Just your basic kitchen poisons...

Gatteau

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I’d love some help with my attempted murder, please!

I need a poison that could be found in a modern-day restaurant kitchen. It has to be something that could be mixed into a drink (currently it’s a hot chocolate with peppermint schnapps, though it’s not terribly important what kind of drink) and drunk by the unsuspecting victim, who then succumbs fairly quickly, over the course of the conversation over the drinks.

My poisoner is originally from the early 1900s and has gotten herself a job as a waitress in this restaurant, present-day. I was hoping to find some kind of Victorian-era poison, or something they used to use regularly that we now just consider poison, but could still be stocked in a kitchen (Laudanum, arsenic, something like that? Those are still in some cleaning agents, right?). I currently have it written as two shakers of unknown (to me) spices that, when combined, are deadly (because that sounds pretty cool), but I have no idea if that’s in the realm of reality, or what spices those could possibly be.

I was reading about cyanide in apple seeds and cherry pits and thought maybe if she crushed enough of those up into the drink, it could work. But it seems like I would need a LOT of apple seeds, and cherry pits are pretty hard to crush, especially discreetly...

So I’m open to any other ideas, thanks!
 

frimble3

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Okay, laudanum would be will known to your character, but as medication, not a poison - it's
an opiate mixed with alcohol, used as a pain-killer in Victorian times. Very popular. Not only for medical uses, but also as a 'feel good' soother for whatever ails you. Much more 'ladylike' than swilling liquor.
But, yeah, in a big enough dose, it could kill you. Or make you easier to kill.

Arsenic is a poison. Found in a kitchen as rat poison.
In Victorian times it was in all kinds of things, from wallpaper, to make-up, to medications.

But, your murderess will find that times have changed, and these once-common killers are now forbidden, regulated, and not commonly found in any decent kitchen.

Fly-paper, maybe, those old-fashioned coils that hang from the ceiling? I've heard of people soaking the poisonous coating off. But, a commercial kitchen would have rules about hanging head flies from the ceiling.

I'd look less at poisons, and more at cleaning solutions - lyes, etc. But most of these aren't swift, silent killers.
Or, poisonous berries that could be sprinkled on a single serving of food, or juiced into a drink.
These days, we have health and safety regulations.
 

ChaseJxyz

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This Youtuber did a video about toxins in foods [vid here]. Apple seeds have the most cyanides of all the seeds/pits, and you need 3.5 oz to kill a 150 lb person. And they need to be crushed for it to come out (because the whole point of seeds is to be eaten and then spread by birds and stuff, and if a normal stomach could break it down enough to release the cyanide then those seeds aren't going to be spread too well). A improperly cooked kidney bean can kill you with as little as 1 bean because of the toxins in it. So a cup of soup or some beans on toast would be enough to do the guy in.

Arsenic is a pretty popular one because it was so easy to get ahold of rat poison. There's also ethylene glycol, which is the basis for anti-freeze, which is naturally sweet-tasting. Commercial antifreeze came out in the 1920s but the chemical was used for other stuff before then.
 

frimble3

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Anti-freeze, that's a good one for a modern murder! I wonder of it, or something similar is used in freezer cooling-systems?
There are warnings every winter about keeping it away from pets and children, and the sweetness would make it easy to hide in a fancy drink, or a dessert!
 

WeaselFire

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Blowfish. Improperly prepared, the toxin is deadly. Put it on your restaurant's menu and run with it.

Jeff
 

Gatteau

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Ooh, ok some good suggestions!

I don't know how I forgot about anti-freeze, I do know about that and it should have been the obvious thing to tip into a cocktail. And if I decide right... now! that her mother back in the day was a chemist, she could know of such things. Bam!

Blowfish would be fun to work in somehow, but unfortunately there's no way this particular restaurant would be serving that. Way out in the boonies, and not nearly fancy enough, ha.

But kidney beans, hm... I had heard something like that, but really just one bean? That does seem like a very easy and discreet kitchen theft. And if the restaurant serves chili, then the chef might have a pot of beans boiling away for prep... Interesting. Maybe I could have her bring a snack along with the cocktail, just to be extra thorough.

Sidenote: that guy's videos are incredible! I may have just taken a quick detour and watched about half his catalogue before remembering I was there to research poisons... :roll:
 

frimble3

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Gatteau, I didn't think about anti-freeze either, until ChaseJxyz mentioned it!
My first thought was the cleaning supplies, etc.
But once anti-freeze was mentioned, it seemed so perfect. If cats and dogs will lap it up, some distracted drinker wouldn't even think about it until it was much too late. Especially if there's a fancy garnish on the drink!

And, there are warnings right on the package. Easy for the MC to get the idea.
 
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Maryn

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In Farmington, New York there was an antifreeze murder. Apparently one shot glass of antifreeze added to margarita mix does the trick. In a restaurant, I'd make that a Blue Margarita made with blue Curaçao.

If the murder is pre-meditated, it's pretty easy to hide an ounce and a half of liquid on your person, waiting for the opportunity to add it to a drink.

(I saved some details of this murder to my idea file. Holler if you want enough to research it further.)

Maryn, recalling that the murderer told friends, duh
 

Roxxsmom

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Ethylene glycol (the ingredient in the most common and dangerous form of commercially available antifreeze) is really toxic, but it doesn't kill super quickly. It is a really common way pets die, because a couple licks out of a puddle on the ground is enough to kill a cat or dog, and owners rarely spot the symptoms until it is too late (it causes massive damage to kidneys, liver and to other organs). I think humans require more of a dose to die, and things like co-ingestion with alcohol and quick medical care can improve prognosis (because it slows metabolism of ethylene glycol). I suppose dialysis could be used to keep a human victim alive, however. Of course antifreeze wouldn't be in a commercial kitchen, though I've heard of people pouring it down drains when it is going to be really cold.

Perhaps an overdose of a strong, time release painkiller (such as what cancer patients are prescribed) would work better. With those, crushing the tablets would make it so the patient could absorb a lethal dose all at once. I don't know how detectable the flavor would be in a drink, however.
 

ULTRAGOTHA

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Your character could come across someone's medicine. Alprazolam with alcohol. Digitalis. Fentanyl.

Or add a poisonous plant to the salad, or the juice of one to the drink. Ricin (castor bean), oleander, etc.
 

frimble3

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You'd need to eat about 10 pounds of it, so highly unlikely you can kill someone with it.
Unless you jammed big handfuls down the victim's throat so they suffocated. Betting that is not what the OP had in mind.

- - - Updated - - -

You'd need to eat about 10 pounds of it, so highly unlikely you can kill someone with it.
Unless you jammed big handfuls down the victim's throat so they suffocated. Betting that is not what the OP had in mind.
 
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Gatteau

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Unless you jammed big handfuls down the victim's throat so they suffocated. Betting that is not what the OP had in mind.

Ha, yep, not quite the subtlety I was going for. But knowing rhubarb leaves are poisonous at all has always been one of those facts I feels weirdly proud about knowing.

Ok, so I think the antifreeze option is probably my most straightforward course of action, and I think I can finagle a way to have some hanging around in the kitchen via some not entirely above board managerial practices (read: laziness and not reordering the propylene glycol non-toxic refrigerator coolant in time and decided to substitute whatever's hanging around in the garage).

But I'm still sort of stuck on the randomness of killer kidney beans... that would just be interesting. Yeah, here's your cocktail, nothing wrong with it at all, I promise... Oh, and here's a little snack. :evil

The other thing I've come across is cherry pits. From what I've read, I'm gathering that about 4 crushed up cherry pits could kill an average person. So maybe that's something that could be sprinkled on top of or mixed into a drink, perhaps with some chocolate shavings. Totally normal. But I'm not sure how tough cherry pits are to crush. Gonna have to get some cherries next time I'm at the store and experiment.

The crushing part, not the poisoning, sheesh...
 

frimble3

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Now I'm wondering. What does 10 pounds of rhubarb leaves look like, cooked down? More to the point, how much green smoothie would you have to make out of it?
Call it a special 'nutrient menu', say it's made of something other than rhubarb, then:
Start off with a rhubarb smoothie
Nice bowl of thick green soup.
Some innocent protein course in the middle (in case the police are run tests)
Green rhubarb leaf gelato for dessert!
 

Gatteau

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Hm, interesting concept. Considering how much things like spinach and kale cook down, it seems pretty plausible. I don't think it's quite what I want for this particular scenario, but now I'm imagining a sort of Arsenic and Old Lace, or Sweeney Todd situation, where the whole point of the restaurant is to kill people with nutrition. There's something there... :idea: