'Genuine' Christianity

I always think about James 3:13 & 17

13Who is wise and understanding among you? Let him show it by his good life, by deeds done in the humility that comes from wisdom.

17But the wisdom that comes from heaven is first of all pure; then peace-loving, considerate, submissive, full of mercy and good fruit, impartial and sincere.

I think of Dorothy Day.

In this case, I require a basis for comparison. The only one who could fill that requirement is Jesus. I do not believe anyone comes close and as a result, I think we are all wannabes at best.

Sincerely,
Gehanna

This is easy for me.

A lovely woman who survived the convent with me (and joined another Order eventually) has been living in a trailer and working with the poorest down in El Paso for 20 years, helping them with an education, get health care, running water, electricity.

The pastor of the church across the street from me. His church collects clothes and food for the poor, and church members queue up to the church door every Saturday, load their cars, and drive the goods to people who need them. His policy is open--we have a running dialogue where he keeps inviting me to come over on a Sunday and I keep telling him church gives me flashbacks. Yet he's always around to talk, or pray for people, and always sets the example of being Jesus to the neighborhood, city, county.


I'm an opinionated broad (yes, really!) and I've been preached at all my life and have zero use for it. Put up or shut up. People like these two friends are (in my opinionated opinion) what Christianity is all about.

Gehanna said:

In this case, I require a basis for comparison. The only one who could fill that requirement is Jesus. I do not believe anyone comes close and as a result, I think we are all wannabes at best.

Sincerely,
Gehanna

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I agree, but we must consider the definition of the word "Christian", Christ like. Even though we can never really reach our goal, the effort to be Christ like should be on-going.

That phrase makes me think of James 1:27 - "Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world."

And what you said about living by the word brought Matthew 7:21 to mind: "'Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.'"

Appalachian Writer said:

I agree, but we must consider the definition of the word "Christian", Christ like. Even though we can never really reach our goal, the effort to be Christ like should be on-going.

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I agree more with you than with myself because what I wrote came out backwards or in this case, backwords. I am glad you made this post to help me get my quirk under control.

Sincerely,
Gehanna

This is an interesting topic. Part of me wants to agree that the "genuine" Christian is the one who lives what they preach. In one sense, that's true--that's the goal. But to me, a genuine Christian is also one who fails at times, someone in process ("for we are His workmanship..."). Christians will still sin, but the difference usually is, that sin will be accompanied by great remorse, and a desire to repent and reclaim that sense of close fellowship (like Peter, when he denied Christ). They have that conviction of the Holy Spirit within that keeps speaking to them and keeps refining them.

A Christian, to me, is in a child/Father relationship with God, made possible by the grace of Christ and the work of the cross:

"1How great is the love the Father has lavished on us, that we should be called children of God! And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him. 2Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when he appears,we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is" (I John 3:1-2, NIV).

As such, he is 'growing' in relationship all his life:

"9For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10but when perfection comes, the imperfect disappears. 11When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put childish ways behind me. 12Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known" (1 Cor.13:9-12, NIV).

This reminds me of Pilgrim's Progress (John Bunyan); we're in a lifetime process of becoming more Christ-like as we submit to the work of the Holy Spirit in our lives.

Appalachian Writer said:

I agree, but we must consider the definition of the word "Christian", Christ like. Even though we can never really reach our goal, the effort to be Christ like should be on-going.

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Our pastor had some interesting thoughts on this last Sunday. In one sense we already are Christ-like, not because we are already 'perfect', but because we've been 'made righteous' (our sins covered by Christ's blood), and yet in another sense there is that practical living out of that 'imputed' righteousness. He was talking about that verse, "Be holy, as I am holy." God wouldn't give us an impossible command--and yet none of us by our actions on this earth are ever going to reach holy perfection. But the reason God could say that was because He gives us His holiness--in other words, judicially He 'counts us' as holy because of that faith in Christ. Instead of our sin, He sees the blood of the Lamb.

Very interesting question and responses. Some thing I think a lot about in the last few years as life has shaped my faith in new ways and yet I find myself returning to my first real stirrings of faith - the way it was when it was new. Simple, less cluttered more action, less words.

To me a genuine Christian is a radical, not one who tries to live by rules but one who dares to put God first and the call of Jesus to love others next. Loving people, not just the ones like yourself but all of them, is one of the most radical (and difficult!) things a person can do.

I see so little love in the portrayal (and sadly in the practice of Christianity) today.

annie jones
ps - have always felt it was my call in life to be a 'voice for the voiceless" first as a social worker and a mom of a disabled child and now as a writer - one of the voiceless in that case is the kind of Christian I know and try to be - not a goody two shoes but a person of faith people would want to know

I believe we might not be able to spot genuine Christians if we do run across one. Most of their "walking the talk" is done where nobody but the recipient can see. I think, though, that what they do will inevitably shine out of their personality.

I've known two people like this. One was my grand-dad, who with my grandma told me the truth about Jesus Christ. She strived for the goal, but he lived it. I never met a single person who didn't love my grand-dad.

My take.

When I think of a Genuine Christian, oddly enough I think of King David. He is called "a man after God's own heart". How could this be? He was an adulter and a murderer. Surely God must hold him in contempt...but He didn't. Why? Because when David was finally confronted with his sin, his repentance was genuine. God saw into David's heart and knew that David earnestly sought Him.

A genuine Christian isn't perfect. A genuine Christian earnestly seeks to be like Christ.

This all reminds me of something I heard once: "Being a Christian doesn't make you better, it just makes you better off."

Pat~ said:

Our pastor had some interesting thoughts on this last Sunday. In one sense we already are Christ-like, not because we are already 'perfect', but because we've been 'made righteous' (our sins covered by Christ's blood), and yet in another sense there is that practical living out of that 'imputed' righteousness. He was talking about that verse, "Be holy, as I am holy." God wouldn't give us an impossible command--and yet none of us by our actions on this earth are ever going to reach holy perfection. But the reason God could say that was because He gives us His holiness--in other words, judicially He 'counts us' as holy because of that faith in Christ. Instead of our sin, He sees the blood of the Lamb.

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Beautifully put. Thank you.

A bit late to the question but it certainly got me thinking. What is a GENUINE Christian? A Christian is one who belongs to Christ and His disciples or followers were called Christians. It occurred to me that who I consider to be a genuine or true Christian doesn't matter a whole lot but rather it is important who Jesus says is a genuine Christian, or His follower.
"IF ye continue in my word, THEN are ye my disciples indeed;" (John 8:31)
"By this shall all men KNOW that ye are my disciples, IF ye have love one to another." (John 13:35)
"If a man love me, he WILL KEEP my words;" (John l4:23a)
"THIS is my commandment, That ye love one another as I have loved you." (John 15:12)
I Corinthians 13 defines real love and how it operates.
In the end, I think a genuine Christian is one who is marked by love - love for the Lord in keeping His Word and love for others by exhibiting the behaviour shown in I Cor. 13.
Thanks for the question. It was good to think about it and consider how I measure up.
Linnea

Balance

The natural and the supernatural share an interesting commonalty (understandably, as they have the same Author), which is balance. In Christianity, the poles seem to pull knowledge/belief against faith/action (as, I think, the great posts above illustrate). Balance is lost when we favor one at the expense of the other, whether as a reaction from personal anecdotal experience or biased teaching. When the pendulum hovers off center, the clock doesn't work very well.

The importance of knowledge of who Christ is (and therefore who we are as His adherents/co-heirs/brethren in the Body) as a crucial aspect of our maturation process (sanctification, if you will) is brought out really well by Peter...

2 Peter 1:3-8 - His divine power has granted to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of him who called us to his own glory and excellence, by which he has granted to us his precious and very great promises, so that through them you may become partakers of the divine nature, having escaped from the corruption that is in the world because of sinful desire. For this very reason, make every effort to supplement your faith with virtue, and virtue with knowledge, and knowledge with self-control, and self-control with steadfastness, and steadfastness with godliness, and godliness with brotherly affection, and brotherly affection with love. For if these qualities are yours and are increasing, they keep you from being ineffective or unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.

...but which we are then cautioned to keep in perspective by the writer of Hebrews.


Hebrews 4:1-2 - Let us fear therefore, lest haply, a promise being left of entering into his rest, any one of you should seem to have come short of it. For indeed we have had good tidings preached unto us, even as also they: but the word of hearing did not profit them, because it was not united by faith with them that heard.

To this aspect of knowledge leading to belief leading to salvation, Paul writes to the Romans:

Romans 10:8-15 - But what does it say? "THE WORD IS NEAR YOU, IN YOUR MOUTH AND IN YOUR HEART"--that is, the word of faith which we are preaching, that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation. For the Scripture says, "WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED." For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him; for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED." How then will they call on Him in whom they have not believed? How will they believe in Him whom they have not heard? And how will they hear without a preacher? How will they preach unless they are sent? Just as it is written, "HOW BEAUTIFUL ARE THE FEET OF THOSE WHO BRING GOOD NEWS OF GOOD THINGS!"

The problem comes in--and the clock remains unbalanced--when we stop our research at this point and conclude that knowledge/belief must be the longest pole in the tent.

But we can err in the other direction, too. Faith/action are also indispensable to our Christianity--and no, I promise I won't paste in the whole book of James--but they, too, must remain in balance lest we lose sight of the reason they're important in the first place. The extreme of ineffectual works is unnervingly portrayed in Christ's own words:

Matt. 7:22-23 - "Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?' And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.'

Being a spiritual bookworm and/or cloistering ourselves within the midst of like-minded believers at the expense of showing Christ's love to a largely unbelieving world is ineffectual faith (if, indeed, it can even be called faith); however, avoiding instruction/fellowship in the faith and/or forsaking the accumulation of our knowledge/understanding of Christ keeps us in the milk and out of the meat. Neither of these conditions can be supported by the totality of Scripture.

Do what you know, but know what you do.

Oh, Bruce, good post--and it reminded me of a question I once heard my pastor ask: "Did Jesus live a 'balanced' life?" Hopefully this isn't straying too far off topic...but it's a topic that fascinates me. Jesus didn't live by a 'schedule'--like so many monks of old, or like even some of us might aim for, in an attempt to live a 'balanced Christian life.' I find great comfort in this, in fact--as I've failed miserably in various attempts to set up artificial constraints for including all of the spiritual disciplines in my life. Jesus' life was ultimately 'in balance' not because He evenly divided His time between teaching, miracle-working, and prayer. The Bible even mentions a few times where He spent "all night" in prayer. Other times, He woke up in the mornings for prayer on a mountain top. Some times, He taught crowds all day; other times He got in a boat with the disciples to get away from them. Yet we know from scripture that that 'balance' between faith and works is healthy, necessary, and good, and we also know that Jesus still epitomized this perfection for us--so how do we adopt His walk for our own?

The pastor that asked this question a few years ago later got an email response from me (we're also good friends), and though I no longer have that response, I'll try to sum it up here. This pastor knew that I happened to be an avid figure-skater, so I wrote my response about "the balanced Christian life" using this analogy:

One of the more fun things to do in skating is something called a fast scratch-spin. It's called that because, when executed well, it's a blur, and always leaves a tracing of concentric circles on the ice, one on top of another. There are certain dynamics involved in doing this well, and obviously, balance is one key factor. But there are other things that contribute to that balance, that can either lead to a top-notch, perfectly balanced scratch-spin, or...not. Here's the set up:

First, the skater builds up a bit of speed traveling in a curved, backward direction, with the weight on the inside edge of the right skating foot. Next, there is a decisive change--the skater switches all the weight to the left foot, and pointing it directly toward the center of the 'circle' path, skates forward putting all her weight on a deeply bent knee, grabbing the ice with the left toe, and settling back onto the ball of the foot--a 'sweet spot' place. At the same time, the right leg is swung around and the centrifugal force of that action begins the spinning motion.

Now, that sweet spot is critical--if your balance is too far forward or backward on the spinning blade, the spin will spiral out, leaving a tell-tale corkscrew pattern on the ice. (This doesn't look pretty, and also receives poor marks from the judges. ) So, *before* straightening the left leg back up and actually doing the spin, the skater has to find that perfect sense of balance while simultaneously swinging the free leg around--and only after that 'spot' is found can she straighten up the left leg, and then apply all her isometric strength and force to pull the arms and free leg in tightly. If she starts to apply force in the spin too soon--before establishing that perfect balance--it'll cause the spin to wobble and spiral out. The spin then can never take full advantage of the centrifugal force, and its power just fizzles out.

Here's the application (at least how I see it)...that 'sweet spot' of balance is analogous to doing and being in the perfect will of the Father. That was the essence of the beauty of Jesus' life, no matter what variables a day might hold. (John 14:31; 12:49-50; 10:37-38; 8:28-29; 6:38; 7:16). Doing the will of the Father at any moment in time involves a radical change of direction--(from following my own instincts, to a 'shift', where I commit all my weight to the opposite leg, a deeply bent 'knee of faith', pointing my course toward the Center). But that's just the set up. I will discover that I actually cannot produce anything of worth until I find that 'sweet spot'--that place in His will where I am precisely supposed to be. Only once I am certain of being there, will my human efforts, enabled and empowered by the 'force' of the Spirit be correctly balanced and so bring the desired result--that perfectly balanced result that perfectly traces one circle upon another, so that the tracing on the ice actually just looks like one thick circle...the perfect union of will. That union was the source of the communion of will that directed His life--and it was also the result of a life lived in that spiritual 'balance.'

So, yes, I believe Christ led the perfectly 'balanced' life--in that it was always centered perfectly in God's will, regardless of whether one day had more 'works' or one day had more 'prayer.' The evidence we see for that is His life's tracings, which always showed that oneness with the Father's will.

Pat, ever think about trying to get your thoughts together in a devotional book and seeking publication with them.

That would mean NOT LOSING any of them, hint hint.

Oh, and you rock. Of course.

I love the writings of Anne Lemmott. She's a fully imperfect Christian, doing what she can as a Christian and admitting to what she's done. Mother Theresa was also quite the Christian, choosing to live in absolute poverty in service to the neediest.

Pat, ever think about trying to get your thoughts together in a devotional book and seeking publication with them.

That would mean NOT LOSING any of them, hint hint.

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I Lily.

Well, I guess I'd need to find out if that was in His 'perfect will' or not, huh? (I'll pray about it. Sometimes I think I have too many options pinging around in my head at any given time. It's hard to get that firm grip of knowing which one to go after...)

You're too sweet to me. If you need a copyeditor, call me.

callalily61 said:

You're too sweet to me. If you need a copyeditor, call me.

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You're on.

*saves post for posterity*

soleary said:

I love the writings of Anne Lemmott. She's a fully imperfect Christian, doing what she can as a Christian and admitting to what she's done. Mother Theresa was also quite the Christian, choosing to live in absolute poverty in service to the neediest.

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Anne Lamott's (sp?) writings crack me up.

And of course Mother Teresa did a great service to society. But IF her life was exemplary, I believe it was not because of a generalized dedication to good works, but because her daily focus, her daily moment-by-moment "food" was to "do the will of Him who sent me, and finish His work." (Jesus' focus and claim, in John 4:34).