and share stories like that.

If the markets all accept simultaneous submission and you do, there is an etiquette to follow. Always notify the market immediately if the piece is accepted elsewhere.

If you simultaneously submit against the guidelines, be prepared to live with the consequences. Editors are professionals and the best way to work with them is to be as professional as you can be.

The wait isn't terrible. Yes, months to wait for a rejection feels like a long time. Use the time wisely. Write a new story. Revise an old story. Keep sending them out. Before you know it, a response will come and you can either celebrate or send it back into the wild.

And welcome to AW

This is a wonderful place to learn and grow.

Boo Radley · Aug 19, 2008

StoneTable said:
Editors do not want to go to the effort to read a story, consider it, try to find a place for it in their schedule, and offer to publish it, only to find you've sold it elsewhere.

VERY good point, I never looked at it like that. Thanks!

astonwest · Aug 20, 2008

I've been waiting for 4 months on one of my stories...it is a long time to wait (especially since I have another of my stories waiting in the wings, since it depends on this one selling first), but going against the guidelines, as previously mentioned, is a bad idea.

If the wait time is an issue, check out places like ralan or duotrope and only submit to places who have fast responses...

Phot's Moll · Aug 20, 2008

I would advise you to only send each story to one market at a time. On several occasions, I've not know a story was accepted until I recieved a copy of the mag with my work in. Imagine how popular you'd be if two seperate mags published your story at the same time - neither would ever publish your work again - neither would other mags owned by the same company.

Four months is a long time to wait if you're sat looking at the letter box. While you're waiting to hear, write something else and send that to another publication. Whilst you're waiting to hear from them, write another one ... you get the idea. Once you've got fifty stories out, you only have to wait a day or two between hearing back about one or another of them.

astonwest · Aug 20, 2008

Phot's Moll said:
On several occasions, I've not know a story was accepted until I recieved a copy of the mag with my work in.

You didn't sign a contract?

johnnysannie · Aug 20, 2008

I haven't always signed a contract. In fact, I had no idea that my short story in the recent Country Woman issue had been accepted until I received my comp copies and a check.

Some pubs send out a contract; some don't.

pdr · Aug 20, 2008

Don't

sim sub, but you can multiple sub to different countries. Do it over a period of time so that one story can make the rounds of all the possible markets and plan it so that a sale in one country is followed by a sale in another country the following year. You are avoiding having your story published at the same time!

Adam Israel · Aug 20, 2008

pdr said:
sim sub, but you can multiple sub to different countries. Do it over a period of time so that one story can make the rounds of all the possible markets and plan it so that a sale in one country is followed by a sale in another country the following year. You are avoiding having your story published at the same time!

Unless the market asks for worldwide rights. And this doesn't work if you're submitting for electronic publication.

Phot's Moll · Aug 20, 2008

I've rarely been asked to sign a contract. Some mags ask for an invoice, but more than half just send me a cheque. I always set out the terms I'm offering in my covering letter (eg first British serial rights) so maybe that covers them?

Boo Radley · Aug 20, 2008

Thank You everyone for your responses, and for not flaming me for asking something thats already been covered

geardrops · Aug 20, 2008

StoneTable said:
In my opinion, you should never send the same story to more than one market at the same time unless all of the markets in question explicitly state in their guidelines that they accept simultaneous submissions.

Beyond any other reason listed, I'll just add: It's hard enough to get published. Don't make it harder by being a jerk and thinking the rules don't apply to you.

And anyway, just spend that time you're waiting to hear back on writing the next thing

Keffington · Aug 20, 2008

Yeah, it's been covered earlier in the thread, but:

Don't sim sub (send the story to more than one market at once) unless both markets say it is okay.

If the guidelines say it is okay and you do sim sub, you'll need to keep an even better watch on who has what. Well, you should keep track of that anyway...

http://www.absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=111080 <= This is why I don't think sim subs are a good idea. It's really easy to mess up.

pdr · Aug 20, 2008

Actually...

in response to this comment:
Unless the market asks for worldwide rights. And this doesn't work if you're submitting for electronic publication.

I assume that, when marketing a story, one sells print rights first, then electronic, and finally radio/audio/i-pod.

Even today, when editors have become spoiled with the buyers' market situation they exist in, you can still find print magazines in several countries which will take your work and pay for it.

Once your story is sold to a zine very few print markets will take it except as an exceptional reprint.

Adam Israel · Aug 20, 2008

pdr said:
in response to this comment:
Unless the market asks for worldwide rights. And this doesn't work if you're submitting for electronic publication.

I assume that, when marketing a story, one sells print rights first, then electronic, and finally radio/audio/i-pod.

Even today, when editors have become spoiled with the buyers' market situation they exist in, you can still find print magazines in several countries which will take your work and pay for it.

Once your story is sold to a zine very few print markets will take it except as an exceptional reprint.

It is entirely feasible for a writer to be submitting to electronic or audio markets first. Some writers submit exclusively to these type of markets.

Some print markets may have an international audience and purchase worldwide rights.

The writers I know that have sold stories to foreign markets have done so after the story was the original sale. In fact, some make more money off of all of the reprints than they have from the first publication. It's smart to submit your story to foreign markets after it's been published elsewhere and you have the rights for that country, which I think is what pdr is saying, just not all at the same time (i.e., simultaneously).

astonwest · Aug 21, 2008

Without a contract, what rights are you selling? Honest question...I would think it would get sticky without something to specify exactly what you were giving in exchange for the payment.

Phot's Moll · Aug 22, 2008

If I (or anyone else) offers particular rights for a story and the story is bought then the author has sold the rights offered. If neither the author, nor the purchaser was to specify the rights purchased, then I agree there could be difficulties.

pdr · Aug 22, 2008

Of course!

It is entirely feasible for a writer to be submitting to electronic or audio markets first. Some writers submit exclusively to these type of markets.

But I usually write literary/mainstream/historical and I teach my students, who also write lit/mainstream, to look for paying print markets to sell first rights to in different countries. Then we look for paying print anthology and reprint markets. It's only after we've sold as many print rights as we can that we sell electronic and audio rights.

For us our best markets are the print ones and, yes, we avoid World Rights unless we are getting a nice fat cheque, for we can usually sell most of our stories to several countries.
BUT
we can't do that if our work goes first to an e-zine as then print publishers will only consider the story as a reprint which is a low paying market.

There are many ways of marketing and this is just one. For writers whose main markets would be print - literary journals, university magazines, women's magazines, the general fiction markets - it is a good way to earn money from each story.

Codger · Aug 25, 2008

Exclusivity has an end.

astonwest said:
I've been waiting for 4 months on one of my stories...it is a long time to wait (especially since I have another of my stories waiting in the wings, since it depends on this one selling first), but going against the guidelines, as previously mentioned, is a bad idea.

If the wait time is an issue, check out places like ralan or duotrope and only submit to places who have fast responses...

Why is it assumed that an editor has the exclusive right to your article for months/years without paying you anything? If I haven't heard from them within around 60 days, I consider it to be a rejection, and immediately submit it to another market.

Phot's Moll · Aug 25, 2008

They have the right, because we've sent them stuff. They didn't ask us to do this, yet we expect them to take the time to read it and to reply. In return, I think it's only fair that we try to ensure their time is not wasted on work that we've submitted elsewhere.

If you're referring to work that an editor has asked you to submit, then that would be different and I don't think it would be unreasonable for you to expect a reasonably prompt response.

astonwest · Aug 25, 2008

Codger said:
Why is it assumed that an editor has the exclusive right to your article for months/years without paying you anything? If I haven't heard from them within around 60 days, I consider it to be a rejection, and immediately submit it to another market.

If, on their site, they state that it could take up to 5 months to get a response, and they don't accept simultaneous submissions......

I had a story submitted to an outlet which stated they normally got back with the author in 30 days. So, after 30 days, I considered the piece rejected. Shortly after another outlet accepted the piece, I received an acceptance from the first outlet and had to explain that I'd waited the requisite 30 days and received an acceptance from another outlet.

Not only did I lose out on a higher payment from the first outlet, the next time I submitted a piece to them, they rejected it. I can't say for sure that it had anything to do with a simultaneous submission (even though I'd gone past their self-proclaimed deadline), but I'm sure it didn't make them happy with me.

So, be very careful about submitting to another market when you haven't received a rejection.

geardrops · Aug 25, 2008

astonwest said:
I had a story submitted to an outlet which stated they normally got back with the author in 30 days. So, after 30 days, I considered the piece rejected. Shortly after another outlet accepted the piece, I received an acceptance from the first outlet and had to explain that I'd waited the requisite 30 days and received an acceptance from another outlet.

I believe it's okay to bug a market about your submission after their self-proclaimed deadline. At least, it's what I'd do.

Adam Israel · Aug 25, 2008

The rule of thumb I've read and follow is to query after their published deadline has passed twice. In other words, if they say 30 days, I'd query after 60.

As an aside, I really prefer electronic markets that acknowledge receipt of submission. The worst feeling, besides waiting, is not knowing if your submission actually arrived. I've been bit by this once. The submission went to the wrong address, the spam filters ate the bounce message and I didn't find out until after the deadline is closed.

eqb · Aug 26, 2008

astonwest said:
I had a story submitted to an outlet which stated they normally got back with the author in 30 days. So, after 30 days, I considered the piece rejected. Shortly after another outlet accepted the piece, I received an acceptance from the first outlet and had to explain that I'd waited the requisite 30 days and received an acceptance from another outlet.

*Always* send a withdrawal letter in a case like that. It takes very little time, and it prevents misunderstandings.

Phot's Moll · Aug 26, 2008

I always query politely when I've waited either for the amount of time they state (if they do) or if I've waited longer than they usually take (if it's a market I regularly sub too) or after six months. If they don't reply to the query, which can happen, I contact them again saying I'm assuming the work has not been accepted and I'll submit elsewhere.

Submitting same story to two mags?

Boo Radley

Adam Israel

Formerly known as StoneTable

Boo Radley

astonwest

2 WIP? A glutton for punishment

Phot's Moll

astonwest

2 WIP? A glutton for punishment

johnnysannie

pdr

Adam Israel

Formerly known as StoneTable

Phot's Moll

Boo Radley

geardrops

Good thing I like my day job

Keffington

Kiss me, I'm a prince!

pdr

Adam Israel

Formerly known as StoneTable

astonwest

2 WIP? A glutton for punishment

Phot's Moll

pdr

Codger

Phot's Moll

astonwest

2 WIP? A glutton for punishment

geardrops

Good thing I like my day job

Adam Israel

Formerly known as StoneTable

eqb

I write novels

Phot's Moll