Trump's Tax Returns

cbenoi1

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Hot off the press.

LONG-CONCEALED RECORDS SHOW TRUMP’S CHRONIC LOSSES AND YEARS OF TAX AVOIDANCE
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/09/27/us/donald-trump-taxes.html

Donald J. Trump paid $750 in federal income taxes the year he won the presidency. In his first year in the White House, he paid another $750.
He had paid no income taxes at all in 10 of the previous 15 years — largely because he reported losing much more money than he made.

All together now. 3 ... 2 ... 1 ... “Like everything else he inherited, he ran it straight into the ground.” (quoted from: Kamala Harris)

The tax returns that Mr. Trump has long fought to keep private tell a story fundamentally different from the one he has sold to the American public. His reports to the I.R.S. portray a businessman who takes in hundreds of millions of dollars a year yet racks up chronic losses that he aggressively employs to avoid paying taxes. Now, with his financial challenges mounting, the records show that he depends more and more on making money from businesses that put him in potential and often direct conflict of interest with his job as president.

Please act surprised.

-cb
 
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MaeZe

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OMG, this is a wonderful Oct surprise!
This article offers an overview of The Times’s findings; additional articles will be published in the coming weeks.

There is so much here, not paying income taxes is nothing compared to the exposed corruption.

... that he depends more and more on making money from businesses that put him in potential and often direct conflict of interest with his job as president.

His properties have become bazaars for collecting money directly from lobbyists, foreign officials and others seeking face time, access or favor; the records for the first time put precise dollar figures on those transactions.


And then there are the licensing deals he claimed he would not make when he was in office.
...in his first two years in the White House, his revenue from abroad totaled $73 million. And while much of that money was from his golf properties in Scotland and Ireland, some came from licensing deals in countries with authoritarian-leaning leaders or thorny geopolitics — for example, $3 million from the Philippines, $2.3 million from India and $1 million from Turkey.
No wonder he loves authoritarian dictators. Puts a new light on Trump trying to get Kim to build Trump beach resorts in N Korea.


As the president wages a re-election campaign that polls say he is in danger of losing, his finances are under stress, beset by losses and hundreds of millions of dollars in debt coming due that he has personally guaranteed. Also hanging over him is a decade-long audit battle with the Internal Revenue Service over the legitimacy of a $72.9 million tax refund that he claimed, and received, after declaring huge losses. An adverse ruling could cost him more than $100 million.
That's what the tax audit is about.


And if he wants to bring up Hunter Biden:
Ivanka Trump, while working as an employee of the Trump Organization, appears to have received “consulting fees” that also helped reduce the family’s tax bill.


I'm not sure how his cult followers view legit tax deductions and stuff like this:
Even while declaring losses, he has managed to enjoy a lavish lifestyle by taking tax deductions on what most people would consider personal expenses, including residences, aircraft and $70,000 in hairstyling for television.

Trump's reaction via his lawyers has been to ask for the documents, the Times refused to and refused to disclose their sources. So this will start out in the fake news category but I don't think that will hold up at all.
 

Roxxsmom

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Now, with his financial challenges mounting, the records show that he depends more and more on making money from businesses that put him in potential and often direct conflict of interest with his job as president.

Please act surprised.

-cb

:Jaw:

This is the closest thing to a surprised smiley I could find.

Oh, and :ROFL:

A long list of corrupt business practices and conflicts of interest. I'm sure he's already screaming that this is all fake news. Well, he can produce the real tax returns then, can't he?

Sadly, I think his base is so conditioned by now to disbelieve anything anyone publishes that is critical of their glorious leader that they won't care. They are too jazzed at the prospect of the ACA being repealed in the middle of a pandemic and returning to a time when "sinful hussies" died of back alley abortions, and white, healthy, adoptable babies were ripped from their mothers' arms.

Will those few "still undecideds" be swayed by this revelation? I guess we'll see.
 
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mccardey

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That $70,000 could have been better spent...
 

Introversion

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What a parasite. Loser. Weak, fake millionaire.
 

cbenoi1

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:Jaw:
This is the closest thing to a surprised smiley I could find.

Thanks.


They are too jazzed at the prospect of the ACA being repealed in the middle of a pandemic {...}

Apparently, Trump's Don't Care Act is a better option for them.


Will those few "still undecideds" be swayed by this revelation? I guess we'll see.

More crap on an already large pile. Trump is playing defense in this cycle, so this is free ammo for Biden et al.


-cb
 
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Michiru

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Sadly, I think his base is so conditioned by now to believe anything anyone publishes that is critical of their glorious leader that they won't care. They are too jazzed at the prospect of the ACA being repealed in the middle of a pandemic and returning to a time when "sinful hussies" died of back alley abortions, and white, healthy, adoptable babies were ripped from their mothers' arms.

Interestingly, in my experience being surrounded by his supporters, they rarely talk about him at all. The more nasty things are revealed about him, they less they've spoken about anything he says or does.

Rather, the conversation goes: Boy, those liberals are really pulling out all the stops! Do you know what they said now?!

It's like Trump has become this figure that things are done to, rather than an actor himself.
 

LeftyLucy

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It's damning to have all this confirmed, but I think it's basically what we all expected to be true, including his supporters, and probably won't change any minds. I thought the biggest revelation was the however-many-hundreds-of-millions in loans coming due in the next four years, but I doubt even that's enough to move his supporters.

I saw a comment on Twitter that the most effective use of this would be to relentlessly attack his image with it. Call him a cheat, a liar, a crook, etc. The point the poster made is that what his supporters are actually organized behind is the *image* and not really the man or anything factual related to him. I wish I could remember who posted it; I'll link if I can find it. I thought it was a valid point.
 

mccardey

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Interestingly, in my experience being surrounded by his supporters, they rarely talk about him at all. The more nasty things are revealed about him, they less they've spoken about anything he says or does.

Rather, the conversation goes: Boy, those liberals are really pulling out all the stops! Do you know what they said now?!

It's like Trump has become this figure that things are done to, rather than an actor himself.
That is both interesting and scarey.
 

MaeZe

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It's damning to have all this confirmed, but I think it's basically what we all expected to be true, including his supporters, and probably won't change any minds. I thought the biggest revelation was the however-many-hundreds-of-millions in loans coming due in the next four years, but I doubt even that's enough to move his supporters.

I saw a comment on Twitter that the most effective use of this would be to relentlessly attack his image with it. Call him a cheat, a liar, a crook, etc. The point the poster made is that what his supporters are actually organized behind is the *image* and not really the man or anything factual related to him. I wish I could remember who posted it; I'll link if I can find it. I thought it was a valid point.
I imagine the Lincoln Project is on the case.

Obviously we could have guessed all this though I have to admit some of the details are more than even I imagined. Turkey, Philippines, and India paying millions to Trump in licensing fees was a surprise. I knew the Mar a Lago memberships were direct profiteering. That came out when he doubled the price of a membership right away in 2017. And the specifics of those very clear connections between Trump's political decisions and payments to him via renting Trump building offices that remain empty was new to me.

The audit was always specious but now we know what it's really about. It's not about his taxes being under audit. That was already done ten years ago. It's about the IRS finding the large refund he got (~$73 Million) was under false reports of losses. There's no additional auditing involved. His lawyers are probably arguing the case for those deductions, maybe with some back and forth, but maybe just some waiting for replies. The IRS can be very slow giving responses to legal appeals.


I wonder if Cohn slipped these papers to the Times? It might have nothing to do with the state case.


Back to will people care? A couple of Trump's reruns won't play well this go round.

Trump: "People will be amazed at how much tax I paid when the audit is over and they see my returns."​

Yeah.. no, that's not playing well, we know what the audit is about.

Trump: "We have a great health care plan."​

This BS is going to be attacked by Biden and the Democrats. Wait for the question to come up in the debate in two days.

Trump: "... the wall..."​

Nuff said. 60 Minutes has a piece on tonight exposing Trump paying more than a billion to a company that has built a very shabby wall (which I guess would be revising the existing wall).
 
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Introversion

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If anyone would rather listen than read about what’s in the NYT article and what means, Cenk Uygur of The Young Turks show breaks it down:

https://youtu.be/OC-23kldIp8

TL;DR: “Trump’s Taxes Revealed: He’s Broke!” and why that & the corruption revealed are a huge national security risk.
 

Kaiser-Kun

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While the commenters on CNN are reacting exactly the way we thought, some people claim their conservative friends are reacting with disgust and might even vote Biden now. I guess there's a difference between summoning Satan and watching him enter through the front door.

On any case, I wouldn't underestimate these news. Remember, tax evasion is what they got Al Capone for.
 

Kaiser-Kun

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Wouldn't be grand if Trump & family fled to Russia?

-cb

Even better if he's judged, imprisoned and then dies of syphilis. But you made me think. How do you guys think Putin would receive Trump if he was no longer useful?
 
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Introversion

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Even better if he's judged, imprisoned and then dies of syphilis. But you made me think. How do you guys think Putin would receive Trump if he was no longer useful?

In whatever manner would most damage the US, probably. Like, perhaps release those pee tapes, to disenchant Trump’s followers n hopes they never vote again?

Hmm...
 

Brightdreamer

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Wait. How useful would a submissive ex-POTUS be useful to ex-KGB Putin?

-cb

Though I'm sure the thought never crosses the WH occupant's mind, it's always looked to me like he is a figurehead and cover for the deeper corruption/destruction that's taking place... and he is ultimately disposable. He already has a cult that worships him in a very literal sense... what would they do, what damage would they wreak, what fanaticism would they be driven to, were he to be martyred to the cause? Drop that figurative bomb in the middle of an already-reeling and divided country, and we blow apart at the seams.
 

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In whatever manner would most damage the US, probably. Like, perhaps release those pee tapes, to disenchant Trump’s followers n hopes they never vote again?

Hmm...

I doubt even the pee tapes would phase them at this point. They'd find a positive spin (alpha males pee on women, didn't you know) or if he was the recipient, they'd dismiss it as fake news.

That's the dragon the Right has by the tail. I've no doubt many of them thought he was a useful idiot they could control, a sledgehammer. And he's about to deliver by finally getting the SCOTUS to 6-3 and neutralizing that annoying tendency for even conservative justices to occasionally side with the liberal wing on some matters dear to them (like abortion or the rights of LGBTQ people). But they can't openly oppose him, even on matters that might give some of them pause, because the Republican base adores him, and the tea party movement already showed what happens to more moderate Republicans who reach across the aisle when the party "base" is riled up.
 

Lyv

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I guess defunding the police (and military, first responders, police, roads, etc) is ok if you do it by cheating on your taxes.

The whole family belongs in prison.

Don't miss the Ivanka Trump bombshell buried in the Times tax story

So consider what we know, according to the Times reporting.1) In at least two deals -- hotels in Hawaii and Vancouver, Ivanka Trump appears to have double-dipped -- serving as both a project manager in her official capacity as a senior staffer for her father's company and as a "consultant" to those same projects.

2) In those deals, Ivanka Trump's apparent categorization as a "consultant" allowed her father to write off three-quarters of a million dollars. (The IRS allows "consulting fees" to be written off as business expenses.)

Which is, well, pretty bad. (The Trump Organization's lawyer offered no comment or explanation for the setup to the Times.)
But it appears as though the Times may only have found the tip of the iceberg here.

Why? Because of the $26 million that Trump wrote off as "consulting fees" between 2010 and 2018, none is allocated to any specific person or entity. (The Times figured out the $747,622 payment by matching an amount paid in Trump's tax returns to the same sum reported by Ivanka Trump on her financial disclosure forms filed when she went to work in the White House in 2017.)
So we don't know who received the other $25-ish million that Trump wrote off to "consulting fees" during that time. (Worth noting: The Times reports that Trump wrote off roughly 20% of all income he made on projects over that time to "consulting fees.")

Given the apparent payment to Ivanka Trump revealed by the Times, however, it's not terribly far-fetched to wonder whether all (or much) of those "consulting fees" went through a similar process: Paid to one of Trump's offspring who were serving as both managers of these operations for the Trump Organization and as consultants to the projects as well.
 

Roxxsmom

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cbenoi1

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{...}is ok if you do it by cheating on your taxes.

They have defrauded a ton of people besides the IRS, and pushed cases into the courts in the hopes the other party will bail out or negotiate a lower settlement. You can say the Trumps have mastered the use of courts and the delays herein to their advantage over the years. How many times Congress wanted to hold the WH (and Trump) accountable and it ends up in court?

It's sort of a Ponzi scheme.

-cb
 

Gregg

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If you guys are unhappy that Trump hasn't paid enough taxes and if the IRS has not penalized him for underpayment of taxes, then you should blame the tax code, not Trump.
Anybody here paying more than required by the tax code? I'm not.