A fistful of anonymous supporting characters

[dpaterso]

Here's the deal: I've got a small group of people travelling together on a bus. But the bus has to stop, it can't go on, so most of the passengers decide to get out and walk (others prefer to wait to be rescued). There's no good reason for them to introduce themselves by name, not yet, they're strangers who happen to be walking in the same direction, that's all. The only named character is the protagonist, Marty.

As conversation slowly begins to trickle between them, the other characters are briefly introduced via Marty's POV, e.g.

"Sounds sensible enough," the man beside Marty said. He had a voice like gravel.

...and thereafter this guy is referred to by this label,

"Well, what stopped them?" the man with the gravel voice said. "There's plenty of room."

Another example,

One of the women who'd decided to walk into town with them said, "Oh my God, what's happened?" Marty thought she might be around twenty, short hair with blonde streaks, smartly dressed, wedding ring.

...and thereafter,

"Who's that?" the blonde woman said.

So far so awful. The problem is... or might be... that this goes on for some time. The man with the gravel voice does this, the blonde woman does this, the woman in the tweed coat does that, the man in the blue track suit jacket does this, the bus driver does that, the office clerk with the loud tie does this, the man with the gravel voice says this, the blonde woman does that...

It's unlikely that any of these characters would have the need or desire to introduce themselves by name in the opening chapter, doing so would sound unnatural and contrived. I'm wondering how long you think you could stand this before it becomes too much? Assuming that it does.

-Derek

[TheIT]

If Marty is the POV character, think of it through his eyes. When would it be logical for the people in this situation to introduce themselves? If he's trying to sort the people out in his own mind, maybe he dubs them with nicknames like Gravel Voice or Blonde Lady until they finally become people to him and not labels.

[dpaterso]

That was my first thought! Tried it but didn't much like it -- the story began to sound like a Noir thriller, which it ain't. :) Not saying I won't go back to it. Just saying I didn't much like it.

-Derek

[TheIT]

Perhaps only the standout characters could end up with nicknames. If there are people in this group who will become important, perhaps draw some attention to them by having Marty notice more details or deciding on a nickname. Let the rest of the characters fade into the background.

If the anonymity went on for a chapter or so, I don't think I'd mind, but after a few chapters I think I'd be bothered. If these people are in some sort of emergency situation, it might make sense for them to introduce themselves, however briefly. I know I feel uncomfortable working with someone if I don't know a name.

[tehuti88]

I wouldn't have a problem with it, as long as the descriptive names given to the anonymous characters are distinctive enough (and it looks like they are) and not too complicated (I'd first introduce the one guy as "the man in the blue track suit jacket," but afterward maybe shorten it to "the man in the blue jacket" or "the blue-jacket guy," for example).

[Soccer Mom]

If I spend more than 10 minutes with someone, I'm probably going to at least give them my first name. If they will be there for an entire scene (more than a couple pages) it would really start to grate. Especially if there is a lot of dialogue. Any convenient reason for them to exchange names?

[Use Her Name]

Why not, "Hi, Chuck, pleased to meet you," the man with the gravely voice held out his hand. Chuck was tall, thin, he looked like the Scarecrow from the Wizard of Oz, plaid shirt and all, and I immediately felt a kind of home sickness when I saw him. "Karrie, likewise," the woman with blond streaks said, hitching up her trousers. She looked as though she had lost weight quickly... She held out her hand with the strength of an arm wrestler, and yet, she seemed to be ... The whole idea of a moving "focus" really is important in a crowd scene. Bring out details. I tell you, go to any crowded place or building where people wait, like the unemployment agency, the DMV, bus stations, (airports you can't use any more I guess) and watch, and jot down notes. A crowd scene with several (4-5) very concentrated studies, or sketches of people will always feel more interesting than just a homogeneous sea of faces. Photographers do this, movie directors do this, and it is a standard and very welcomed device in fiction.

[DWSTXS]

If Marty is the POV character, think of it through his eyes. When would it be logical for the people in this situation to introduce themselves? If he's trying to sort the people out in his own mind, maybe he dubs them with nicknames like Gravel Voice or Blonde Lady until they finally become people to him and not labels.

I like this. I've seen it done exactly like this in some novels I've read.

[JoNightshade]

I like giving "nicknames" like Gravel Voice. But if you're opposed to that, what I do is just establish that there are a bunch of people, and then have the MC relate to one or two. Not everyone has to talk, and you can probably accomplish the same thing by just using one or two characters rather than everyone in the group. So, for example.

"I'm so tired," said someone in the back. There was a chorus of agreement.
"No kidding," added the guy on Marty's left. His voice was gravelly and he carried a blue suitcase.
Marty made eye contact and smiled. "I'm Marty."
"George. Nice to meet you."

Now from this point on, all major commentary is made by either Mary or George. If there are things like people just exclaiming, they go as follows:

"Oh my gosh!" said a blonde woman. She was standing over the ditch on the side of the road, shaking.
"What is it?" someone else asked.
"Holy crap!"
Marty and George looked at each other, then began to run.

I had to deal with this issue because my MC is a teacher with 6 classrooms full of kids, and obviously I didn't want to name and describe them all. He ends up interacting with 3 of them in a major way, and then I had 4 others who were named over the course of the book. The rest are unnamed.

[John Paton]

I hate it.

However do not use the names Beauregard Bo Decker or Cherie ;) on any account !

Personally I like names for characters - can Marty look at a luggage tag of the blonde (there is a blonde isn't there?) and make a comment about her destination. He can also throw in her name in a slighty flirty way as well. OK it is contrived.

I would find it difficult to empathise with 'gravelly voice' but Pete might tweak me.

Let us know your solution and good luck DP.

[dpaterso]

Thanks all for your thoughts.

So, from what everyone's saying, it looks as if there's no organic, natural solution. :D

We spend ages fiddling with character dialogue so it sounds natural, but when it comes to character intros we have to employ unnatural devices. :D

For what it's worth, these characters are "local" -- the story's set in the UK, where strangers forced together by circumstance for what they pray is a short period of time are much less likely to say, "Hi, I'm xxx," or even smile at each other in case people think they're gay or on drugs. Sounds wildly stereotypical, but that's the social behavior pattern. It doesn't help that Marty's an outcast, a rebel teen with tats and piercings.

Anyways, ignore my yapping, something's gotta change. I'm gonna re-read those replies and mull it over and apply a fix before things get too out of control. Thanks again. :)

-Derek

[Sophia]

If I were in Marty's situation, I would say something innocuous to the person walking nearest to me, because I would feel it was drawing more attention to myself to keep up the "no communication with anyone" norm (which I think is a UK thing, not a me thing) in these unusual circumstances. I wouldn't give names, though, and would be taken aback if someone offered theirs at all if it was assumed we wouldn't be seeing each other again after that event. In your story, I'd have to have it be told through Marty's POV, and to concentrate on one person at a time instead of having his attention wander around all over the place. He could just be aware of the gravel-voiced man at first and be thinking about the best way to keep up that conversation, and then only if someone else says something important to the story, then he could be aware of that. I'd also only call the character the gravel-voiced man once or twice, and use distinctive speech patterns to make it clear when he says something.

(I tried to give a stupid example but couldn't come up with anything useful - if you don't end up with something you like, could you post a sample continuous snippet?)

Saying that, I don't think the style you have is awful in itself, but the choice of descriptors for the various characters would have to be more specific to Marty's personality to keep me hooked for a long section. "... around twenty, short hair with blonde streaks, smartly dressed, wedding ring" feels a little too generic. Seeing as we're in his POV, you could have him be shocking, more 'true' to himself with his tags. Revealing descriptors from his POV would have me reading that scene just to hear more of how he sees the people around him. Especially if those descriptors change subtly with his mood and perception of these people as the scene advances.

[Alice.S]

It's unlikely that any of these characters would have the need or desire to introduce themselves by name in the opening chapter, doing so would sound unnatural and contrived. I'm wondering how long you think you could stand this before it becomes too much? Assuming that it does.



-Derek





I think I could stand it...I mean through out the whole of the lemony snicket seires Count Olaf's associates where known as: Hook-handed man, The bald man with the long nose, The wart-faced man, The one who looks like neither a man nor a woman,two white-faced women, man with a beard but no hair and the woman with hair but no beard

[Bing Zabriskie]

I like the idea of using nicknames. In some situations real names can be hard to know.

I'm writing a shortie where the MC is one of the hostages held by 3 gunmen, all are important chars and there are a lot of interactions among them, but they don't say, "Hi, I'm John Dole. What's your name?" So I've been calling them the bald guy, the beefy guy (who turns out to be a former marine, so I also call him a marine or a soldier) and the Hispanic (who eventually gets a name because he talks too much and I get sick of the dull referral.)

I also have a silly idea about nicknaming. Sometimes you can relate a person to how you sense them--the fat guy, the busty woman, the husky voiced girl, the stinky smelled dork...

I'm not sure if it's a good idea to relate a char with the MC's imagination. For example... the moaning woman has a look resembling Mona Lisa, and John starts to call her Moana Lisa in his heart. The hairy guy's laughs reminds John of his dog Goofy... [Next time hairy guy talks:] "I need water," says Goofy. [Until he is actually given a name or dies from licking dirt.]

[dpaterso]

Thanks for these additional thoughts, I was flipping coins and banging my head off the keyboard today trying to figure what's best. I'm OK with nicknames depending on genre and setting, they don't really fit this piece too well but if that's how it has to be, that's how it has to be. And/or perhaps I'll try to zone in on a more exaggerated, amusing insult voice for Marty when describing strangers in his head, but without making him appear too dislikeable (could be a cumulative effect). Workin' on it. Don't want to bore anyone by posting a sample. It's still too first pass-ish.

-Derek

[Maryn]

Derek, if the nicknames are making you uncomfortable, you might find it lessens if you can arrive at a one-word nickname, which may seem less contrived when it's repeated. So perhaps the first time we meet the dude with the gravelly voice, your POV character can think of him as Gravel Voice, but after that, just as Gravel.

Nicknames are also easier to swallow if they stereotype by more than just looks and sounds, for at least some of the characters. You might have Gravel, Blonde, Businessman, Housewife, Wanna-Be Rock Star (who becomes Wanna-be), Techno, Plump Student, and so on, all neatly slotted according to the character's biases.

Maryn, who uses such devices fairly regularly

[melaniehoo]

dpaterso - I'm having this exact same problem! I'm so glad you brought this up because I was annoying myself with "the first man", "the scrawny man", etc. I have the added problem that my MC has no interest in befriending most of these extra people, but he's forced to interact with them.

I like the nickname idea based on physical characteristics and plan to steal your advice. :D

Good luck!

[dpaterso]

Maryn, who uses such devices fairly regularly
So you admit they're devices! :D

I want things to be natural! Naaaatuuuuurraaaaaaal I tells you!

Unfortunately, natural ain't working. Drat and double drat.

I like the nickname idea based on physical characteristics and plan to steal your advice. :D
But if everyone uses this trick, life's gonna get a little boring, no? :) Hence my ill-fated quest to find something that perhaps lies in the gray space between natural and device. :D

Heck, killing 'em off as quickly as possible may be a better solution! Ponder mode. Meanwhile the story continues, for better or for worse.

Thanks all, brain cells are buzzing.

-Derek

[Sophia]

I was trying to find examples that might help. One book I remembered as having an early scene with several unnamed characters is Gardens of the Moon by Steven Erikson: there, the characters around the POV character (herself, an unnamed girl) are referred to as "the old woman", "the other man", "this one". The book is fantasy. The tags seemed to fit as they worked well with the girl's character -- a fishergirl, presumably uneducated, young, with a limited knowledge of people beyond her class level. Would that fit what you think of as 'natural'?

[JJ Cooper]

Why not have one really annoying 'happy chappy' circling around the bunch introducing himself/herself to everybody. That way you get all of the names without the MC asking. It may give an insight into some personality traits through their responses, or non-responses. Those who ignore him/her could get short nicknames to mix it up a bit.

Besides, it may be fun killing off the annoying one later in the book.

JJ

[dpaterso]

Thanks Sophia, good stuff, and veering towards natural which is what I'd prefer (tho' I accept I might not achieve this 100%).

Damn JJ you hit the target there, I'd been thinking about an "organizer" type (I used to work with a guy who... never mind, gah the memories) -- a mouthy me-me-me who won't shut up, who insists on taking charge and telling everyone what he thinks they should do. That one outspoken pain-in-the-ass character in the group could pull info (unwillingly) out of the others. Readers would cheer when he met his fate!

Writing to do!

-Derek

[seun]

If Marty is the POV character, think of it through his eyes. When would it be logical for the people in this situation to introduce themselves? If he's trying to sort the people out in his own mind, maybe he dubs them with nicknames like Gravel Voice or Blonde Lady until they finally become people to him and not labels.

I like this approcach if names aren't going to be used immediately. One potential drawback is it's a quite a Stephen King thing to do. If done badly, it could look like a rip off.

[poetinahat]

No comment here. I just think this completely excellent thread title should remain at the top of the New Posts page.

*bumpdabumpiddybump*

[melaniehoo]

But if everyone uses this trick, life's gonna get a little boring, no? :) Hence my ill-fated quest to find something that perhaps lies in the gray space between natural and device. :D

Heck, killing 'em off as quickly as possible may be a better solution! Ponder mode. Meanwhile the story continues, for better or for worse.

Thanks all, brain cells are buzzing.

-Derek

I do plan to kill of a few, but even they will need some sort of identifying name or tag. My problem is most of the extra characters are scrawny Mexican men. They ALL have dark hair, dark skin and dark eyes, lol.

[James81]

"Sounds sensible enough," the man beside Marty said. He had a voice like gravel.



First off, a comment. This is telling and not really showing, right? Show us how this man's voice is "like gravel".

For instance:

"Sounds sensible enough," the man beside Marty said, his voice raspy and gritty.

That's terrible, but it's all I can think of. The point is that it's telling.

I would also ask myself if the phrase "sounds sensible enough" is really moving the dialogue forward, or could a nod of his head or some bodily action show us that he understands and seems to agree.

As for struggling to establish names, you could introduce them while on the bus. Marty could be sitting on the bus, looking out the window and hearing the conversations between the people you want to use later, and have their names come out in the dialogue.

[MelodyO]

Holy moly, I was going to post about this very topic today! Great minds, synchronicity, and all like that there. :)

My problem is my secondary character has kidnapped my MCs. Under no circumstances is he going to introduce himself. So far I've called him the Italian, the kidnapper, their captor, and the goon. Now I'm just calling him "him". Greeeaaaat. I can't find a descriptor I like, and it's worse because it's just him rather than a group that needs to be differentiated. SIGH. I like the idea of a nickname, though, and my POV MC is snarky as heck, so she should be able to think of something suitably scathing.

[melaniehoo]

Holy moly, I was going to post about this very topic today! Great minds, synchronicity, and all like that there. :)

My problem is my secondary character has kidnapped my MCs. Under no circumstances is he going to introduce himself. So far I've called him the Italian, the kidnapper, their captor, and the goon. Now I'm just calling him "him". Greeeaaaat. I can't find a descriptor I like, and it's worse because it's just him rather than a group that needs to be differentiated. SIGH. I like the idea of a nickname, though, and my POV MC is snarky as heck, so she should be able to think of something suitably scathing.

I like the Italian. :)