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Amount of Humor in Non-Humor Fiction

Klope3

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Sometimes, fiction is dark. There are probably novels out there that are purely gloom-and-doom all the way through, and I'm sure that works well sometimes. But my intuition, as well as a fair amount of advice I've read, says that for the vast majority of fiction, a little bit of humor is a good thing. There doesn't have to be a funny moment every chapter, or even every few chapters, but a bit of laughter (or a quiet chuckle, or even just a lighthearted smile) can help the reader connect emotionally with the characters in a way they might not have otherwise. Plus, it's a nice reprieve from the more stressful parts of the plot, and serves as contrast to make the subsequent stressful parts feel even more harrowing.

But in fiction that doesn't focus on humor, how much humor should be included? I know this will vary from author to author, but it would still be helpful to have a general idea of what works well. In your favorite works of fiction, how much humor is there? Are the funny moments laughter-inducing, or just mildly amusing? And how did the inclusion of humor affect your overall experience of the story?
 

veinglory

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The is no limit to how much humor can be in a non-humor book, the amount of romance in a non-romance book, the amount of crime in a non-mystery. Not even the amount of sex in a non-erotica. Genre is more defined by the 'point' of the book than the amount of stuff in it.
 

SwallowFeather

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I find the basic concept of comic relief to be helpful. I don't necessarily like when one character is the designated comic relief (b/c it tends to mean we don't take him/her seriously) but I like the "relief" concept itself: when things have been pretty intense for awhile, time to work in a laugh or two to let off the tension.

I personally put as much humor as possible into my books. This isn't much, b/c my story instincts are very serious and I basically suck at humor, so I know I'm never going to go overboard. And really, if you're able to do more than I am--I mean if your humor's also actually good, if it'll get a genuine laugh--I don't see how you could go wrong using as much of it as you can. As long as you don't sacrifice genuine, important emotional moments for it. Getting us to laugh in between the big moments opens us up so that when the moment hits we may cry... but don't sacrifice the moment itself for a cheap laugh.

(What makes a laugh cheap, I don't know if I could explain. Like I said, I suck at humor.)
 

Kjbartolotta

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I'm a big fan of the funny, but it never really happens for me intentionally so much as if I think of something funny about the scene, I pounce on it. I have a hard time with everything in between, I've learned writing comedy has given me a good handle on writing horror.
 

Woollybear

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But in fiction that doesn't focus on humor, how much humor should be included? I know this will vary from author to author, but it would still be helpful to have a general idea of what works well. In your favorite works of fiction, how much humor is there? Are the funny moments laughter-inducing, or just mildly amusing? And how did the inclusion of humor affect your overall experience of the story?

For what it's worth, one of the books I've been reading is The Comic Toolbox (to get a little more humor into my stories). It's a decent book--makes the point that writing funny is like anything else--you can learn it and practice it.

I feel like one funny character in a cast (funny as in quirky / says amusing things) is about right. I've always enjoyed when those characters are developed and used well.
 
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Klope3

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For what it's worth, one of the books I've been reading is The Comic Toolbox (to get a little more humor into my stories). It's a decent book--makes the point that writing funny is like anything else--you can learn it and practice it.

This might be what I need! I've seen a lot of people say that "the humor just happens," but I don't want to rely on anything in my writing "just happening." I want to be able to consciously design everything. Too much room for accidents otherwise.
 

katfeete

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It really depends on the writer. I have some favorites (Terry Pratchett, Lois McMaster Bujold) who have me howling with laughter for half the story, and other favorites (Ursula LeGuin, China Mieville) who might make me crack one quiet smile in a book. It’s a style question, not a content question, and everyone’s style will vary. Sometimes, style isn't even something you have conscious control over. My first novel was a dark, gritty cyberpunk with a genetically-engineered super-assassin MC* and all my beta readers told me “hey, this book is really funny.” I didn’t take it well at first, but I have come to accept my fate.

As far as humor in a narrative goes, as with everything else, it’s all about what you want to do. Laughter is a natural defense we deploy in the face of surprise, a way of controlling cognitive dissonance before it overwhelms us. This can work for you, as a writer, or against you. There’s a climatic moment in the Firefly movie that I’ve seen Whedon characterize smugly in interviews as increasing the seriousness by showing people “anyone can die”, investing them in the stakes, and make them hang breathlessly on the last scenes of the movie. But in the theatre I was in, the whole audience erupted in laughter. And they kept laughing and cracking jokes for the rest of the movie, tittering through all the high-tension, high-stakes scenes. The moment was so surprising, so out of left field, that it broke immersion and ruined not only that moment but all the moments after — a remarkable banana peel for someone who made the phrase “sudden but inevitable” famous to step on.

So laughter can be a sign you’ve screwed up, that you haven’t foreshadowed something well enough to make it believable. But it can also be used to make the story more real. One of my favorite Pratchett moments is a scene at the end of Going Postal. We’re given just enough information to realize the hero has pulled off a last-minute reversal and against all odds, may have won — and then before telling us how he pulled it off, Pratchett spends a few paragraphs on the wizards who are using this climactic moment as an excuse to hit the buffet before the crowds of less serious eaters can get there:

The Lecturer in Recent Runes ladled more bacon bits into his salad bowl, having artfully constructed buttresses of celery and breastworks of cabbage to increase its depth five times.

“Any of you fellows know what this is all about?” he said, raising his voice above the din.

I am not so bold timing-wise as Pratchett, but a reminder that not everyone in your story sees the hero’s goals as paramount or even particularly noteworthy is one of the easiest ways to add depth and believability to a story, and humor is one of the most subtle and concise ways to achieve it. In this case humor doesn’t break the tension, it increases it. That the wizards consider dinner more important than the plot is surprising but, well... inevitable.

I think it’s also worth noting that there’s a difference between character humor and narrative humor that people often trip over. Jokes characters tell each other may or may not be funny to the reader, because being funny to the reader isn’t their purpose; their purpose is to establish a character as the kind of person who cracks jokes, and other characters as the kind who find that joke funny (or don’t). Conversely, what makes readers laugh the most are things a character says or does quite seriously — they’re funny because they’re out of tune with the narrative, not because anyone was telling a “joke”.

So a comic relief character is someone who takes themselves seriously, but that the narrative constantly encourages readers to laugh at. Sometimes -- if the character is absurd because of the power they hold, for example, or because they're selfish and petty, or both -- it can work. But it's inherently cruel, and often, it says more about who the writer thinks it's OK to bully than the writer would like. Think for a minute about *cringe* JarJar Binks. He wasn't a petty character with petty goals; he wanted to save his people. So why was he "funny"? Because he was clumsy, because he talked in broken English, because he was a backwoods hick. It's okay to laugh at those kind of people, they deserve it. Ever notice how often Hollywood comic relief is a black man or a fat woman?

Yeah. "Funny", isn't it.

Laughter is powerful, and like all powerful things, it's dangerous. But used well, it's an amazing tool for making worlds and characters come alive.



* I was twenty, okay.
 

The Black Prince

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I naturally include humour in my stories - which tend to be fairly dark.

Two short points I'd make: someone above said that just one comic relief person is about right for humour in a non-humour story. I would disagree with that - mainly as when you think about normal conversations IRL, the humour tends to be shared around. It would feel weird to me if just one person was making all the jokes - people tend to bounce off each other with humour.

The other point - far more important - never try to force the humour. If what you write isn't naturally funny, then no amount of tricks or techniques will make it so. No-one who tries to be funny...is funny.
 

indianroads

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^^^^^ that.

Pay attention to everyday conversations. Some people even joke during stressful situations- an old friend was a Sergeant in the Rangers and would talk about loving the service when he was running for the helicopter as bullets flew through the jungle around him. People joke all the time, for many it’s a form of stress relief, or it just lightens the conversation.

What I’m suggesting is that you mimic your characters after what you encounter in real life.
 

SwallowFeather

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^^^^^ that.

Pay attention to everyday conversations. Some people even joke during stressful situations- an old friend was a Sergeant in the Rangers and would talk about loving the service when he was running for the helicopter as bullets flew through the jungle around him. People joke all the time, for many it’s a form of stress relief, or it just lightens the conversation.

What I’m suggesting is that you mimic your characters after what you encounter in real life.

I agree. This is what my humor ends up being like. My best joke this round is while planning a risky mission: "They're not just going to come in shooting if they see a woman there." "I dunno--pretty progressive, those Communists..."
 

Woollybear

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Re: Shared humour--My experience is completely unlike this.

There's a class clown, and then there are the rest of us. That's always been my experience and it reads true to me when authors handle it this way. Of course, they need to do a good job with it, and what one person finds funny another will not.

It's subjective, like they say.
 
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The Black Prince

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There are class clowns and class clowns. I tend to think of the stand alones as unfunny try-too-hards...the genuinely funny people tend to have friends who are also funny.
 

Kat M

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People have different levels and styles of humor.

At work we have one person who makes raunchy jokes; other people enjoy it and bounce off of her, but she's always the instigator. A lot of us share "kid funnies" because we all have that in common. I have a tendency to show up to work in a [redacted animal] suit at the slightest provocation and for some reason people laugh.

So your writing may include one class clown, but another character might have a penchant for darkly hilarious mutterings, and they all might enjoy a good pratfall.
 

frimble3

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I think that 'class clown' has an element of performance in it, of <em>conciousness</em> of 'being funny'. The person who is always 'on'. Who makes the obvious funny crack, who does physical humor fearlessly, who pushes any joke a little too far. They are the 'class' clown because the class gives them a captive audience. They're fun if you aren't trying to concentrate, and as long as they don't get nasty, or pick on one person or topic. <br>
But, they can be tiresome. <br>
<br>
Then there are people who are 'just funny'. They don't go through a mental file of 'jokes for any occasion'. They see things differently. Their brains make connections that most people's don't, and that skewed view comes of as 'funny' sometimes in a 'Ha-ha' way, sometimes in a 'A-ha' way. But they're not trying, it's just their way. When they make a 'joke' you listen, because it's going to be 'different'. <br>
<br>
 
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The Black Prince

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But if you've ever been subjected to the class clown who isn't funny...

My god! It is so painful.

This person tends to be funny for reasons other than those they intend and can be a good source of humour in literature. Lieutenant Dan in Good Morning Vietnam was an excellent example. He, who when being sacked from the radio show, uttered the immortal line:

"Sir...deep in my heart...I know I'm funny."