Hey guys, Can I bounce a question off you? I'm struggling with a manuscript for a YA novel-- I'm on a third draft but I've made major changes each time and it is still pretty rough and undecided. I've gone from third person, two different POV's, to first person, one POV. Then I decided that I did need the second POV after all but... Okay. Take two. I'll try to explain my current dilemma. My two MC's are mother and daughter. The story is mainly about events in the daughter's life, but these events are linked to some unresolved issues and past events in the mother's life. I'd like to include some of the mother's story, but I'd rather have this as scenes than relayed in conversation. I've considered an old diary etc but it is such a cliche (though I know it has been used beautifully by some writers). Right now, I have brief sections from the mother's POV interwoven with longer chapters from the daughter's. Both are first person-- which may be confusing, I'm not sure. The story about the mother's past is gradually revealed to the reader, but not the daughter-- she only finds out in a conversation with her mother which takes place near the end of the book. Any thoughts on how to make this work in terms of structure? Potential pitfalls? Or suggestions of books that have done something similar successfully? Any thoughts very much appreciated. --Robin
wanting feedback-- POV dilemma
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Actually, while I'm asking for advice anyway, does anyone know how to make paragraphs in a post? With space between them? I've never figured it out... I think my posts are usually shorter than that last one!
Hi, Cassidy, can you do it all from the daughter's point of view? When you start throwing in the POV of an adult, you're less likely to have your YA readers feel close to the story. Not saying it can't be done, but it's tricky.
Yes, just put a space between. Um, like I just did here
Yes, just put a space between. Um, like I just did here
Anne Cassidy does it beautifully in 'Forget me not'. It is a mother and daughter story told from both perspectives - daughter and mother as teenager. ( Can't remember if it is third or first or a combination of the two.)
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/043994290X/?tag=absolutewrite-21
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/043994290X/?tag=absolutewrite-21
I could do it all from the daughter's POV if I have to but I'd like to include the mother's if I can make it work. The mother's story is primarily about events that happened while she was a teen, so I'm hoping that it can still be high-interest for a teen reader.
I'll check out Anne Cassidy's book-- thanks so much for the suggestion!
I'll check out Anne Cassidy's book-- thanks so much for the suggestion!
I don't think there'd be a big problem with this, especially if it's back to the mom's POV when she was a teen. If you can manage to make the switches their own chapters, that'd be even better.
ETA: And to separate paragraphs, just hit "enter" twice
ETA: And to separate paragraphs, just hit "enter" twice
I just went out and bought "Forget Me Not"-- from a quick glance, it looks like she does 1st person for the daughter and 3rd for the mother. Looking forward to reading it-- thanks for the tip, Timewaster.
Sage-- yup, the two viewpoints are divided by chapters-- no jumping back and forth within a chapter, so I don't think it should be confusing. I just worry about making sure each thread is equally engaging and that the two stories are woven together in a way that works well.
I think I'm maybe ready to print the whole thing and give it to some trusted friends to read... then go from there.
Sage-- yup, the two viewpoints are divided by chapters-- no jumping back and forth within a chapter, so I don't think it should be confusing. I just worry about making sure each thread is equally engaging and that the two stories are woven together in a way that works well.
I think I'm maybe ready to print the whole thing and give it to some trusted friends to read... then go from there.
Why is the mother's narration POV necessary at all? Is her past relevant to the daughter's current situation? The plot is the daughter's right? If she needs to know about her mother's past, I think it can be revealed to her in the narration of the daughter's POV. How the daughter reacts to the mother's history is interesting and telling, other than conversation, many of them found in an attic (diary, photos, etc.).
I don't know a lot about your plot obviously, but I'm wondering if the real problem is that your story is the mother's and you need to tell the story from her POV.
I don't know a lot about your plot obviously, but I'm wondering if the real problem is that your story is the mother's and you need to tell the story from her POV.
Hi Daagzahav,
Welcome to AW-- thanks for sharing your thoughts.
To answer your question, I think this story could be written as an adult novel and told entirely from the mother's POV, or as a YA novel and told from the daughter's. Basically, a series of events that took place in the mother's life when she was a teenager are brought back to the surface because of an event that occurs in the present which involves the daughter's absent father (who is mom's high school boyfriend). I've chosen to go the YA route, so I'm focusing on the things that happen to the daughter, her reaction to these, and the ripple effects of all this in the family. Mom's history is relevant in that in informs how she (Mom) reacts to her daughtyer's dilemma, and because she holds information that is relevant to the daughter's own developing sense of identity. You're right in saying that this could be revealed in conversation and I have toyed with doing that-- I'd keep it much briefer in that case as I don't want to bog the book down with back story.
There are a lot of parallels between the two teens' stories though, and it is interesting to play with this and see how the themes surface and resurface in both stories-- and to see how alike and how different the two young women are in their responses, sense of possibility and ability to make choices that are right for them. If I can play out both stories in scenes and make it work, I think it could make a stronger novel. So... I'll try it anyway, and if it is a flop, I'll rewrite from a single viewpoint.
I may just be being stubborn, as my previous novel started out in two alternating viewpoints-- siblings-- and I ended up decided to rewrite and stick with one, because as the story emerged it clearly belonged more to the older girl. I'm pleased with how that novel turned out but am keen to have another shot at writing from two POV's-- I guess it remains to be seen if that is the right choice for this new novel, but at least the process is proving to be educational!
By the way, Timewaster-- I read and enjoyed Forget Me Not-- thanks for that suggestion. Very helpful to see how someone else handled this!
Welcome to AW-- thanks for sharing your thoughts.
To answer your question, I think this story could be written as an adult novel and told entirely from the mother's POV, or as a YA novel and told from the daughter's. Basically, a series of events that took place in the mother's life when she was a teenager are brought back to the surface because of an event that occurs in the present which involves the daughter's absent father (who is mom's high school boyfriend). I've chosen to go the YA route, so I'm focusing on the things that happen to the daughter, her reaction to these, and the ripple effects of all this in the family. Mom's history is relevant in that in informs how she (Mom) reacts to her daughtyer's dilemma, and because she holds information that is relevant to the daughter's own developing sense of identity. You're right in saying that this could be revealed in conversation and I have toyed with doing that-- I'd keep it much briefer in that case as I don't want to bog the book down with back story.
There are a lot of parallels between the two teens' stories though, and it is interesting to play with this and see how the themes surface and resurface in both stories-- and to see how alike and how different the two young women are in their responses, sense of possibility and ability to make choices that are right for them. If I can play out both stories in scenes and make it work, I think it could make a stronger novel. So... I'll try it anyway, and if it is a flop, I'll rewrite from a single viewpoint.
I may just be being stubborn, as my previous novel started out in two alternating viewpoints-- siblings-- and I ended up decided to rewrite and stick with one, because as the story emerged it clearly belonged more to the older girl. I'm pleased with how that novel turned out but am keen to have another shot at writing from two POV's-- I guess it remains to be seen if that is the right choice for this new novel, but at least the process is proving to be educational!
By the way, Timewaster-- I read and enjoyed Forget Me Not-- thanks for that suggestion. Very helpful to see how someone else handled this!
Here's a question - would Judith Guest's Ordinary People count as a YA novel? I don't think it was ever published as such (in 1976) but quite a lot of teens did read it - including me, in the wake of the 1980 film version. I think it's taught in schools nowadays, though most likely more in the USA.
It's told (in alternating chapters, in third person present tense) from both an adult and a teenage viewpoint - a father and a son.
Could that be published as YA if it were written nowadays? (No doubt for older teenagers, due to language, non-explicit sexual content and themes of suicide and family breakdown.)
It's told (in alternating chapters, in third person present tense) from both an adult and a teenage viewpoint - a father and a son.
Could that be published as YA if it were written nowadays? (No doubt for older teenagers, due to language, non-explicit sexual content and themes of suicide and family breakdown.)
Hey Eyeblink,
I have not read it (didn't even see the movie) so I can't comment on whether it is YA, but I'll check it out-- thanks.
-Robin
I have not read it (didn't even see the movie) so I can't comment on whether it is YA, but I'll check it out-- thanks.
-Robin
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