Leaving a carthorse standing hitched up in the snow... how OK is that, for how long?

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SwallowFeather

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So I've go this farmer who just made a food delivery to a sort of boardinghouse, and the cook there presses him to stay for a cup of coffee. Matter of ten minutes probably. (An important story needs to be told in his presence in the kitchen.) It's currently snowing (not bitter cold but enough for snow obvsly) and it's coming up on dusk.

Now this guy made the delivery with a horse & cart. It's not mentioned, b/c my POV character's been indoors the whole time, but realistically in my set-up there's no other way he made that delivery. Am I right in supposing that unless he's a real jerk to his horse (and he can't be, he's meant to be an over-the-top kind character) there's no way he'll leave it out there for ten minutes just so he can kick back with a cup of joe? Would it be much more OK as long as he, I don't know, threw a horse blanket over it, or am I grasping at straws here??

And I'm sure unhitching the horse (I don't really think the boardinghouse has a barn anyhow, it's not a time when everyone's got horses, just the poorer farmers & deliverymen) would be way too much work for this kind of moment, so that's out.

Boy, if only I'd mentioned the darn horse in the narration, I would have realized the problem before this...

Thanks for any help!
 

jclarkdawe

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A horse who has been out for the winter would have a coat that is immune to most cold and snow. I've seen a couple of inches of snow on a horse just sitting there. That's because the coat is so thick the heat of the horse doesn't melt the snow.

Only problem I'd see is if the horse is hot and sweaty, in which case I'd throw a blanket over the horse. But cart horses usually don't do the type of exertion that causes them to become hot and sweaty.

Horses were used to standing around. Look at the hitching posts in most Westerns. I'd make the coffee a regular occurrence. Cart horses in cities would frequently have the timing of the route down pat, and would wait while the driver was getting coffee, beer, or whatever.

Jim
 

SwallowFeather

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Yeah, I knew standing around was normal, it's the snow that was worrying me, b/c I do know sweating & chilling can be a problem. Hm. It's an area with bitter winters, so it would have spent plenty of time in a barn... I don't know exactly how they did it. Still, it makes sense that it would have a pretty good coat, I imagine? (It's March at this point so it certainly would've had time.) The horse might be a bit sweaty due to having to get the cart unstuck at one point; I think it'll only help my character's nice-guy image if I have him throw a blanket over the horse in case.

What you say is really encouraging, in any case. Thanks so much for your expertise & responding right away! Now I can continue this scene tomorrow w/o a lot of rearranging.
 

jclarkdawe

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Blanket would most likely be the one the driver used to keep himself warm. It would not be a fancy horse blanket. But most of the time there would be no blanket at all. Driver might throw his coat over the horse. Driver might carry a feed bag and that's definitely a possibility for keeping the horse warm, as well as not bored. But if this was a regular stop, the horse would expect to have to wait here.

Why did the cart get stuck? Most likely cause would be mud, but that indicates warmer weather. Frozen ground is actually somewhat hard to get stuck on. Horse would have winter shoes on, which do better at biting into the ground than the summer shoes. There were a bunch of different approaches to winter shoes.

If the horse was urban, it probably spent the night in a stall, but it would have spent the days outside. It would be used to the cold and unlikely to be clipped.

Jim
 

SwallowFeather

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Thanks again!

Why did the cart get stuck? Most likely cause would be mud, but that indicates warmer weather. Frozen ground is actually somewhat hard to get stuck on. Horse would have winter shoes on, which do better at biting into the ground than the summer shoes. There were a bunch of different approaches to winter shoes.

I was thinking fresh snow piling up faster than expected. They'd been having a thaw & then it started snowing like crazy. Could actually be mud under it in places, come to think of it--I've seen that, weird though it is. (Though was it under fresh snow? Maybe not.) But yeah, come to think of it, without the mud, fresh snow would just slow you down, wouldn't it? Not get you stuck. (ETA: Which is fine. I just need him to be late.)
 
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WeaselFire

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Makes you wonder what a wild horse does when it snows. Oh yeah, it gets snowy! :)

Horses are used to this. Many deliveries might take longer than ten minutes. But, if it's part of his character, have him leave at an opportune moment by saying "I have to attend to my horse."

Jeff
 

jclarkdawe

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Wild horses will find the lee of a tree break or the sheltered side of a hill. If they can't do that, they turn their butts into the wind and simply deal with it. The herd might drift with the wind. Rarely does it seem to be a big deal in their life. Horses are much more likely than cattle to paw their way through snow to get at graze. As long as they can get through the snow and there's graze underneath, horses will survive.

Horses, although in many ways a very fragile creature, survive the cold and snow very well. Their preferred temperature is around 50 degrees with their summer coat. In the Great Cattle Die-Up of 1886-87 https://truewestmagazine.com/the-great-cattle-die-up/ saw a much higher percentage to the total numbers of cattle deaths to horse deaths. But the ultimate cause of the Die-in was the drought the previous summer and the lack of graze.

Snow removal was very different in the 1800s than now. Cars require a lot better snow removal to keep going then cars. Many cities and towns in heavy snow areas would actually roll and pack the snow rather than removing it. At that point, sleighs would be used. Heavy wagons would remove their wheels and substitute skis. So your first problem here is figuring out how the community dealt with snow. This would be a direct function of snow depth and how much of the season involved snow being on the ground. Below is a snow roller in Vermont in 1841.

VT1941snowroller.jpg


Mud, for wagons, is something else. Mud increases the draw pull (effort to pull the wagon) and will shorten the work time of the horse. But as long as the equation stays relatively constant, the horse will exert a steady pull and the wagon keeps going. The change in the equation happens when the horse can no longer exert that steady pull, and/or when the wagon suddenly goes into a deeper patch of mud.

At that point you're screwed. Rarely you can get some more "oopmf" from the horse, but normally you now have to add supplement force, such as getting off the wagon and pushing, leverage, additional horses or oxen, building up under the wagon, or some combination. Praying and/or swearing doesn't tend to work.

Short version of getting stuck in mud or snow that I've read in novels is about half of them cause me to start laughing. The reality isn't what most people imagine. I'd suggest that rather than have a weather related problem, that you make the previous delivery into a problem such as a new person receiving the items, or whatever.

Jim
 

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Thanks so much again for the good input, jclarkdawe. I'll make sure there's not a silly reason for my guy to be late!

Another question just came up (same farmer, same horse) as I work on another scene. Two questions: a passenger riding on the front of his farm cart with him gets angry & starts yelling. Does this affect the horse at all? I know a horse experienced on the roads has to be used to noise, but I would also give the horse credit for knowing what anger sounds like as opposed to just noise, and this one wouldn't be used to that right behind her reins. (In my rough draft I tentatively have her shake her harness & speed up just a little, making the ride slightly bouncier.) And, what sounds might the driver make to calm her, besides reining her in a bit?
 

jclarkdawe

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This really depends upon the horse. Anger can create an interesting vibe for a horse, but many horses can separate anger directed at them from other anger. Horses are amazingly adept social animals and watching herds of horses communicate with each other can be fascinating.

But it's definitely well within the realm of horse behavior for a horse to spook at the sound of an angry voice.

Horses that are experienced at driving receive a lot of communication through the reins. A reassuring shake of the reins can convey so much more than you'd think to a horse. The driver's calmness can be immensely reassuring to a horse. But verbally a horse can be calmed by a simple "Whoa, boy." Some drivers use humming or singing.

Some will merely start talking to the horse. I remember calming one horse with, "Four score and seven years ago our Fathers brought forth upon ..." It isn't what you say, but how you say it that matters.

The horse would show its reaction to the angry voice by tossing its head which would shake the harness, ears being pinned back, maybe the head snaking out, maybe some jigging in the gait, maybe a stamped food, tail swishing, eyes maybe bulging out. Horses are great as showing their reaction, as this is how they communicate with each other.

Jim Clark-Dawe
 
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