She definitely was not helpful in any way. That I can say. Whether she was purposefully being mean or just didn't know how to critique in a useful way I am unsure of.
FML Feeling Rejected
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She definitely was not helpful in any way. That I can say. Whether she was purposefully being mean or just didn't know how to critique in a useful way I am unsure of.
This is definitely me! I want to hear the bad. I really do, but I am also very hypercritical of my own work so I need people to tell me the good too so that I know what I'm doing well so I can do it again and also so that I can shut up my inner anxiety about me sucking horribly at everything I do.
This CP didn't say a single thing positive. Literally nothing. I've even read all her inline critiques now too and there isn't one good thing written which makes me feel like I'm absolute shit and does not help the inner anxiety at all.
I literally just found her on twitter CPMatch. (Probably not the best way to find CP's but hey)What's your relationship with her?
I had a beta reader like that and I pushed back and said, "I respect your advice, but I need to know—did anything work for you? What was it?" because I need to know what's working, not just for my ego, but so that my machete-like edits don't go too far.* And I had the relationship with her where I could ask that question without being defensive.
Do you have another CP whose advice and vision for the novel is generally in sync with yours? You could run the harsh advice past that person. Their perspective on the same issue could help you determine whether or not to follow that advice and how to do so.
*Oh, ShouldBeWriting explained that so succinctly. Read their post instead.
I currently have another possible CP but I don't have anything official going yet. I'm just not sure how to find a good one yet.
That's good to know. I'm under the assumption a good CPer and/or Beta Reader would be the same yes?
And that was all suppose to post as one comment but I apparently failed miserably at doing that today XD
I can't think of a single reason to insult someone's work, or try to bully them into changes. It won't produce good material, it won't make for a good relationship, it won't help the writer build confidence in either the crit process or their own abilities, and it won't be the basis of a long-lasting partnership.
I'm not precious about writing - there is stuff I write that I know I'll never want to change, so I just keep it in my cabinet, but on the other hand, I spent years writing retail TV commercials, and you don't get much more servile than that. Even in advertising, though, I've never been insulted or bullied by a client: they might say "You have to do it my way because reasons (including paycheck)." - that would be fine. And when it's a novel of mine that I want to sell, I expect critique and input and I'll find a way to make changes whenever they're suggested, if I trust the person critiquing. After the actual writing, that's my favourite part of the process - working with a really great editor or a really great agent who just wants to make it a bit more sellable.
I guess I'm saying - don't send work out for crit to someone whose opinion you don't have burning faith in; and never, never, never allow people to bully you or insult your work under the guise of "helping".
Lots of people will diss your work once it's out - that's their right, if you've put it out for consumption. But I don't think anyone should have to accept insults or bullying as part of the process. I feel very strongly about this. I can't imagine it helping at all. I'd certainly call out anyone who tried it on now, so they don't inflict it on others.
Point them out to me. I've got your back on this.
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What's your genre, Kay? I know you said YA but what kind? AW is a great place to find CPs.
I - and I'm sure most writers - had to kiss a lot of frogs before I found my princely CPs. It's a whole lot of trial and error, and I also encountered people who were spiteful, people who had no idea how to give good critique (no judgement here - I was one of them, once) and people who made comments so bizarre I was both bewildered and a little frightened. But once you find your gang, the support is amazing.
I understand your feelings. Unfortunately, some writers have a major superiority complex. I don't believe in ever calling a writers work crap that does nothing, in my opinion, it actually discounts their alleged statement. It's sheer laziness. I had someone who I finished critiquing (sent it off with the goods and the bads) and they were so offended they never bothered to send back my MS with any kind of advice. If you're looking for a new CP let me know. I am currently looking for a new one as well. Regardless good luck and don't give up. One persons trash is another persons gold.
What's your genre, Kay? I know you said YA but what kind? AW is a great place to find CPs.
I - and I'm sure most writers - had to kiss a lot of frogs before I found my princely CPs. It's a whole lot of trial and error, and I also encountered people who were spiteful, people who had no idea how to give good critique (no judgement here - I was one of them, once) and people who made comments so bizarre I was both bewildered and a little frightened. But once you find your gang, the support is amazing.
YA Fantasy! Maybe I'll lurk about AW and see if I can find CP here to try out.
ChibiUsagi
Banned
There’s a big writing community on Twitter that may be helpful for you.
You deserve a much better crit partner. Seriously, that kind of criticism isn’t constructive.
Good luck
I’m a newspaper editor, and I can see why that might foster a different (harsher) critique style. You’re working on tight deadlines; stuff has to be done right then and done right. Personally, I try to have good “bedside manner” and always be constructive and phrase crits tactfully, but I work at a weekly, so it’s a little easier.
Every crit I’ve ever had within the publishing industry has been super tactful and polite. Some of those crits have still been absolutely devastating, because you learn quickly to decipher the real message (which is often a polite no, or sometimes a polite “this is a mess, but I hope you can improve it,” or sometimes a polite “hell, no!”). Politeness is still a good thing, though. It makes the process more bearable.
For CPs, I think it’s essential to find someone who 1. knows your genre and can appreciate what you’re aiming for and 2. is fairly close to your own level of skill and experience. The second one is my personal preference, anyway. I find I don’t do well critiquing people who are just starting out in writing, which may be why I don’t teach anymore. Of course, my assessment of these writers’ skill levels is subjective. But I think in general we’re better at critiquing those we see as peers. We’re less likely to overwhelm them and more likely to prioritize our crits in a helpful way.
Every crit I’ve ever had within the publishing industry has been super tactful and polite. Some of those crits have still been absolutely devastating, because you learn quickly to decipher the real message (which is often a polite no, or sometimes a polite “this is a mess, but I hope you can improve it,” or sometimes a polite “hell, no!”). Politeness is still a good thing, though. It makes the process more bearable.
For CPs, I think it’s essential to find someone who 1. knows your genre and can appreciate what you’re aiming for and 2. is fairly close to your own level of skill and experience. The second one is my personal preference, anyway. I find I don’t do well critiquing people who are just starting out in writing, which may be why I don’t teach anymore. Of course, my assessment of these writers’ skill levels is subjective. But I think in general we’re better at critiquing those we see as peers. We’re less likely to overwhelm them and more likely to prioritize our crits in a helpful way.
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A similar thing happened to my friend and it really knocked her writing confidence for a while.
I don't know why people are so cruel sometimes, I sometimes wonder if it comes from a place of jealousy. I hope you haven't allowed the CP to lower your confidence, OP. Sounds like they were just a really inappropriate CP.
I do of course understand there's times where constructive criticism is necessary, but the key word is constructive...
I don't know why people are so cruel sometimes, I sometimes wonder if it comes from a place of jealousy. I hope you haven't allowed the CP to lower your confidence, OP. Sounds like they were just a really inappropriate CP.
I do of course understand there's times where constructive criticism is necessary, but the key word is constructive...
Well good news everyone. My new CP got back to me with her thoughts on my first chapter and actually enjoyed it. She had some notes about grammar which I expected since its one of the things I asked about, but in general she liked my concept and writing.
