LGBTQ+ YA and Male Protagonists

Drascus

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Curious to see if anyone has some insight on the publishing world's take on LGBT+ YA.

I'm writing my second book, a YA novel with a male protagonist. I'm 12,000 words in only to discover that 50% of the YA readership is female, and doesn't really like male protagonists.

That isn't the end of the world, I can finish this book for practice, or write another of the many ideas that I have. However I'm curious to know if the readership is more open to male protagonists if they are LGBTQ+.

The protagonist of my novel is queer. The book is about establishing identity and that's a big chunk of it. At the beginning of the novel he has the 'default' assumption that he should be heterosexual and by the middle he will realize that it's not really working for him.

The book doesn't end with him getting the boy, or perfectly figuring out his orientation / identity. There is romance, but it's more "going on dates" than "starting a relationship".

Any one have thoughts, knowledge, or data about publishing trends on this?
 

Ariel.Williams

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I’m no expert on YA publishing, but I have read a lot of YA and plenty of it has had male protagonists. I’ve also read a lot of YA with male lgbtq protagonists like Aristotle and Dante Discover the Secrets of the Universe and We are the Ants. I don’t know if that helps.
 

Drascus

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I got that information from a lecture given by a published YA novelist. It was a few years back so maybe that information is dated?

Either way, thanks for the reply / encouragement! Maybe I'm just taking one person's opinion too seriously, even if it is a professional one. Hopefully there are some statistics online about readership demographics or publishing trends that I can find.
 

AW Admin

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There's a huge emphasis on own voices, and the "coming out" story is not as much of a thing as it was even ten years ago.

Have you read much recent YA? Your question suggests you need to read a lot more recent YA.
 
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Drascus

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Thanks for the feedback. :)

It's not a coming out story, I'm not even sure if the protagonist will come out or not. It's a story about a kid trying to be all things to all people and realizing that doing that means abandoning his friends and ideals. Ideals he doesn't realize he has until he abandons them.

I have not read as much recent YA as I would like. I haven't read as much recently as I would like period. Currently reading Children of Blood and Bone.
 

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Couple things:

1. As many people have said, following trends is generally a fool's errand. The books that are hot right now are often yesterday's trends as far as acquisitions are concerned. IMO, writing a book you love - regardless of whether the topic is popular right now - is going to give you a much more powerful end product than if you pretzel yourself to adhere to some imposed niche.

2. I don't know who your author was, but IME most authors have a skewed, at best, view of the market. What makes me suspicious of what your author said was the statement about young women not really liking male protagonists. My understanding is there's data pointing to the reverse, but I've never heard of girls avoiding books about boys. Which doesn't mean it's not true, but I'd definitely want to know where she got that idea.

Bottom line, though, is that your typical author isn't going to have much insight into why their work is marketed the way it is, and if the marketing campaign is successful, everybody's going to read cause and effect into it. It is (once again, IME, which is limited) a whole lot more complicated than that.

I can tell you, as a parent, that sexuality and coming out are very much on the minds of the YA audience, if not for themselves then for their close friends. It may be a literary "trend," but for many young people, it's a continuing reality. Your story would resonate with the majority of the teens I'm privileged to know. If you're passionate about it, write it.
 

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I need more practice finishing books for sure. My first book is a bit of a mess but after 4 drafts and revision on beta reader feedback I think I need to just query it and write another.

Thanks for providing another perspective. I wasn't ready to toss the book I'm writing out, but I feel a lot better about it now.
 

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I'm writing my second book, a YA novel with a male protagonist. I'm 12,000 words in only to discover that 50% of the YA readership is female, and doesn't really like male protagonists.

I’m confused; doesn’t this mean 50% of the readership is male and does like male protagonists?

In any case, the young adults I know have no such preference, and I just asked my two teenage avid readers to be sure.
 

Drascus

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I’m confused; doesn’t this mean 50% of the readership is male and does like male protagonists?

In any case, the young adults I know have no such preference, and I just asked my two teenage avid readers to be sure.

According to the author giving the lecture, 50% were teenage women, 50% were adults. Her point was that a publisher was not going to want to buy a book that 50% of the potential audience would not be interested in.

I wouldn't change a book to fit demographics, for instance, I would not change my MC's gender. I was drawing on my own queer experience to write him and wouldn't feel comfortable doing that for a young woman. The question was more of, do I want to spend time on this book if it's not marketable.

However looking at the market myself, and after some responses here, it doesn't look like it's as big a deal as that author was making it out to be.
 

lizmonster

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According to the author giving the lecture, 50% were teenage women, 50% were adults. Her point was that a publisher was not going to want to buy a book that 50% of the potential audience would not be interested in.

Really curious where she got her data. Also wondering how she explains Albertalli and Silvera, who both had wildly successful books featuring teenaged boys. (Yeah, I know two data points means nothing, but come on.)

Also (because this lecture I wasn't at is annoying me :)), women read books with male protagonists all the time. For much of our lives, we've had to, because that was the majority of what was on offer. If that balance has tipped overall for YA, hallelujah, but don't tell me women (in aggregate) won't choose to read about men, because that's blatantly false.
 
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Drascus

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Really curious where she got her data. Also wondering how she explains Albertalli and Silvera, who both had wildly successful books featuring teenaged boys. (Yeah, I know two data points means nothing, but come on.)

Also (because this lecture I wasn't at is annoying me :)), women read books with male protagonists all the time. For much of our lives, we've had to, because that was the majority of what was on offer. If that balance has tipped overall for YA, hallelujah, but don't tell me women (in aggregate) won't choose to read about men, because that's blatantly false.

I'm thinking she got her info from her marketing team. This was a guest lecturer on YA writing for Brandon Sanderson's BYU lectures in 2014. I listened to more of it after I'd written my post where she went on to talk about how she's a "LDS Writer". That reinforced the idea that she might be in a bit of a bubble marketing-wise.
 

lizmonster

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I'm thinking she got her info from her marketing team. This was a guest lecturer on YA writing for Brandon Sanderson's BYU lectures in 2014. I listened to more of it after I'd written my post where she went on to talk about how she's a "LDS Writer". That reinforced the idea that she might be in a bit of a bubble marketing-wise.

Okay, I have a guess now who she was. She was probably correct about the readership for her specific work. Personally, while I appreciate wildly successful authors sharing their stories, I don't put much stock in how generalizable their experiences have been. I've had too many experiences myself that were counter to what I hear, and too many people in publishing telling me my experiences are common.

The most important thing, though? Trend/readership-wise, 2014 might as well be the 18th century.

Go forth and write your book. :)
 
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I get so annoyed when people trot out the "50% of readers are wooooooomen/giiiiiiiiiiirls" stat like it's somehow surprising. Like...they know quite a large number of the population is made up of women, right? More than half, but some counts. Leaving aside that a vast, vast majority of readers will happily pick up a book if the MC is a different gender from them, often without even thinking about it. Maybe not this particular author's target audience, but like lizmonster has pointed out, that stuff is not easy to generalize. I say write the book and figure out the target audience afterwards. Much easier that way.

(Apparently I too have strong feelings about this lecture I did not attend :))
 

mccardey

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I'm going to join the club of People With Strong Feelings because I haven't had my coffee yet, and also because if there were rulez we'd all be successful. But mostly because that old reading is for girls/girls only read about girls thing has been so pernicious and has sprung from (and created) so much social bullying.
 
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Roxxsmom

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I can't speak for modern readers, but I'm guessing more than half the YA readership is actually women. I believe girls and women read fiction than boys and men. However, this doesn't mean male protagonists aren't marketable. For one thing, those who market fiction are always trying to increase readership among boys and men. According to this article, about 60% of YA titles are purchased by girls or women, though of course some of this could be women purchasing titles as gifts for teens of both sexes. It's harder to determine who actually reads them. Regardless, there are still plenty of boys who read YA fiction, and I am guessing this is true among LGBTQ readers too.

https://www.thecut.com/2014/06/dudes-who-read-young-adult-fiction.html

Do you know for a fact that girls don't like male protagonists? Has anyone presented actual data to support this statement, or, were they basing their assessment on a personal opinion or simply assuming this must be the case? Because, if we are talking anecdotally, I certainly don't (and didn't as a teen) have a problem with male protagonist if they are complex and multidimensional, and the character isn't filled with unexamined/unchallenged misogyny or sexism. I even know a few girls and women who admit they prefer male protagonists for various reasons.

There are many successful YA writers who are men, and there are successful YA titles with male protagonists.
 
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mccardey

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I believe girls and women read (?more) fiction than boys and men.
I think that is largely due to the bullying received by book-loving boys and men in earlier years (pre-Harry Potter, probably) . It would change more quickly if people didn't endorse the trucks are for boys, dolls are for girls gender restrictions.
 
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According to the author giving the lecture, 50% were teenage women, 50% were adults. Her point was that a publisher was not going to want to buy a book that 50% of the potential audience would not be interested in.

So, no teenage boys read YA novels? Sorry, but I think that's BS.

Listen to Lizmonster.
 

Kjbartolotta

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The only subject on which I have any legitimate expertise: YA and it's readers.

Boys read YA. Boys read YA with girl characters. Boys read. If adults stopped making assumptions about what boys tastes are and solely catering to them based on an antiquated notion of them 'only wanting to read about boys (if they read at all)', it would make the whole world a better place. Thanks for coming to my TEDx Talk.
 
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Animad345

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If young women have a problem with reading novels that have male protagonists, why are the majority of students that study English Literature female? (I'm not sure about internationally, but this is definitely the case in the UK).

When I was sixteen, those who chose to study English Literature had to read The History Boys, a play. It was a majority (by far) female class and no one complained about the fact that all the protagonists were male and that there were only two women characters, with small roles. I mean, just look at the title! Women of all ages are totally used to reading books with male main characters. For years, the literary canon was only made up of male writers whose novels featured male protagonists more often than not.

I don't think that young men who like to read have a problem with female protagonists. I strongly recall The Hunger Games being an absolute favourite of one of my male classmates, who even wore a badge which referenced the book. As far as I can see, it was popular with both sexes anyway, and the main character was of course female.

Sorry for the mini-rant; it's a topic I've been thinking about for a long time!
 

Drascus

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If young women have a problem with reading novels that have male protagonists, why are the majority of students that study English Literature female? (I'm not sure about internationally, but this is definitely the case in the UK).

When I was sixteen, those who chose to study English Literature had to read The History Boys, a play. It was a majority (by far) female class and no one complained about the fact that all the protagonists were male and that there were only two women characters, with small roles. I mean, just look at the title! Women of all ages are totally used to reading books with male main characters. For years, the literary canon was only made up of male writers whose novels featured male protagonists more often than not.

I don't think that young men who like to read have a problem with female protagonists. I strongly recall The Hunger Games being an absolute favourite of one of my male classmates, who even wore a badge which referenced the book. As far as I can see, it was popular with both sexes anyway, and the main character was of course female.

Sorry for the mini-rant; it's a topic I've been thinking about for a long time!

This is all anecdotal, but I've always loved female protagonists. The MC of my first completed novel is female. My voracious reading started with Tamora Pierce and Robin McKinley.

I'm really glad to see any genre with a shift toward female protagonists. There is plenty of male-dominated media out there.
 

Kjbartolotta

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I don't think that young men who like to read have a problem with female protagonists. I strongly recall The Hunger Games being an absolute favourite of one of my male classmates, who even wore a badge which referenced the book. As far as I can see, it was popular with both sexes anyway, and the main character was of course female.

This is all anecdotal, but I've always loved female protagonists. The MC of my first completed novel is female. My voracious reading started with Tamora Pierce and Robin McKinley.

I'm really glad to see any genre with a shift toward female protagonists. There is plenty of male-dominated media out there.

To some extent, I don't even ascribe any nobility or excessive self-awareness to young men who read stories with female protagonists; for me it was as simple as 'wow this MC is really strong and cool I'm into in'.

What I largely see is that adults tend to coddle boys excessively and instinctively lean in to the idea that boys only want to read about boys. And, while on some level I'm defensive about the inner lives of young men, boys who don't want to read about different lived experiences can either learn to do better or kick rocks down the road. It's really the parents fault, after ten years of begging them to buy YA with female characters for their sons I'm pretty confident of this. I've also very much seen the opposite, parents convinced their daughters only want female characters.

I run a YA books club at my work and it's given me all kind of interesting data points. For the record, it does tend to be mostly girls talking about books with female characters, I try my best to include boys wherever possible but am pretty supportive of the idea that it's going to be predominantly a space for young women. Again, boys can suck it up.

I just see constantly the way adults tend to unwittingly reinforce these bad stereotypes and give no option towards confronting them.
 
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Drascus

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To some extent, I don't even ascribe any nobility or excessive self-awareness to young men who read stories with female protagonists; for me it was as simple as 'wow this MC is really strong and cool I'm into in'.

What I largely see is that adults tend to coddle boys excessively and instinctively lean in to the idea that boys only want to read about boys. And, while on some level I'm defensive about the inner lives of young men, boys who don't want to read about different lived experiences can either learn to do better or kick rocks down the road. It's really the parents fault, after ten years of begging them to buy YA with female characters for their sons I'm pretty confident of this. I've also very much seen the opposite, parents convinced their daughters only want female characters.

I run a YA books club at my work and it's given me all kind of interesting data points. For the record, it does tend to be mostly girls talking about books with female characters, I try my best to include boys wherever possible but am pretty supportive of the idea that it's going to be predominantly a space for young women. Again, boys can suck it up.

I just see constantly the way adults tend to unwittingly reinforce these bad stereotypes and give no option towards confronting them.

I'm really glad that no one gave me any flack about reading the authors I mentioned when I was in elementary school. I would have missed out on some amazing stories. Parents end up with weird expectations for their children, it's one of the things I'm trying the hardest to avoid in my own parenting. They can be whatever kind of person they want as long as they aren't assholes. :D
 

KimJo

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When I was actually writing and getting published (been about 3 years now since I stopped), I wrote YA fiction. Some was LGBTQIA, some not. The majority of my published novels had male protagonists. I did have trouble finding readers, but that was more due to my own inability to promote/market my books, and some issues with my publishers, than with the fact that the novels were about teenage boys.

Even if the majority of readers of YA are teenage girls, in my (anecdotal) experience, girls don't have much issue reading books about boys. I haven't known any teenage girls who would reject reading a novel because the protagonist was male instead of female...or, for that matter, because the protagonist was any other gender; characters and readers aren't only male or female.

But I also found that, for myself and for a number of other YA authors I knew, particularly those who wrote for the same publishers as I did, the majority of our readership were actually women in their 30s-50s. And again, it didn't matter what gender the protagonist was.