Doctor Who (may contain SPOILERS for current episodes)

EMaree

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Very curious to see what the reactions to last night's episode are like on the American side of the pond. I enjoyed it -- it felt a little bit too on-the-nose, but then again I sometimes need to remind myself to step back and remember I'm not the target audience for the show anymore and it needs to be accessible to younger audiences. A few of the points it raised really stuck with me, particularly that you can't walk away from the awful parts of history. You ARE a part of it, even if you as a person wouldn't condone it now you know better. It's just such a chewy theme, the idea that sometimes you have to watch, because you DID just sit and watch at the time, because if you were of that time you would have sat and watched. Modern Doctor Who often leans more towards 'we should do good and help the world' over 'we should preserve history', and it feels like a long time since we've had an episode that pushed hard in the preserving history direction.

It was so good. It was powerful. It's still on my mind days later.

I do wonder if there were elements that could have been handled better... it felt *so* weird, somehow, having a bunch of Brits shoving themselves into a charged American environment and getting to hold the upper hand of 'we're much more enlightened'. But given the limitations of the format [that is to say: must contain the companions and the doctor] I think Malorie Blackman did a fantastic job turning in a powerful piece of storytelling.

The time vortex manipulators did give me a powerful sense of missing Jack Harkness, though. I would've liked to see him here using Barrowman's American acting to its fullest and adding a bit of American perspective to things.
 

Sage

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This American, at least, didn't care that they were Brits. I could see the episode playing out exactly the same way if the characters were Americans from the future. Yaz and Ryan's reactions to the situation and their own time period felt as true to me as an American, so there was no sense of "Brits are more enlightened" to me.

Very powerful episode. It seems to be well-received all over, at least if I go by twitter. :greenie

It's interesting to see how dealing with racism has changed over the course of the new series. It's a long time since the Doctor told Martha that she could walk through Shakespeare's time without fear.

It's also interesting that suddenly events in time are a fragile thing. It makes absolute sense that the changes Krasko makes would stop this event, and yet, what about all the times the Doctor might do something that seems innocuous (say, steal a bus) for the sake of stopping an alien in the past, that might lead to small changes that lead to big changes? We haven't had to worry about a butterfly effect, but now that time is fragile, we might have to.
 

RichardGarfinkle

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A good episode and one that harkens back to one of the original purposes of Doctor Who: Teaching about the past. There were a number of these during the Hartnell Era, but they became much rarer as the show evolved. The last such episode I can think of was Vincent and the Doctor.

It was certainly written for an audience that didn't know much about the era, which I think works in its favor. It didn't strike me as being a bunch of Brits shoving themselves in, rather it was a bunch of 21st century people seeing something important and trying to help it. It's a plot that could have easily shown up on the more American centered Legends of Tomorrow (they would have handled it differently, but it still would have fit).

I thought Yaz and Ryan's reactions were excellent, and the clear awareness that no single event fixes something like racism, rather it's a long term process with a lot of standing up for (or sitting down for) what's right and human. Graham's reactions were also good with subtle differences in the writing. He isn't in as much danger as Yaz and Ryan so he's more confident in dealing with things. This shows the difference between being in the line of fire and being an ally of those who are.

The Doctor is doing what's right (of course) with a good combination of respect and insouciance.

I think these first few episodes have been recapitulating the things that have made Doctor Who good and reminding the audience of them with Jodie Whittaker showing that, of course she can play the Doctor in all aspects.
 

Justobuddies

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Finally saw episode 1 of the season and it was a bit "meh" to me. I'm not sure if it is the writing or the acting that was bad. There were certainly a few cuts in the show that made the story jump awkwardly giving me some whiplash. I think it would have been better to only introduce one companion and new doctor at first, instead of trying to introduce an ensemble. The result being that we don't really get a good sense of any of the characters.

Not sure if it was the actress trying too hard to bring back the zaniness of 11, or the writers tried to write her that way. Either way it just wasn't working for me the wackiness seemed forced and done strictly to bring back ratings, which doesn't really make me want to keep watching. I will, of course, keep watching because the first few episodes of each new doctor, or when new writers come in it's always off-putting. Usually, there's an episode that pushes the doctor into a serious place and the actor finally finds their doctor. I will give it a chance to really grab me, but for now, it's just a show that I used to like.
 

benbenberi

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Being concerned about the effects of changing history is another way the new series is calling back to Classic Who. It was a big deal for the First Doctor, who did a lot of historicals. And the Eight Doctor was always worrying about endangering the Web of Time. I like that Chibnall's bringing back this classic theme, which mostly got ignored in the RTD/Moffat era.
 

RedRajah

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Last night's episode reminded a little of "Quantum Leap" -- which then had me brainstorming which Doctor & Companion I'd want meeting up with Sam Beckett & Al and where/when in time...
 

Keithy

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Hmm, just caught the third episode. I liked it, and think it was the best episode so far this series, although that's not saying that much (the other episodes were a bit boring). A bit heavy-handed on the educational side of things for me, a bit too much telling. I did wonder if, Rosa Parks had not done what she had done, whether someone else might have done it, thus rendering the future racist's scheme irrelevant. And with some zappy thing on hand to send him away, why not do it earlier?

Jodie Whittaker is OK as the Doctor, although her accent grates. And she has too many assistants; it's difficult to give them all something to do and have an interesting story. Please let the stories be more interesting.
 

Max Vaehling

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I know it probably won't happen, but I'd love to see this Doctor run into River Song. . . . and/or Captain Jack.

This is actually the first time since seasion 5 that I'd love to see some of the old companions, just to see how they'd react. (I'm pretty sure River would be delighted, btw. Although it'll be hard to beat the chemistry Alex Kingston had with Capaldi.)
 

Max Vaehling

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I loved this one. Rather than Quantum Leap or Legends of Tomorrow, though, it reminded me of Timeless, especially season 1 when they dealt more with the heavier aspects of the past. (Right in the first episode Rufus frames it quite nicely, saying something like "I'm a black man. There's no point in American history that's awesome for me.")

As for how stealing a bus might not be a big time diruptor, I think that was explained by the ninth doctor, way back: There are fixed points in time that can't be changed, but everything around that will largely sort itself out. So it's all canon.
 

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I'm glad for the third episode. It's been a while since they actually did something with the "time" aspect of the TARDIS and not just fighting aliens.
 

benbenberi

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I'm glad for the third episode. It's been a while since they actually did something with the "time" aspect of the TARDIS and not just fighting aliens.

For those of us who enjoy that aspect, I can recommend another show (comparable to Timeless in some ways) that deals with it: El Minister del Tiempo -- a Spanish series, on Netflix. A nifty premise, well-executed, & it's a refreshing change to see critical moments of Spanish history at the center instead of the same old Anglo/American bits.
 

RedRajah

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I am wondering/hoping with the coming attractions for next week if...












...those spiders are related to those found on Metebelis 3 in any way?
 

frimble3

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It's nice to see a return to time-travel, after so many strange planets, where anything goes. It give a sort of marker to judge against. Even the ones set in the 'now', modern day, etc. were grounded in something, we knew the parameters that were the background to the alien invasions, etc.

Oh, and the look on Rosa Parks' face when, before she had done anything, these strangers knew her name and were speaking of her as though she was somebody. Reverend King was already well-known, but for a simple seamstress, it must have seemed bizarre.
​All in all, a good one.
 

kuwisdelu

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I liked it.

It's interesting to see how dealing with racism has changed over the course of the new series. It's a long time since the Doctor told Martha that she could walk through Shakespeare's time without fear.

Definitely. I'm glad that this season they finally dealt with it in a real way, rather than the "oh, some of my best friends are blue" cringe-fest we frequently got.

Sure, it was a little heavy-handed at times, but overall, I liked it.

I really liked how Yaz's and Ryan's reactions grounded it in the present-day, with how things are "better, not perfect, but better". That's important. There's still a lot of work left to do.

And I liked how Graham didn't want to be on the wrong side of history, but the Doctor acknowledged that wasn't their choice to make; they don't get to walk away or opt out: they had to stay and let Rosa do what she needed to do.
 

neandermagnon

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Jodie Whittaker is OK as the Doctor, although her accent grates.

I love her as the Doctor. There's something about her that reminds me of Sylvester McCoy's doctor (sorry I forget which one goes with which number). While I did use to watch Dr Who before Sylvester McCoy, he's the doctor I remember most clearly from my childhood, therefore archetypal for me... though I may be remembering Sylvester McCoy a little as a composite of him and a couple of earlier Doctors. I can't place what it is about Jodie Whittaker's Doctor that reminds me of him though. It's obviously not her age or gender. The style of clothing may be part of it but I think it's more than that. I did worry (as I have with every change of Doctor) that she won't seem like The Doctor any more, but she totally does. And I love her accent.

One thing I found about the Rosa Parks episode is how much it brings home to me how horrific the racism is. When Ryan got slapped in the face like that... what makes it so powerful for me is that I identify with Ryan, Yasmin and Graham as modern English people, like me. So seeing how horrifically Ryan gets treated and all the racism that's going on... it's like taking my modern English mind back to 1950's Alabama. It really brings it home.

I really liked how Yaz's and Ryan's reactions grounded it in the present-day, with how things are "better, not perfect, but better". That's important. There's still a lot of work left to do.

And I liked how Graham didn't want to be on the wrong side of history, but the Doctor acknowledged that wasn't their choice to make; they don't get to walk away or opt out: they had to stay and let Rosa do what she needed to do.

I agree. They didn't take Rosa's agency away from her - it was about her courage and hers alone in the face of horrific treatment.

And it's definitely important to be reminded that while things are better, they're still a long way from perfect.
 

MythMonger

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A good episode and one that harkens back to one of the original purposes of Doctor Who: Teaching about the past.

I enjoyed that as well.

I hope we'll get a few more shows like that this season, interspersed with the alien shows.
 

Keithy

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Tonight's offering was "Arachnids in the UK". Well, in Sheffield (again) to be precise; I am assuming the film unit must be based there. The episode continues the slow upward curve begun last week, although I was hoping for a reference to Metebelis III, but not to be. The wife was scared of the spiders but she's scared of them in real life. Overall the same problems persist: grating "eh-up" accents, too many companions and a weak ending.

Nevertheless, my doubts are being assuaged. Next week's episode sounds interesting. And please, keep the sonic screwdriver under control!
 

Laer Carroll

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Tonight's offering was "Arachnids in the UK". ... Overall the same problems persist: grating "eh-up" accents, too many companions and a weak ending.


Thanks for the spoiler, truly. I'll skip the episode because I hate spiders too.

The things that bother you don't bother me at all. In fact, I rather like the several Friends.
 
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Laer Carroll

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HAH! Just came back from a huge Halloween costume store. Guess what costume is front and center?

And in men's sizes too.

I have long flowing silver/blond hair with a matching trimmed beard. I THINK I could pull it off !!!
 
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Keithy

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About the surfeit of companions, having a gaggle was tried in the 80's (Tegan, Nyssa and Adric, for instance) but it was impossible to give all of them something worthwhile to do. The writers resorted to plot devices such as having them locked away in prisons so as to save screen time for the rest. Before you mention that the episodes back then were only half an hour, the series used to go on for 20 or 25 episodes. Different times.
 

Orianna2000

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There have been multiple companions in the new-Who, too. (Didn't mean for that to rhyme, LOL!) Granted, they didn't last long together, but Nine had Jack and Rose together for a few episodes. Later, there was Rose and Mickey traveling with Ten. It's a bit more crowded with three of them, but I think it could work.

OMG, a crossover between Quantum Leap and Doctor Who would be absolutely brilliant! I might have to write one.

* Thoughts on Episode #3 *

In the Rosa Parks episode, I was disappointed that the rogue time traveler wasn't a time agent. When are we going to see the Time Agency?? On the other hand, isn't the prison he came from the same one that held River Song?
 

RedRajah

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@Orianna -- the same one.


I just finished watching last night's episode. Of the 4 episodes so far, I feel it was the weakest -- but I shudder to think how much it could have been worse if it was put through Moffat's wringer. Recognizing the guest star was a pleasant surprise. And I was also bummed that the title critters had nothing to do with Metebelis III either.
 

Keithy

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Tonight's episode - The Tsuranga Conundrum: good setup, lousy antagonist. Nice spaceship, bad dialogue. It's set in the 67th century, yet they still have people with Scottish accents? I don't even know if they are supposed to be human.

Perhaps it's a good thing there is no Christmas episode this year.
 

RedRajah

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My first thoughts...

BEEP THE MEEP~?!

My second thought was that this was the "anti-42" in terms of episodes (a Chibnall script from RTD's era). And "42" was a guilty pleasure for me. But there was a "42" vibe here. And this time around the death count is reversed.

Next week has my curiosity piqued.