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White Lion Literary

liritha

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They've liked both my #PitDark and #DvPit tweets but so far, I've refrained from querying them.

The agency is brand new and I can't find any information about them or their literary agent (Tatiana Liard). She claims she's interned as an editor for several presses, including Entangled Press - I know they're legit (I think?) thought there are some issues with them. It doesn't look like she interned for a literary agent so I'm wary of the experience she cites.

The agency seems very active on Twitter and they've already signed at least one author. On one hand, I wouldn't want to not give a legit agent a chance - we all start somewhere, right? But I'm just getting a bit of an iffy vibe from the White Lion Literary's website, as well as the non-existent online presence. But maybe I'm bad at Googling, so I thought I'd ask here.

Has anyone heard of them or Tatiana Liard?

Website: http://www.whitelionliterary.com/
 

Sonya Heaney

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All I could find was a link to their website and that Twitter account. I know that a lot of editors (including those I've worked with) have low online profiles, but shouldn't there be *something* on the internet about a literary agent?

The FAQs page talks about we, but there's only one agent listed. I'd be holding back for now.

Edit: Yes, Entangled Publishing (not Press as the agency's website says) is very legitimate. The controversy was that they signed some authors who'd been banned from Amazon. (And then unsigned them? I stopped following around about then.)
 
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waylander

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In all honesty I am not convinced. People who successfully start their own agencies have generally worked as agents for a while with a larger agency giving them a track record of having sold books to major publishers. They often bring a roster of clients with them. Having been an intern for a few smaller publishers does not give anywhere near the same level of experience.
You need an agent who has a personal relationship with editors in major houses i.e those editors will read their emails and reply to them, will pick up the phone to them etc becuse they know the agent has a track record of delivering good authors.
 

liritha

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In all honesty I am not convinced. People who successfully start their own agencies have generally worked as agents for a while with a larger agency giving them a track record of having sold books to major publishers.

Yeah, from my research (including lots of interviews with agents), this is the impression I've gotten. You can start out on your own and establish your own agency, but unless you already have the connections (read: have interned at another agency), you're not going to go far. I have a friend who signed with a newbie lit agent, but they had decades of editorial experience, including big presses.

You make excellent points, waylander!

Also, I agree with everything Sonya Heaney has said. I'm generally very wary of people with no digital presence, especially in the publishing agency. Thank you both!
 

Sonya Heaney

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People who successfully start their own agencies have generally worked as agents for a while with a larger agency giving them a track record of having sold books to major publishers. They often bring a roster of clients with them. Having been an intern for a few smaller publishers does not give anywhere near the same level of experience.

^^ What I wanted to say, but didn't want to be the first one to say it! ^^

Going from intern with a mid-sized press to running a literary agency is not a logical step to take.
 

Woollybear

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They've liked both my #PitDark and #DvPit tweets but so far, I've refrained from querying them.

The agency is brand new ...

A few more general thoughts... about new agencies but also small presses... I don't disagree with anything above--

When I was in a similar situation (questionable agency, etc) I went to the twitter account to see how many likes they had passed out during those parties and whether there was any coherence to the pattern of likes they gave.

A few likes from them that day, and all on environmental tweets? I moved forward.

A ton, ton, ton of scattershot likes? Like, six hundred likes? I said hell no.

You can get a sense from their likes.

Of course, checking the agency (or small press) is a good idea too. I followed up on three of about eight such likes (also an agent like from an establishedagency) and ignored the other six. All resulted in good intel for my project. Two ended in a pass on their end, and the third (small press, not new agency) was slowly wending toward acceptance but I pulled my submission because the press, despite looking strong and staffed competently, was too new for my comfort and I'd heard too many horror stories here of all the ways things could go south.

Anyway, my suggestion is (1) check their other likes to get the lay of their philosophy on the pitch parties (<- my biggest thought on this whole pitmad thing) and (2) if you query there's no guarantee anyway, especially if they handed out eighty likes or more, a lot of times it ends in R anyway. But there is a potential and real upside to dipping your toe in. You are more likely to get feedback on these queries than cold ones.
 
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mrsmig

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Speaking from my own somewhat bitter experience, someone whose background in publishing is limited to editing for a small publisher does NOT make for a good agent.

First and foremost, agents need be able to identify if a manuscript is marketable. Then they need to be familiar enough with the market and its trends to know where to pitch the manuscript. To do that effectively they need established contacts within those markets. They need to know how to SELL. Knowing how to edit a manuscript doesn't necessarily translate to knowing how to sell a manuscript.

The only way I'd sign with a brand-new agent would be if that individual had worked for an established agent/agency. That's how you learn the agent's side of the trade.
 

leopardy

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Darn. I came here hoping to find a little more. I really am surprised there isn't more on Tatiana Liard out on the interwebs. I wish that anyone who is currently working with White Lion Literary would come on here and tell us how things are going for them. Or anyone who has worked with Tatiana Liard in the past could give insight on the potential this person has for leading an agency.
 

Clairels

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Darn. I came here hoping to find a little more. I really am surprised there isn't more on Tatiana Liard out on the interwebs. I wish that anyone who is currently working with White Lion Literary would come on here and tell us how things are going for them. Or anyone who has worked with Tatiana Liard in the past could give insight on the potential this person has for leading an agency.

What more were you hoping to find? This thread establishes that she has no experience as an agent, no track record of sales, and no web presence. The lack of information IS the information.
 
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waylander

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If she was a good agent she would be all over the web
 

mikepellegrini

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Another good tell is that her website is not professionally done. There's a pop-up on the page, "This site designed with the Wix.com website builder..." That's a do-it-yourself website builder that Wix offers with its hosting accounts. The site (despite the lack of real info on it) looks good, but I'll lay odds Tatiana made it herself. That's not confidence inspiring.