crass role reversal

Depends on where you want to go with the changes in society. If it’s a simple role reversal, where the 75% women are masculinized dudebros in Amazon garb, the comments and specialization are basically a power play. Think ‘piece of meat.’ ‘Flex those pecs sugar!’ ‘Look at that ass.’ ‘I bet you could go all night right baby?’ If there are more complex changes in society, there may realization of the value of men as breeding partners due to reduced supply. Then chastity customs and protective partnering associations show up (Melanie Rawn did a kickass version of this in her Exiles of Ambrai series, which was also an amazing read). Then you have comments like ‘Who let you on the street in that outfit?’ ‘You’re asking for trouble without your covering.’ ‘Who do you belong to sweetness?’ Think ownership. Then you could also go a somewhat more amusing route. Women get lonely too, and while sex is part of that, you could indeed have hordes of affection-starved women shouting things like, ‘Oh, honey, wrap those arms around me and hold me.’ ‘If I get you off the street, would you make me dinner and call me pretty?’ ‘What would it take to get a gorgeous fella like you to buy me roses?’
Or maybe the change in a matriarchal society would be very different. Maybe those comments and beliefs and behaviors - all familiar - would not be repeated because people learn from the past. Sometimes. Maybe research some matriarchal societies and extrapolate technologically advanced society from their basic social mores. Your story sounds interesting and I really hope to see it on shelves someday! Hope this helps!

Why are they taunting him? You need to think about their motivation.

Is he attractive? Does he still have a tendency to dress like a sex worker? (Shirtless, maybe? Bling?) What's their GOAL in being sexually suggestive and/or derogatory?

indianroads said:

My WIP - in early planning stages - involves an isolated society 600 years in the future where, due to the weakness of the Y chromosome, the population demographics have changed to 75% female (obviously leaving 25% male). MC is male - who worked as a prostitute when he was younger, and escaped that to become a gang leader in a dystopian city. Times are changing, and MC and his gang (also 75% female) have to relocate to a new city. The scene in question is that of MC and his gang entering, walking down a wide boulevard, as the current citizens of the city watch, jeer, and taunt.

Ok - here's the question:
What sexually suggestive and/or derogatory things might a bunch of women shout at a male in this circumstance?

So women especially - have fun with this.

Click to expand...

It depends on *him.*

EDIT: If he had a limp he was sensitive about, I'd mock that. If he had a scar somewhere (especially from a woman) I'd mock that. If he was a cuckold I would mock that.Find his weakness, and call it out. /EDIT

So, the best way to set that up is to show earlier the taunt that he reacts to (do it while he's a prostitute) and then have that be his emotional shame (and our vicarious whatever) later.

Separately, read The Power. It's a different premise but the same idea, if that makes sense, and the author does a beautiful job (stunning job) flipping everything that exists in our current power dynamic to the opposite gender.

indianroads said:

Competing gangs are herded onto a single ship - males being rare, many females consider MC as fresh meat. What sort of reception would he get?

Click to expand...

I trip on this a bit. If males are rare - and still necessary on some level - then they're going to be treated as a valuable resource.

indianroads said:

What if they are treated as a commodity instead?

Click to expand...

I'd need to see how you wrote it. But fundamentally I think I'd still have trouble buying men would be harassed. Treated differently? Sure. But if they're seen as an object of any value, I'd expect a strong cultural bias toward overprotectiveness, not crassness.

indianroads said:

These are street gangs were talking about.

Click to expand...

I get that these are people with terrible manners. But when you talk about scarcity, you're not talking about a simple inversion of real-world male/female cultural norms. Women aren't scarce in our world.

You can no doubt make this work, but as a reader I'd need a better reason then "horny street gang."

indianroads said:

If you control a person as you would a commodity, you can farm them out as a pimp does, but to make babies or for companionship.

Click to expand...

I'm just saying that for me as a reader this only works if the commodity is plentiful. Yes, they can be objects sold or rented, but as a constrained resource there would be a strong social incentive to avoid damage. Think bird in a gilded cage.

Like I said, though, I haven't read it! You're probably selling it fine on the page.

Don't see why you can't have both. Are some gangs more prominent than others? If a guy falls into the hands of the leader of a major gang, he's in the 'bird in the golden cage' situation - safe, but not free. If he escapes into the clutches of some random woman who wants a kid, or heterosexual sex, he's in trouble. He can only hope that, like his previous owner, she's going to keep him for her own use.
As to why a woman in a position of power would want a guy, aside from sexual novelty, it's probably as a show of power and position - "There are only X number of men around, and I've got one." Under some circumstances this might lead to the men being pawns in negotiations, or to being killed, either as a show of disdain, or simply to deprive the owner of an asset.
Also, what tech is available? Is artificial insemination possible, in-vitreo or egg-transplant? Because if the population is so low that all the survivors from a massive fleet can be housed on one ship, a man might be part of a forced-breeding program. Especially if one of the leaders wants a population made up of her kinswomen. A number of her gang-members are detailed to serve as substitute wombs for her children, while the Guy is used as sperm donor for everyone who wants to serve the cause by giving birth. (Yes, genetically this isn't sound, but it sounds as though things are pretty dire in any case.)

I think you gave a reason for the taunting and the nature of the taunt in your first post -- he has a Y chromosome that has weakened over the years. Therefore, the women's taunts would be along these lines -- "genetic weakling" "Y-gene pussy" etc.

indianroads said:

My WIP - in early planning stages - involves an isolated society 600 years in the future where, due to the weakness of the Y chromosome, the population demographics have changed to 75% female (obviously leaving 25% male). MC is male - who worked as a prostitute when he was younger, and escaped that to become a gang leader in a dystopian city. Times are changing, and MC and his gang (also 75% female) have to relocate to a new city. The scene in question is that of MC and his gang entering, walking down a wide boulevard, as the current citizens of the city watch, jeer, and taunt.

Ok - here's the question:
What sexually suggestive and/or derogatory things might a bunch of women shout at a male in this circumstance?

So women especially - have fun with this.

Click to expand...

indianroads said:

That could work - but I'm going for something more in line with what women endure these days.

Click to expand...

I'm not understanding why women would jeer at and taunt him in a suggestive way, I don't think. Women don't tend to do that now -- why would they once women are, presumably, in charge?

indianroads said:

That could work - but I'm going for something more in line with what women endure these days.

Click to expand...

But these days women are not a rare commodity which is one of the reasons they endure what they currently endure — one of the main reasons being as they are seen as disposable.

Slightly different angle but in Gilead (Handmaid's Tale), fertile women are considered a rare commodity hence why only Commander's are allowed to use them because of their high rank. These women's bodies are being requisitioned and are not theirs anymore but they are always watched and at the same time they are treated carefully in the sense that if they need to be punished they would rather cut a Handmaid's hand or take an eye or anything that doesn't endanger her ability to procreate. They will think very careful before killing one. Street gangs are not a religious dictatorship but still a commodity is still something that is handle carefully so as a reader I am like Lizmonster and would find it difficult to understand why they would debase and taunt them, unless they don't need men to reproduce but then I don't see why they would be a commodity.

I hope this helps.

indianroads said:

So women especially - have fun with this.

Click to expand...

indianroads said:

The wife of a friend of mine used to work in a strip club - and she has said that on 'ladies night' when they brought in male strippers for entertainment, the women customers were far more raucous and out of control than their male counterparts. So I know this sort of thing can happen.

Click to expand...

I'm suspicious of a flat gender flip of the concept to start with, and these comments are doing nothing to reassure me that I'd enjoy reading your take on it. Harassment isn't fun. I'm not a vindictive a-hole that would leap at the chance to humiliate someone else just because I have the chance at it. If you imagine women would would en masse react that way, I've already got a fundamental problem with your take.

The strip club comparison actually does not support that view, either. Think this through—do you really think the power dynamic is the same for a female stripper with an audience of men than for a male stripper with an audience of women?

cornflake said:

I'm not understanding why women would jeer at and taunt him in a suggestive way, I don't think. Women don't tend to do that now -- why would they once women are, presumably, in charge?

Click to expand...

Yeah, this. You could probably find isolated cases, but they aren't typical, and again, the power dynamic is wildly different.

So, my point is, a straight-up gender flip where the roles and behaviors are completely swapped with no change or nuance is not the best you can do with this. Especially not in a scenario like you describe where men are less common, and therefore more valuable on an individual basis.

indianroads said:

I don't believe that rarity necessarily equates to respect, especially when the rare thing is considered a commodity. Rare is also a relative term - 1 out of 4 or 5 is scarce but not exceedingly so. The jeers aren't related to rarity, but from the view that men are only good for one thing - and when one seizes power from a respected woman, he's hated.

Click to expand...

Not sure if this was in response to my post, but in case it was. In my example, rarity doesn't equal respect. Gilead doesn't respect Handmaids, but if you have issues making making babies and you have a human incubator, i.e. a fertile woman they don't "respect" them, then just want to make sure that they baby making machine is not damaged or broken because you only have a limited supply of them. In my book this is not respect.

I understand that they wouldn't want men in battles because they don't want their "sex toy"/"sperm donor" broken, but I don't buy this kind of environment would be similar to what women endure these days.

In case it wasn't aimed at my comment, then just forget it