Human bioelectricity

efreysson

Closer than ever
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jan 23, 2007
Messages
1,618
Reaction score
101
Location
Iceland
It occurred to me that messing with the natural electricity within the human body might be an interesting new way to kill people in my new WIP.

What would theoretically happen if all bioelectricity in a person would suddenly shut down? Might there be some kind of dramatic visual effect, or would they just flop down like discarded marionettes? And just how much power is there in the human body, anyway? If it were all to be harnessed/extracted in one go, might it cause an actual light show?
 

Al X.

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jul 9, 2017
Messages
1,053
Reaction score
604
Location
V-Town, check it out yo
Website
www.authoralexryan.com
A rudimentary search on the subject indicates that the field is very weak, and at best the absence may affect wound healing. I don't think that it is plausible for it to suddenly shut down, or even shut down at all, as the electrical field that is generated is caused by chemical interactions within the body, just like in a battery.

As to the question of how much "power" there is in the human body, theoretically it is whatever chemical energy is present. Let's say for a Q and D (quick and dirty) assume 1,000 calories per pound aggregate between fats and proteins. A man weighing 170 lbs would have roughly 50 pounds of flesh (the body is roughly 70% water. So, 50,000 calories. A KCal is roughly 1.2 watt hours, so say a little over 50 watt hours in round numbers. A D size battery, for comparison, is roughly 30 watt hours. That's not much, and that is only assuming you can completely convert all of the chemical energy to electrical energy. In reality, only a small fraction of that would be available in an electrical form.
 

Woollybear

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Nov 27, 2017
Messages
9,857
Reaction score
9,923
Location
USA
When I think of electricity in the body I think of the nervous system, and the junctions between nerve endings--which are ion gated channels.

Potassium and sodium (other ions?) are important to conduct the signal. If I were to work this angle of bioelectricity into a magic system, I'd pattern my system off of real-world conditions in which sodium and potassium are sorely depleted. (Looks like that causes cardiac arrest, which I believe to be true.)

Sounds like me and Al hear the prompt a little differently--and his calculations look fine to me, so depends where your own thoughts are I guess.
 

ChaseJxyz

Writes 🏳️‍⚧️🌕🐺 and 🏳️‍⚧️🌕🐺 accessories
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jul 5, 2020
Messages
4,524
Reaction score
6,203
Location
The Rottenest City on the Pacific Coast
Website
www.chasej.xyz
As AI said, there's not a lot of juice in a person, which is why The Matrix is kinda silly in that regard. So drawing "electricity" as we modern people think of it isn't really worth the effort. If you somehow manage to shutdown the ATP cycle (which are the actual "batteries" of "power" for living things) then they'll just pass out/die, because that's what happens when your heart stops going. That in itself isn't very flashy.

If you run electricity through a person, at low levels* it causes the muscles to contract/spasm. When they did that as a test at the neurologist it was uncomfortable, it felt like a strong static shock but having your muscles move outside of your control is very creepy and feels wrong. Doing stuff with electricity and bodies has been a subject of human imagination for quite awhile, look up Galvinism. It's why Frankenstiein exists, this theory that you can "give life" to otherwise dead material (of course, it takes a lot more than just electricity on the nerves to keep the body going).

Your character(s) can always kill others with electricity through broken power cables, electric chairs, lightning strikes, etc etc. If it's because magic then you can handwave more of it away, you're turning "mana" into electricity and that's where that big sudden burst of power is from. Nothing is more flashy than a bolt of lightning.

*the actual hows of electricity is one of the few things I can't wrap my head around, so whether it's the voltage or wattage or whatever that causes this I don't remember or could even tell you, but Dr Google would know the answer
 
Last edited:

Helix

socially distancing
Kind Benefactor
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Mar 31, 2011
Messages
11,750
Reaction score
12,192
Location
Atherton Tablelands
Website
snailseyeview.medium.com
I was thinking much the same at Woollybear. Something like rapid hypokalemia, where potassium is reduced to critically low levels. (Or hypnatremia with sodium.)
 

ChaseJxyz

Writes 🏳️‍⚧️🌕🐺 and 🏳️‍⚧️🌕🐺 accessories
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jul 5, 2020
Messages
4,524
Reaction score
6,203
Location
The Rottenest City on the Pacific Coast
Website
www.chasej.xyz

neandermagnon

Nolite timere, consilium callidum habeo!
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 25, 2014
Messages
7,314
Reaction score
9,519
Location
Dorset, UK
What would happen if all bioelectricity in the human body shut down? (this is not the same as using electricity to kill someone - what happens when you electrocute someone is different)

I've answered as if this happens instantly. If it happens more slowly then go with hyponatraemia/hypocalcaemia as suggested above, because these are the main ions involved in the process described below.

First consider how electricity in the human body works normally. It's not like electricity in a wire. Your nerve cells work by the active transport of ions from inside to outside the nerve cell (in the axons - the long thin bit of the nerve cell). Active transport is where the cell membrane pumps particles against a concentration gradient. Without the active transport, there would be an equal concentration of ions on both sides of the membrane, because of diffusion. Your nerve cells use energy to pump ions out, against the concentration gradient, so that there are more on the outside than the inside. Ions have an electrical charge so this means there is a potential difference between the inside and outside of the nerve cell (i.e. electricity).

When a nerve impulse happens, the ions come flooding back in again. This starts at one end of the long thin bit of the nerve cell, and it triggers changes in the next bit of the membrane, which allows the ions in the next bit to flood in - this continues up the nerve cell. It's like domino rally - the dominoes fall in turn but the dominoes don't move along. Or like a Mexican wave in a sports stadium - each person moves up and down but stays in the same seat and the wave moves around the stadium. The ions themselves aren't moving up the nerve cell (not like electrons in a wire) they are moving from outside to inside, but the nerve impulse travels along the nerve like a mexican wave/domino rally. After the impulse happens, the cell membrane immediately starts pumping the ions back outside the cell, to be ready for another impulse.

So it takes a lot of energy to keep your nervous system in a state where it's ready for nerve impulses to happen. If this active transport of ions from inside to the outside of your nerve cells were to stop, your entire nervous system would immediately shut down and you'd die.

This doesn't just take place in nerve cells though. A similar thing happens in muscle cells. The reason why you get rigor mortis when you die is that the cessation of active transport of ions across the appropriate membranes puts the muscle fibres into a permanently contracted state. So not only would your nervous system immediately cease to function, all your muscles would cramp up, same as rigor mortis. Only difference is you're not technically dead just yet. The heart would cease to beat so all circulation would stop. Consciousness would cease instantly due to the nerves in your brain no longer being able to fire. Death due to lack of circulation usually happens after about 13 mins. At the point where the bioelectricity in the body shuts down, you would get all your nerves firing just once at the same time, as all the ions flow into the nerve cells and at the same time all your muscles cramp up. This would probably be experienced as a flash of literally everything including extreme pain just before your consciousness shuts down completely. In theory the muscle cramps would be extremely painful but the nerves won't carry that signal to the brain. The extreme pain would come from all the nerves that carry pain signals firing at once.

From the outside, the person would look like they completely froze up and dropped dead. Like rigor mortis. Instant death basically. It would look just the same as the avada kedavra killing curse in Harry Potter. In fact if you want a biological explanation for the avada kedavra curse this is most likely it. But for a high tech rather than magical way of killing someone, you'd give the bioelectricity explanation rather than it being magic. NOTE: it's still magical though, because there's no description of what mechanism is used to stop the cell membranes from actively transporting the ions across the membranes. But IMO that would only be an issue in a hard science fiction story. Future or alien tech can handwave this issue. Hostile alien/evil high tech bad guy has ray gun that causes nerves to stop actively transporting ions, which causes your entire nervous system to shut down instantly and for rigor mortis to happen before you're even dead. Sounds good to me! :Thumbs:

ETA: the above is an A-level biology level explanation, aka year 13/university entry level. I have simplified the explanation compared to the detail that would be expected by an A-level examiner. The reality is more complicated than this but the general principle remains the same.
 
Last edited:

efreysson

Closer than ever
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jan 23, 2007
Messages
1,618
Reaction score
101
Location
Iceland
Your character(s) can always kill others with electricity through broken power cables, electric chairs, lightning strikes, etc etc. If it's because magic then you can handwave more of it away, you're turning "mana" into electricity and that's where that big sudden burst of power is from. Nothing is more flashy than a bolt of lightning.
It's magic, yeah. I'm trying to iron out the death magic of my evil sorcerers. I know that magic and exact science don't go well together, I'm just trying to figure out some kind of internal logic to it all. While blasting lightning may be flashy, it's just kind of basic, and can be defended against. I'm trying to work out something even more lethal.
Here's a video that discusses a case of hypokalemia for OP to check out. I'm pretty sure he's done hyponatremia, too, but I can't think of the video off the top of my head.
... that was a LOT of liquorice.
I've answered as if this happens instantly. If it happens more slowly then go with hyponatraemia/hypocalcaemia as suggested above, because these are the main ions involved in the process described below.. . .. . .. . .From the outside, the person would look like they completely froze up and dropped dead. Like rigor mortis. Instant death basically. It would look just the same as the avada kedavra killing curse in Harry Potter. In fact if you want a biological explanation for the avada kedavra curse this is most likely it. But for a high tech rather than magical way of killing someone, you'd give the bioelectricity explanation rather than it being magic. NOTE: it's still magical though, because there's no description of what mechanism is used to stop the cell membranes from actively transporting the ions across the membranes. But IMO that would only be an issue in a hard science fiction story. Future or alien tech can handwave this issue. Hostile alien/evil high tech bad guy has ray gun that causes nerves to stop actively transporting ions, which causes your entire nervous system to shut down instantly and for rigor mortis to happen before you're even dead. Sounds good to me! :Thumbs:ETA: the above is an A-level biology level explanation, aka year 13/university entry level. I have simplified the explanation compared to the detail that would be expected by an A-level examiner. The reality is more complicated than this but the general principle remains the same.
As I mentioned above in this post, I'm writing magic.This is an outstanding answer. Thanks. Would you say there would some physical symptoms other than the instant stiffening, like bleeding or something? And would the rigor mortis effect stay until decay set in?
 

Faraway_

Registered
Joined
Dec 23, 2020
Messages
15
Reaction score
1
What if the shock from draining all bio-electricity from the body connected in some way with the magnetic field surrounding (I don't know your world) and they slowly (or quickly) shot up into the sky (assuming there is one) or squished down into the Earth in some sort of decomposing obliteration/electric parasitism...

Also I understand this is not scientifically accurate, just fantasizing.
 

Al X.

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jul 9, 2017
Messages
1,053
Reaction score
604
Location
V-Town, check it out yo
Website
www.authoralexryan.com
Okay...

There is something wrong with my numbers. And I figured out what it is, and I HATE the convention of calling food calories 'calories' when they are actually kcalories. So, we're looking at a total body chemical energy content of 50 kilowatt hours (KWH.) That makes a little bit more sense to me, as you aren't going to ride a bicycle 100 miles or run a marathon on less energy than a D size flashlight battery can provide. A car battery provides approximately 1 KWH. But again, only a very small fraction will be available in electrical energy.