The Daily Rejection, Vol. 2

diana86 said:

Agent #1 has a lot of feedback and edits for me to complete before going on sub. Agent #2 is SO enthusiastic and excited, and only has minor edits for me. I was worried Agent #1 had a point, and that I might regret not taking that agent's advice. But I also suspect that going with Agent #1 could land me in revision hell forever. Your post helps validate that concern. So, seriously, thank you for posting this here. <3

Click to expand...

A lot of it really depends on your final "feel" for an agent. Don't get completely sold on "But this agent has a track record for sales." That's important, obviously, since it shows they have the experience and connections, but if the creative partnership isn't there, you'll just end up being even more stressed as time goes on. I've seen people--including my own wife--in relationships with agents that brought in a lot of money, but left them feeling miserable because they were no longer doing what they actually wanted to do. If the money is the priority, then by all means go with that agent that will promise the sales as long as you do what they tell you to do. If you want to see YOUR work, as YOU envisioned it go into print, then maybe pick the agent that loves your work, instead of "What it could be" provided you are willing to be the clay that gets shaped to someone else's creative expectations.

diana86 said:

OMG. I'm so sorry your journey has been so fraught with frustrations. But I hope that now your book is in the right hands, you'll have a speedy sale! Congratulations on signing with someone new!!!

Also, your timing on posting this feels like fate to me. I've now received offers from my top two agent choices (I think I'm in some opposite version of the Upside-Down, this can't be real). Both have utterly fantastic sales, so I can't even compare based on that. Agent #1 has a lot of feedback and edits for me to complete before going on sub. Agent #2 is SO enthusiastic and excited, and only has minor edits for me. I was worried Agent #1 had a point, and that I might regret not taking that agent's advice. But I also suspect that going with Agent #1 could land me in revision hell forever. Your post helps validate that concern. So, seriously, thank you for posting this here. <3

Click to expand...

Yes, follow your gut... I had two offers last year, both top veteran agents. One was my first choice and first agent I queried. She had books I read, readings I attended, a natural choice. The offer didn't have edits in mind, but (well, a little more complicated, but ready to go on submission). But because my offer call was kind of messed up as was my query process in terms of it being 2 years, I was swayed by sales and name of the other agent, and circumstances had her handle the offer better. They both courted me heavily until the ink dried on my contract (unreal after years of rejects). But, sadly, the edits never were what was discussed, they evolved... and I began to regret the edits and knew another round would mean it wasn't my book nor would there be room in my heart for editor edits if I was lucky to get publishing offer. and so we both essentially pulled the plug with heavy heart and much respect. There went a year on top of two query years. I made the right choice at the time of the offer because of circumstance, but knew the other agent was likely to click with book more. But was dazzled with sales and enthusiasm for my book of the other and how the offer was handled with much more organization and timeliness. the flip side to this, is you can say it was just a continuation of my manuscript journey that got it to where it is now. But if I didn't land another offer, I don't think I would be saying that. No, I wouldn't.

So with my new offer I wanted it clear if the edits were minor. THey appear to be, LORD crossing fingers, but my now agent made it clear was minor.

That said, it doesn't of course mean that will play out that way for you. In the end, you gotta go with what feels right and what circumstances are telling you is right. and then just go with what comes as best you can.

good luck and congrats!

Tamlyn said:

*throws out congratulations and commiserations for everything missed*

Eye surgery sucks. Just throwing that out there. I didn't finish my WIP, I didn't finish my edits, and my gaming convention was a large failure. But it's NaNo time and I do not need brain (or, thankfully, non-blurred vision) to draft. So throwing myself headlong into that. Or I will. Just as soon as I feel a little better and I win my game

Click to expand...

I'm so terribly behind in responding to people here, I've been finding it hard to jump back in. So I'll piggyback on your first sentence. Me too!

I hope your eyesight continues to improve. Things like this remind us that our writing success isn't the most important thing in our lives, don't they? Good luck with NaNo.

Nova Odyssey said:

Gosh, not sure if anyone on here from when I was posting still.... but for those who are, a very brief update to what happened to me since my last dooms-day post. agent and I parted ways after a year of me editing book, it never went on submission. a hundred queries later (to add to the previous hundred) I got rep again when I queried the right agent... instead of my 2 year query saga of one of my first offers, this one I got in two weeks. but contextualize that in the fact that this has been a "YEARS" project. it was a hard process, too sad to even post on a reject board. but sharing so that folks are reminded just how subjective things are in the query process and it what works in a book. XOX

Click to expand...

Well, I am sort-of on here.

I'm so happy you got rep again. It gives me hope.

To recap, I had rep and my book went on sub. Before it was completely pitched, my agent cut me loose (said she was too busy and had to reduce her workload). I've been querying another book, and that's gone nowhere. This is a book my ex-agent said she liked. So

A continuing theme in my editor rejections were folks saying that my mix of genre elements would work better in YA than in Adult and that my voice seemed more YA than Adult. After all these agent Rs on book 2 queried as Adult, I decided to adjust the MS and make it YA. I'm about to start querying that way.

I'm not sure if it would be kosher to query agents who've rejected this project but did so after a different query, a different beginning, and my identification of it as Adult. Is changing the age category of the book enough of a change to requery, especially in light of all those editors who thought my work would be better cast as YA? If I requery, do I explain the change of category (and why) or just send my new query and not even mention the old one?

lianna, collie, ktzeee - for rejections
harlequin - but ? Higher tier rejections are always nice.

Nova – So glad you've gotten another agent, and I hope this time it works out much better for you. I know how much stress the first go round was putting you under.

Welcome back, Hathor. for the rejections, but good luck for the YA change. No idea about the querying, sorry

(oops. Too many smileys. Or frownies, I guess?)

Collie said:

Another rejection on a full. She included some lovely comments, and a short explanation of why it didn't work for her. Naturally, that is exactly the opposite of what the last person said, though it was very kind of her to take the time. This industry is very subjective and I am both rejected and dejected.

Click to expand...

Ugh. This is where I'm at today, too, kind of. Another rejection on a full, with a "This is a great concept! Great characters! You're very talented! But I didn't love it." Sigh. I'm really not sure how to fix it when every rejection is because they didn't love it enough, you know? It's incredibly frustrating in a writerly sense, nothing really concrete to go on. I'm feeling pretty wallowy right now, if you need a wallowing buddy.

Felix - Cheers on the full!

Belle_91 - Sympathies on the form R. Cookies, totally.

sockycat - Better your best work in a couple of weeks than something you're not happy with right away. Good luck!

Marlys - R cookies for you as well, but sounds like it was a personal R, at least? So yay for that.

diana86 - That sounds like a heckuva phone call! And multiple offers, too -- woot!

ktzeee - Yay for all the requests!

Tamlyn - Yech on the eye surgery. Hopefully it'll be better soon? And go you for NaNoing anyway!

More R cookies to lianna, Shoeless, Harlequin, ktzeee, Collie, Cannelle, and anyone else who needs 'em.

Nova - Nice to see you again! Sounds like a rough ride, all right, but a good result in the end.

Hathor - If it's changed enough to fit in a whole different category, I'd just query as new. If they recognize you or the project from before, you can explain then.


Apologies to anyone I missed... not feeling very coherent tonight. I was going to slog out a query tonight, but I think I'm just going to go read myself to sleep instead. Should take about five minutes, at this point.

Liz_V, thanks. I'm not sure if the book has changed a lot or I've just faced the fact that my voice and MCs sound young, even though I'm not.

Good luck on your query. I wrote a new one myself yesterday. Only my umpteenth attempt... but it finally dawned on me when I woke up in the middle of the night how I could phrase things so as to eliminate certain details. It went from 330 words to 230 words. Why I couldn't figure out how to do this before, I don't know. I hope the muse visits you, too.

Have a nice weekend, everyone!

Hathor- sorry to hear that. it is indeed, rough.
good to hear from folks, thanks!

sorry for all those rejects to the faces I'm not familiar with here. remember, some of it really is just plain subjective. I know it sounds blah to hear, but I have heard it all in terms of what works and doesn't.

Nova Odyssey said:

Gosh, not sure if anyone on here from when I was posting still.... but for those who are, a very brief update to what happened to me since my last dooms-day post. agent and I parted ways after a year of me editing book, it never went on submission. a hundred queries later (to add to the previous hundred) I got rep again when I queried the right agent... instead of my 2 year query saga of one of my first offers, this one I got in two weeks. but contextualize that in the fact that this has been a "YEARS" project. it was a hard process, too sad to even post on a reject board. but sharing so that folks are reminded just how subjective things are in the query process and it what works in a book. XOX

Click to expand...

Hi Nova! I'm still here (and still offer-less)

Sorry to hear about the agent-parting, but congrats on the new agent!

Hathor - Sometimes the YA/adult divide doesn't make any sense to me at all. Yay for simplifying your query, though! Don'cha love those things that are so blindingly obvious -- afterwards?

I think I've got the base text of my query set (mind you, I thought that the last six times, too). Now it's just the tedious process of falling in love with an agent enough to want to work with them, then promptly falling out of love as soon as I click Send so I can fall in love with the next one. Sigh. Can't imagine why I keep procrastinating this!

I'm procrastinating it tonight, too. But at least this time I'm using writing as my query-avoidance tool. That's good time management, right?

Nova Odyssey said:

Hathor- sorry to hear that. it is indeed, rough.
good to hear from folks, thanks!

sorry for all those rejects to the faces I'm not familiar with here. remember, some of it really is just plain subjective. I know it sounds blah to hear, but I have heard it all in terms of what works and doesn't.

Click to expand...

Yup, subjective is the name of the game. That may actually be my least favorite word in the English language right now, subjective!

Speaking of words, is there a word- maybe a long German one?- for the overwhelming sense of dread and horror that you feel when you hit the send button on a query and you're certain that you screwed SOMETHING up (agent's name/weird typo in the query that makes you appear completely incompetent as a writer/somehow your entire copy and pasted query got mixed up and you pasted a recipe for lentil loaf instead, etc), even though you checked it at least nineteen times and everything looks fine? That word needs to exist, because it features heavily in my life.

So, this isn't nearly as cool as getting an agent...but I just got an email that a story I submitted to the Writer's of the Future contest for the 4th quarter round received an honorable mention. So that's kind of neat. I don't really know much about the contest and I submitted on a whim, but apparently I get a certificate? Lmao.

sockycat said:

So, this isn't nearly as cool as getting an agent...but I just got an email that a story I submitted to the Writer's of the Future contest for the 4th quarter round received an honorable mention. So that's kind of neat. I don't really know much about the contest and I submitted on a whim, but apparently I get a certificate? Lmao.

Click to expand...

Snap! Well, an Honorable Mention seems to be that our stories got through the first round of judging, but didn't make the final 20 or so stories. And yes, we get a snazzy certificate.

sockycat said:

So, this isn't nearly as cool as getting an agent...but I just got an email that a story I submitted to the Writer's of the Future contest for the 4th quarter round received an honorable mention. So that's kind of neat. I don't really know much about the contest and I submitted on a whim, but apparently I get a certificate? Lmao.

Click to expand...

Keep the faith. You're obviously doing something right, so at least you know you have talent. Now it's just a matter of that talent translating into a real opportunity. But take comfort in the fact that you're actually a good writer. That will lead to other things in time.

Got a form rejection yesterday and decided it was a good time to close out a bunch of non-responses.

Thanks SO MUCH for all your advice Shoeless and Nova Odyssey. I chose the agent who seemed most excited about my book, and accepted his offer yesterday. Will be announcing it next week once he’s back from vacation! Ahhhh! I still can’t believe this is real.


@Hathor: Oof, I’m so sorry about your agent parting ways mid-sub. That’s kind of a miserable thing for her to do. Regarding mixing genre elements, I’ve personally found that’s a tough sell in YA as well. My second book was a YA thriller with sci-fi elements, so it was tough to pitch, and editors couldn’t figure out how they’d market it, so it didn’t sell. Just some food for thought.


@Cannelle: It’s all so subjective. What one agent doesn’t fall in love with, another very well might. Remember it’s not just about loving the book as a casual reader; they have to love it enough to re-read it a gazillion times and pitch it to editors. So it’s not as much a reflection on your book as it is on their very personal tastes.


@sockycat: YAYYY congrats!!! That seems like something you can add to your resume/author bio, right?

Cannelle said:

Yup, subjective is the name of the game. That may actually be my least favorite word in the English language right now, subjective!

Speaking of words, is there a word- maybe a long German one?- for the overwhelming sense of dread and horror that you feel when you hit the send button on a query and you're certain that you screwed SOMETHING up (agent's name/weird typo in the query that makes you appear completely incompetent as a writer/somehow your entire copy and pasted query got mixed up and you pasted a recipe for lentil loaf instead, etc), even though you checked it at least nineteen times and everything looks fine? That word needs to exist, because it features heavily in my life.

Click to expand...

I agree with you about "subjective," but it's definitely a thing. I've had agents and editors say diametrically opposed things about my work. And there are popular books that I hate and can't figure out how they got published in the first place.

There should be a nice German word for that feeling. I haven't pasted in a lentil loaf recipe, but years ago I sent a number of queries referring to my book's "foreward." I still cringe a bit about that.

sockycat said:

So, this isn't nearly as cool as getting an agent...but I just got an email that a story I submitted to the Writer's of the Future contest for the 4th quarter round received an honorable mention. So that's kind of neat. I don't really know much about the contest and I submitted on a whim, but apparently I get a certificate? Lmao.

Click to expand...

CameronJohnston said:

Snap! Well, an Honorable Mention seems to be that our stories got through the first round of judging, but didn't make the final 20 or so stories. And yes, we get a snazzy certificate.

Click to expand...

Take what validation you can. Better than a kick in the teeth.

Collie said:

Got a form rejection yesterday and decided it was a good time to close out a bunch of non-responses.

Click to expand...

I like to have Querytracker close them out for me after a set amount of time. It seems less painful that way.

diana86 said:

@Hathor: Oof, I’m so sorry about your agent parting ways mid-sub. That’s kind of a miserable thing for her to do. Regarding mixing genre elements, I’ve personally found that’s a tough sell in YA as well. My second book was a YA thriller with sci-fi elements, so it was tough to pitch, and editors couldn’t figure out how they’d market it, so it didn’t sell. Just some food for thought.

Click to expand...

Thanks. I am bearing in mind that these were editors for Adult imprints saying my MS would work better in YA. For some reason (I think it was a random conversation at a conference or the like), my ex-agent sent my MS on sub and the next one (the one I'm querying now) to an editor at a YA imprint. I got an R, of course, saying, "These are Adult." But she liked my voice and said to be in touch in the following months if I decided to change them to YA. Sigh. Unfortunately, I was being stubborn and saying, "No, no, I want to write Adult." Too much time has passed now and I no longer have an agent.

There's probably a good German word for what I'm feeling now.

Cannelle said:

Speaking of words, is there a word- maybe a long German one?- for the overwhelming sense of dread and horror that you feel when you hit the send button on a query and you're certain that you screwed SOMETHING up

Click to expand...

I think it's called "querying".

I had this on the last query I sent -- in fact it was fine, but I was convinced I'd left an [optional stuff can go here, if you have it] bracket in the sent version. I hadn't, that's why those notes are in brackets (easy to search), but I used up a lot of "there's nothing you can do about it now anyway" before I had a chance to check the saved copy.

sockycat (& Cameron?) - congrats on the honorable mention! I don't know if it still is, but Writers of the Future used to be a fairly big deal, so good going!

Collie - R cookies.

diana86 - Looking forward to the official announcement!

Hathor - Everything's better with those long German words with lots of gutteral sounds. And with wine.

What is it about Germany, that they have all the best depressing idioms? These are words the English language needs.

Ah, torschlusspanik....I know that well!

These German words are great. When I read Cannelle asking above for a long German word, I could only think of "schadenfreude" (and didn't spell it right at first) and I didn't know what it meant, either. Turns out to be depressing also! From vocabulary.com:

Schadenfreude. When another person's bad luck secretly makes you feel good, that's Schadenfreude. In German, Schadenfreude literally means "damage-joy," and it's always spelled with a capital S.

Nova - I'm glad to hear you've gotten rep again, but I'm sorry for all the stuff that happened before! Keep us in the loop. I'd love to hear you've gone out on sub someday soon!

Diana - Congrats on choosing an agent. So excited for you!!

Condolences on the R's to lianna, Collie and ktzeee

Sockycat and Cameron - congrats on the honorable mentions and the certificates.

I had my name mentioned in RWA's national magazine this month for winning the contest back in July. Makes things feel a little more real - and almost verging on professional.

RaggedEdge said:

These German words are great. When I read Cannelle asking above for a long German word, I could only think of "schadenfreude" (and didn't spell it right at first) and I didn't know what it meant, either. Turns out to be depressing also! From vocabulary.com:

Schadenfreude. When another person's bad luck secretly makes you feel good, that's Schadenfreude. In German, Schadenfreude literally means "damage-joy," and it's always spelled with a capital S.

Click to expand...

Check out the song from Avenue Q for the best explanation of Schadenfreude. Ever. *language warning*

The last two pro stories I read really sucked and made me feel all grumpy about the fact that my objectively superior tongue) stories get nowhere.