Bee hive - bee skip

Puma · Jul 2, 2006

Bee Hive - Bee Skip

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06-14-2006, 07:53 PM

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Bee Hive - Bee Skip

Has anyone ever heard of a bee skip and have any idea how they worked? From what I understand a bee skip was a bit like a flat woven basket and was used to attract bees - but that's about all I know (in use in 1820, I found one in an estate sale listing). If you do have any idea about this, do you also know whether hives were being used at the same time period - or did hives replace bee skips? Puma

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06-14-2006, 09:36 PM

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SKEP not SKIP

I've only ever seen the word written as SKEP, Puma.

It's the traditional dome shaped bee hive made from plaited straw of some kind, then coiled into shape.

The hive superceded it because the hive is designed to fit the shape the bees make their honey cells. All very mathematical and perfect for bees.

Bee keeping was not kind before hives. The bees couldn't make proper cells and it was difficult to extract the honey. In the bad old Saxon days they used to burn most of their bees in their skeps to extract the honey as they couldn't take the honey and feed the bees sugar through the winter as modern apiarists do.

I'm not sure but I think that by 1820 the mathematical hive was used by the major honey producers but cottagers kept a skep - I've seen old ones dating from the 1st WW - and a special skep was used to collect swarms right into the 1950s when the skills of making them disappeared.

Last edited by pdr : 06-15-2006 at 12:42 AM.

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06-15-2006, 05:00 AM

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Wow, PDR, I am awed by how much information you gave me so fast. Thank you very much. Puma

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06-15-2006, 05:01 AM

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Sorry, wouldn't post and when it did it gave me two. Puma

Last edited by Puma : 06-15-2006 at 05:04 AM.

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06-15-2006, 05:42 AM

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skeps

Hi Puma. Is your question related to your WIP? If so, what is the location? Skeps were used in the US and Europe before movable frame hives came along. There were different types of movable frame hives including the Huber leaf hive (Huber was blind when he developed it!) Probably the biggest development in beekeeping history was the development of the Langstroth hive in 1851. Lorenzo Langstroth was was an ordained minister. He discovered the concept of "bee space." If a space is less then 3/8" the bees seal it. If it is greater than 3/8" they fill it with comb. If it is exactly 3/8", they leave it along and travel through it. By having 3/8" clearances throughout the hive body, a hive with movable frames is possible. All modern beekeeping equipment is based on langstroth's discovery.

Skeps did not "attract" bees. Bees would take up housekeeping in them (sometimes). The problem was that you had to destroy them to harvest honey and beeswax. Hope that helps. Dave

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06-15-2006, 07:15 PM

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My question does relate to a WIP (although it is finished and edited a couple times - but I always figure I can fix things until and if someone decides to pick it up). My WIP is US, 1814 app. I had found the "bee skip" in an auction listing from 1823 in the same general locale. Were any sort of hives in use in 1814? Thanks, Puma

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06-15-2006, 07:19 PM

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http://homepage.mac.com/mreddygbr/skepFAQ/

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06-15-2006, 07:27 PM

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Thanks, Arrowqueen. That was a very interesting anf informative article. I'm amazed that I've gotten so many good responses to my question.

But - now I have another - when skeps were used, were stray colonies of bees ever collected off trees where they were swarming (which I know has been done with hives)? If they were, how did they get the bees into the skep? Thanks, Puma

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06-15-2006, 07:34 PM

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Nice site, Arrowqueen.

Don't mention it, Puma. I'm surrounded by bees at home and grew up amongst early 19thC things.

Good to see that Arrowqueen's site clearly states it's not expert. Interesting and nice to see the pictures.

Bee keeping became more civilised in the 16th C when they discovered the bee's life cycle and when was best to take honey but it was that bee space discovery - blooming maths! - that made an industry possible. Interesting to hear of the efforts to save the bees before bee space hive.

Somewhere in the back files of SF and Fantasy Genre there are some great threads on weapons and horses, a good one in the Research questions area on horses too. Is it possible to sticky them here?

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06-15-2006, 07:47 PM

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I think they just knocked the swarm down off the branch, while some poor unsuspecting bastard stood underneath with an empty hive.

But I may be wrong.

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06-16-2006, 05:03 AM

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Swarms were a much more important resource before the movable frame hive was developed. Since the advent of the Langstroth hive, swarming has been considered an undesirable trait. If your bees swarm, you will probably lose the swarm (unless you're at the right place at the right time) and your honey crop will be reduced.

In order to harvest honey from a skep, you had to destroy the colony. If you were lucky and the colony swarmed first, you had a ready made replacement colony on hand. There is an old rhyme "A swarm of bees in may is worth a load of hay..."

To answer your question, I imagine beekeepers in the early 1800s collected swarms the same way we do today. If they are on a branch, cut it or shake it. The queen is in the center of the mass of bees. Get her and they all come with her. BTW, when honeybees swarm, they are generally pretty docile. Prior to swarming, they gorge themselves for the trip and because they have to produce lots of new comb. They also don't have a nest to protect. I've gathered swarms without any protection (net or bee suit) and not been stung (much). That is when I was a younger show-off, I don't do that now. A swarm that hasn't gotten settled into a new home within 24 hours or so gets testy.

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06-16-2006, 06:58 PM

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One thing re swarms...

When you've cut or released that round clump of the swarm and it drops into your skep you'd better brace yourself. It's amazingly heavy.

Also in the good old days you'd have half the household or neighbourhood out banging pots and pans and making a clamour as it was believed that the noise kept the bees still!

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06-17-2006, 01:29 PM

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I'm going to post my WIP bee segment into share your work, contemporary/mainstream as Puma Bees. If you with experience with bees would take a look at it and let me know how far off I am, I'd appreciate it. Thanks Puma

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06-17-2006, 02:14 PM

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Puma, I found the old rhyme:

A swarm of bees in May is worth a load of hay;
A swarm of bees in June is worth a silver spoon;
A swarm of bees in July isn't worth a fly.

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06-17-2006, 03:38 PM

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That's really neat, 1dSquared. Now I'll also have to check the time of year where I have the bees in my novel. I'm always amazed at how much we don't know of what we think we know. Thanks to everyone for your help. Puma

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06-17-2006, 04:53 PM

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And here are some nice old bee-liefs:

http://www.doghause.com/superstitions.asp

(Sorry about the terrible pun. Couldn't resist it.)

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Evaine · Jul 2, 2006

There's an incident in Lark Rise to Candleford, a book about late Victorian country life in the UK (whose author I have forgotten), where one of the villagers follows a swarm of bees while holding their house key in the air - in the belief that this gives them legal claim to the bees when they swarm.

One of my neighbours makes the traditional bee skeps, and is also called in to deal with swarms when they're causing problems - as one did a few years ago in the chimney of the building where Barclays Bank now is.

Bee hive - bee skip

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Retired and loving it!

Evaine