The Storming of Women's Bodily Autonomy

ElaineA · May 8, 2019

It's a full scale, frontal assault. Two biggies in the last couple of days:

1) Item 1, the Georgia Heartbeat Bill. Many have heard about the general idea of a "heartbeat" bill. I'm going to set aside the fallacy of a 6-week fetal "heartbeat" for now, as well as the high unlikelihood of most women knowing they're pregnant within 6 weeks, to focus your attention on the wider matters addressed in the legislation that election cheat Brian Kemp has signed into law. The law declares

“unborn children are a class of living, distinct person” that deserves “full legal recognition.” Thus, Georgia law must “recognize unborn children as natural persons”—not just for the purposes of abortion, but as a legal rule.

The upshot:

....The bill confirms that fetuses “shall be included in population based determinations” from now on, because they are legally humans, and residents of the state.

Taken literally, it means women and physicians who abort will be subject to murder charges and, if found guilty, incarceration. Taken to its (il)logical extreme, it also means fetuses of pregnant prison inmates will immediately have a 4th Amendment case against being held in prison without due process. The fetus didn't commit a crime, so the state has no right to keep it imprisoned.

Even women who seek lawful abortions out of state may not escape punishment. If a Georgia resident plans to travel elsewhere to obtain an abortion, she may be charged with conspiracy to commit murder, punishable by 10 years’ imprisonment. An individual who helps a woman plan her trip to get an out-of-state abortion, or transports her to the clinic, may also be charged with conspiracy. These individuals, after all, are “conspiring” to end of the life of a “person” with “full legal recognition” under Georgia law.

Women who suffer miscarriages will also be considered suspect.

Prosecutors may interrogate women who miscarry to determine whether they can be held responsible; if they find evidence of culpability, they may charge, detain, and try these women for the death of their fetuses.

2) Item 2, the Ohio Insurance Coverage Restriction bill. 1/5th of the Ohio House reps have signed onto a bill that would prohibit PRIVATE insurance companies from covering abortion services. The party of small government is telling insurance companies what they CAN'T cover. The bill includes this restrictive language.

The bill would ban nontherapeutic abortions that include "drugs or devices used to prevent the implantation of a fertilized ovum.”

That means birth control. But what, you may be asking, about the case of the mother's life being endangered by, oh, IDK, an ectopic pregnancy?

And Becker says the bill also speaks to coverage of ectopic or tubal pregnancies where the fertilized egg attaches outside of the womb.

“Part of that treatment would be removing that embryo from the fallopian tube and reinserting it in the uterus so that is defined as not an abortion under this bill," Becker explains.

Except, that's not a thing. It's not medically possible. It's made up out of whole cloth.

Make no mistake, this is not just an assault on abortion. It's a full on assault on women. Their rights, their autonomy, their humanity. We are to be reduced to unwilling incubators. These laws are extreme, and neither of them are likely to withstand reasonable Supreme Court scrutiny, but I'm not sure how "reasonable" our SCOTUS will be by the time any challenges make it up there. And these bills won't stop coming.

Welcome to the Christo-Fascist States of America.

Kjbartolotta · May 8, 2019

Tryin' to leave it alone, but these were always the stakes in 2016. And then, as now, there just weren't enough fucks given about women. So here we are in an untenable situation, and it might be too late. JFC.

mccardey · May 8, 2019

ElaineA said:
And Becker says the bill also speaks to coverage of ectopic or tubal pregnancies where the fertilized egg attaches outside of the womb.

“Part of that treatment would be removing that embryo from the fallopian tube and reinserting it in the uterus so that is defined as not an abortion under this bill," Becker explains.

Click to expand...

Except, that's not a thing. It's not medically possible. It's made up out of whole cloth.

Make no mistake, this is not just an assault on abortion. It's a full on assault on women. Their rights, their autonomy, their humanity. .

It's also a full-on assault on science. And, you know, reality.

Larry M · May 8, 2019

I'm so sick of Republicans and their fucked up, bullshit.

ap123 · May 8, 2019

mccardey said:
It's also a full-on assault on science. And, you know, reality.

I agree that it's also an assault on science, but it is our new reality--the one many of us knew was coming.

lizmonster · May 8, 2019

They know these bills are bullshit under current law. They're specifically going after Roe, and they'll win.

This has been coming since Reagan.

Lyv · May 8, 2019

More from Becker

When it came to IUDs, which are plastic devices implanted into a woman, Becker said they should be included in the ban because they prevent the implantation of a fertilized egg, meaning they can be considered an abortion.

“This is just a personal view. I’m not a medical doctor,” Becker said.

No kidding. It's his personal view that he wants to be law. That is based on ignorance and misogyny. That means children will have to endure forced pregnancy after rape. Not hyperbole.

And last week, it was reported in Ohio that a 26-year-old man, Juan Leon-Gomez, had raped an 11-year-old girl, and that she was now pregnant. As one writer noted, “Ohio’s new ‘heartbeat bill’ means that the 11-year-old girl will likely be forced to carry the child to birth, regardless of the fact that she was raped.”

That child and children like her are being victimized again by a bunch of ignorant old men.

Yeah, I am sick of Republicans, too.

For my entire reproductive life, I had the right to choose. I am so angry that right is being taken away. Women will die.

The GOP doesn't want women to have access to birth control. But they also want women not to have abortions. And for insurance companies not to have to cover chlidbirth or prenatal care. And forget about comprehensive, age-appropriate sex ed; they demand that proven failure, abstinence-only sex ed. It's all about controlling women. Limiting their opportunities, putting them at a disadvantage in as many ways as they can. The GOP is fully [allllll the expletives deleted] evil. They stand for nothing good and if they didn't cheat, they wouldn't be in power. It's that simple.

This is why I support Planned Parenthood. They're in my will. They're in the program of my memorial as a suggested donation. ACLU, too.

lizmonster · May 8, 2019

They're punishing women for being sexual creatures because they don't believe they should be accountable for their own actions.

We've long lost the narrative here. We let them make it about babies, and it's not. It's about choosing what's done with our own bodies at all times.

ElaineA · May 8, 2019

Lyv said:
The GOP doesn't want women to have access to birth control. But they also want women not to have abortions. And for insurance companies not to have to cover chlidbirth or prenatal care. And forget about comprehensive, age-appropriate sex ed; they demand that proven failure, abstinence-only sex ed. It's all about controlling women. Limiting their opportunities, putting them at a disadvantage in as many ways as they can. The GOP is fully [allllll the expletives deleted] evil. They stand for nothing good and if they didn't cheat, they wouldn't be in power. It's that simple.

Let's not forget treating the babies, once born, as leeches on society. Cutting education, food assistance, medicaid, etc etc ad nauseum.

Lyv said:
This is why I support Planned Parenthood. They're in my will. They're in the program of my memorial as a suggested donation. ACLU, too.

I gave to PPact, NARAL, and the ACLU today, and if this situation matters to you at all, I encourage others to support the cause. You don't even have to spend a dime. Sharing a Tweet or FB post helps spread the word about what's happening here. *The More You Know*

Coddiwomple · May 8, 2019

Lyv said:
Women will die.

This. And they just. Don’t. Care. The awful truth is they prefer dead women to women they can’t control.

Brightdreamer · May 8, 2019

Larry M said:
I'm so sick of Republicans and their fucked up, bullshit.

+1000

lizmonster said:
They know these bills are bullshit under current law. They're specifically going after Roe, and they'll win.

This has been coming since Reagan.

Yep. The flood of anti-choice, anti-science laws rushing to the compromised SCOTUS is no coincidence. It is the beginning of the end for anything resembling progress or women's equality (or even basic rights.) At least one of these is going to become the new federal precedent, and the camel that stuck its nose in the tent decades ago will finally get its backside past the flap.

And I, frankly, see no stopping it short of breaking the union. We have on our hands a power-mad group of people determined to destroy the very notion of science, too often in the name of their god, and it's increasingly clear that they'll torch the very Constitution they claim to embrace (just as they redact and cherry-pick the holy book they claim to revere) to achieve their ends... and they'll drag the rest of us into their Hell with them. They just can't seem to live with us without trying to destroy us.

(And, yeah, I know it won't happen, and if it came to civil war nobody would win, but still, we've reached the point were even simple communication is impossible.)

Mclesh · May 8, 2019

The Handmaid's Tale isn't supposed to be an instruction manual.

I decided a while ago that the ACLU and Planned Parenthood were organizations (besides NRDC) I will focus my meager resources on. Instead of pulling the covers over my head (which is what I'm tempted to do right now) I'm going to send a couple donations off.

Kjbartolotta · May 8, 2019

ElaineA said:
I gave to PPact, NARAL, and the ACLU today, and if this situation matters to you at all, I encourage others to support the cause. You don't even have to spend a dime. Sharing a Tweet or FB post helps spread the word about what's happening here. *The More You Know*

A lotta artsy folks I know (including my GF) have been doing sales on their art with percentages and matched donations going to PP and NARAL.

ap123 · May 8, 2019

lizmonster said:
They're punishing women for being sexual creatures because they don't believe they should be accountable for their own actions.

I don't think so. I think they're punishing us for daring to live our lives as equals, and the bottom line is these hate-filled misogynistic pusbuckets don't believe we are equal. They see us as receptacles/incubators, period. They don't care how high the maternal mortality rate climbs, they don't even care how it will harm the economy for all as women lose rights and are forced back to the dark ages. Much like the general health care debates, they'd rather lose what they have and need than see someone else they view as less-than receive the same.

lizmonster · May 8, 2019

I'm open to it being about more than one pathology. But there's definitely an element of shame over sexuality. We're supposed to be saying no to them! If we don't, we must be punished! Because sex is shameful, but they'll have it anyway and be ashamed in private while we're shamed in public or die in back alleys.

We are things to them. Not people. Never people.

RedRajah · May 8, 2019

And with the poor and minorities already under-served by medical professionals, there's an even bigger danger of who'll be punished/die off more.

As the cynic says "That's not a bug -- that's a feature."

lizmonster · May 8, 2019

I wonder what these lawmakers think will happen? Are they ready for the scores of women they're going to have to prosecute? Are they ready for the optics on that?

I think it's pretty much a given that this SCOTUS will overturn Roe. But I'm not sure what happens next will be quite what they expect. It's past time we stopped talking about "balancing" the rights of women. Either it's my body, or it's not.

ElaineA · May 8, 2019

lizmonster said:
I wonder what these lawmakers think will happen? Are they ready for the scores of women they're going to have to prosecute? Are they ready for the optics on that?

I think it's pretty much a given that this SCOTUS will overturn Roe. But I'm not sure what happens next will be quite what they expect. It's past time we stopped talking about "balancing" the rights of women. Either it's my body, or it's not.

That's what's so mind-boggling about the Georgia law. They can't defend against a lawyer representing a fetus to say "the conditions in prison are suboptimal to my healthy development and the state is imprisoning me without having convicted me of any crime" without tying the fetus to the mother. If the fetus is a separate human, the mother's crime and condition of being in prison cannot devolve to it. They have to give the fetus a trial, or...what? It's the most absurd, ill-thought-out situation, but when you're using a bill written by a lobbyist and adding local sugar and spice to it, I guess that's what you get. :Shrug:

lizmonster · May 8, 2019

ElaineA said:
That's what's so mind-boggling about the Georgia law. They can't defend against a lawyer representing a fetus to say "the conditions in prison are suboptimal to my healthy development and the state is imprisoning me without having convicted me of any crime" without tying the fetus to the mother. If the fetus is a separate human, the mother's crime and condition of being in prison cannot devolve to it. They have to give the fetus a trial, or...what? It's the most absurd, ill-thought-out situation, but when you're using a bill written by a lobbyist and adding local sugar and spice to it, I guess that's what you get.

I have to believe they don't think they're going to have to do much enforcement. The law will almost certainly be suspended while it's litigated. What their vision is post-Roe I can only guess, but I suspect they're imagining the law being uniform across the country - which it won't be.

I don't think there's any other law on the books anywhere that requires someone to risk their lives to sustain the life of someone else.

MaeZe · May 8, 2019

lizmonster said:
They know these bills are bullshit under current law. They're specifically going after Roe, and they'll win.

This has been coming since Reagan.

Don't be so sure that SCOTUS is quite there. They went too far with this legislation. Roberts is not going to vote that it is okay to investigate women who had miscarriages. And what about a medical decision to save the mother's life?

Those idiots are drunk with perceived power and it's going to bite their asses.

MaeZe · May 8, 2019

lizmonster said:
I have to believe they don't think they're going to have to do much enforcement. The law will almost certainly be suspended while it's litigated. What their vision is post-Roe I can only guess, but I suspect they're imagining the law being uniform across the country - which it won't be.

I don't think there's any other law on the books anywhere that requires someone to risk their lives to sustain the life of someone else.

I think they believe they are pushing the envelope. That or they're all Christian Fundies and they think God is behind the wheel.

Bottom line, if they'd been smart, they'd have taken things one step at a time instead of this outrage. Not everyone lives in one of these states. SCOTUS decisions have to keep that in mind. How about that crap charging a woman who goes out of state for an abortion?

First, they don't have a right to those medical records. Are they going to subpoena them from California? And what about a woman passing through the state? Does it apply to her?

The bill is ludicrous. And hopefully it will motivate the majority of women in the country to oust Trump.

Introversion · May 8, 2019

Kjbartolotta said:
Tryin' to leave it alone, but these were always the stakes in 2016.

“But, but, but, both parties are equally awful, so I’m voting my conscience, because principles.” —Practically Every 3rd Party Voter I Interacted With In 2016

Brightdreamer · May 8, 2019

MaeZe said:
The bill is ludicrous. And hopefully it will motivate the majority of women in the country to oust Trump.

Unfortunately, there are many - too, too many - women who are okay with handing over their freedoms, their rights, and control of their own bodies because...

... because bad things only happen to bad people.

... because God made women to suffer for Eve's sin.

... because it'll never happen to them.

... because they don't want to get all political, and surely it won't actually go through, it's just a scare tactic or political ploy that won't actually be enforced.

... because the men in their life make all their decisions, and they say this is the way it should be.

... because rights are really easy to win back after they're lost, right?

... because things have to go all dystopian before the magic utopia happens.

... because whatever bullcrud rationalization or reason they have that's endangering my whole frellin' gender.

ShaunHorton · May 8, 2019

ElaineA said:
That's what's so mind-boggling about the Georgia law. They can't defend against a lawyer representing a fetus to say "the conditions in prison are suboptimal to my healthy development and the state is imprisoning me without having convicted me of any crime" without tying the fetus to the mother. If the fetus is a separate human, the mother's crime and condition of being in prison cannot devolve to it. They have to give the fetus a trial, or...what? It's the most absurd, ill-thought-out situation, but when you're using a bill written by a lobbyist and adding local sugar and spice to it, I guess that's what you get.

By fact of proximity to the accused during the crime, the fetus is now an accomplice and guilty of aiding and abetting whatever felonious act their mother committed.

TheListener · May 8, 2019

This is just another case of so-called religious men trying to dominate women. They have been doing it for a couple thousand years and think they have the right because the bible tells them they do. This is the bible belt after all.

You won't see this sort of legislation being done in California, Oregon, Washington, Minnesota, Michigan, New York, New Hampshire, or Maine. If a wall was ever to be built, it should have been built around the South. Sorry Southerners, but there is a abnormal look at how the world should be from that area of the country.

Now women are suffering because men think they have the right to rule, telling them what they can and cannot do with their bodies. This just opens the door to back room abortions that killed more than were successful. Women will travel across state lines in secret to get them. And their self-righteous families may just turn them in for it. Too much like the Third Reich for my taste.

Men and women were never created equal in the eyes of those bible thumpers in the South. Women were meant to be ruled over and until those women stand up for themselves, take this decision to court, fight for their rights, then you will see a lot more legislation based on some archaic beliefs from the bible, written by men. There is no separation of church and state in their eyes.

The Storming of Women's Bodily Autonomy

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