Elizabeth Warren officially tosses her hat into the 2020 ring

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Massachusetts senator releases video announcing run

Oh, dear.

She's one of my senators. I like the job she does, as my senator. I despise the "Pocahontas" memes around her (though she did herself no favors taking that genetics test IMO -- that was dumb).

She'd probably make a good president. If she's the Democratic nominee, I'll vote for her. I'd vote for a block of maggoty cheese over 45.

But, I suspect she'll have the same troubles getting elected as Ms. Clinton did, for similar reasons. Moreover, she's got a somewhat professorial speaking manner, and that's not what the Democrats need running against the Demagogue in Chief.

This is going to be one ugly m'fluffer of an election. :rant:
 

regdog

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Proudly voted for her, twice. I'll support her for president. I'm another who worries she's going to face the same "Hillaryesque hate" particularly from men. I know only two men who support and like her. The rest give the same vague, ridiculous reasons they did when asked why they didn't like Hillary. "I don't know." "There's just something about her I don't like." "She's a bitch" "She's too outspoken"

Sad that in 2019 there are so many men who still want women to be little more than Steppford wives.
 

ChloeRose

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She will lose if she becomes the Democratic candidate.
 

MaeZe

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I'm not excited. But it's early. We don't know who else will run in the primary and I don't know how well she can do on the national stage with national agenda skills.
 

lizmonster

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To be clear, I also suspect she can't win. But I think we should be honest about the reasons, and what we can do about them, either for this election or future ones.
 

Lyv

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Volunteered for both her senate campaigns, voted for her twice. While I would like to see her stay in the Senate and she's not my top choice for Democratic nominee, I'd work for her and vote for her in a heartbeat if she got the nomination. I see the same misogyny coming from the same voices, not all of whom are on the right, and we better work on that, in general.
 

MythMonger

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To be clear, I also suspect she can't win. But I think we should be honest about the reasons, and what we can do about them, either for this election or future ones.

I'd love to see her win it all, but I suspect the Massachusetts curse will be in full effect for Warren. MA candidates have a terrible time on a national level outside of their party's base, for whatever reason. (Dukakis, Kerry, Romney)
 

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I'd love to see her win it all, but I suspect the Massachusetts curse will be in full effect for Warren. MA candidates have a terrible time on a national level outside of their party's base, for whatever reason. (Dukakis, Kerry, Romney)

Not to quibble, but Romney isn't really from Massachusetts. :)

Before Warren ran for senate, everyone in MA was talking about how fabulous she was. The minute she started campaigning, the negativity came out, and her win was far narrower than I would've expected. Now she's in the senate, everyone loves what she's doing there. They only hate her before she's actually doing the job.

She'd be a fine president. Clinton would have been a fine president. I'll vote for the Dem nominee, but between the evangelical girl-cooties crowd and the leftist Bros, I'm not hopeful this country would elect a woman, no matter how qualified. (If "qualified" mattered to enough people, Trump wouldn't have been able to Putin himself into office.)
 

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She will lose if she becomes the Democratic candidate.

Thanks for the one-liner. It was very insightful. Only not.

Truth be told, there's a lot of reasons why Elizabeth Warren might lose if she were the Democratic nominee. Some might view her as too far to the Left side of the dial. Some are going to be put off by the clumsy way she handled Trump's taunts about her Native American heritage. Some might wonder if she's too old (69) though she's a kid compared to likely challengers Joe Biden (76) and Bernie Sanders (77).

Some might worry in trying to be Not Hillary, Warren will be baited by Trump into trying to go toe-to-toe with him and he'll clean her clock when it comes to fighting dirty. Some might be concerned Warren isn't up to the full-on assault from Fux News, the Trump Zombie Army and the big money of the Sheldon Adelsons and Robert and Rebecca Mercers of the Right.

Some may be fearful that the Bernie Sanders brigades are lying in wait with knives sharpened to come for Warren's throat after her "betrayal" of Sanders by not coming out to actively support her fellow progressive. Some will be scared the Democratic establishment will not get behind Warren and push another more moderate candidate to the forefront.

Elizabeth Warren is one of the smartest people in politics. She already knows what sort of shitstorm she'll be walking into as a presidential candidate and I'd bet the car payment she's ready for it. Or at least she thinks she's ready.

Some will muse that if the multicultural base was tepid in their support of Hillary Clinton, what's going to motivate them to turn out en masse to push Warren over the finish line.

Those are legitimate concerns and reasons to think Elizabeth Warren may have misjudged the moment and will crash and burn in 2020.

What matters most is Elizabeth Warren is a smart, ambitious woman and America puts smart, ambitious women through the wringer.

An odd thing happened to the woman who came onto the scene as an anti-banking, anti-establishment, burn-down-the-castle revolutionary: Elizabeth Warren became the castle.

In the past few years, she raised millions of dollars to build a political machine. She began talking up policy issues beyond the bread-and-butter economic proposals she became famous for. She bolstered her foreign-policy credentials with trips abroad. She built up a large team of staffers who carefully engineered policy rollouts and email blasts. She became a front-runner in the 2020 presidential race.

But as she announces her exploratory committee—which is really announcing her presidential campaign—Warren wants to be the outsider again.

As always happens with front-runners, Warren has become a target. She’s considered less shiny than some of the newer firebrands, who have themselves become the anti-establishment. Operatives working for several other Democratic candidates about to make their own announcements have insisted she’s the Hillary Clinton of 2020—and not in a complimentary way. They describe her as overly cautious and cold, carefully curating her “authentic” moments and struggling to escape a relatively small issue—her claim of American Indian heritage—that’s threatened to overtake her entire candidacy. Her big speech just after Thanksgiving on “a foreign policy that works for all Americans” sounded a whole lot like Clinton’s focus-grouped emphasis on “everyday Americans,” several operatives argue. She even has Bernie Sanders threatening to run to her left.

Along the way, each spot of drama—from the heritage controversy to whom she might pick as her campaign manager—has been hungrily covered by the press.

No other candidate has experienced anything quite like this this cycle. Then again, no other candidate has built herself up into quite this kind of dreadnought.

If the response to Warren's announcement has been somewhere between a :e2shrug: and a :e2yawn:, it's because there's going to be a LOT of Democrats testing the waters for the opportunity to slay the Donald Dragon. Warren is just the first one out of the gate and she may not reach the finish line, but she's got as good a chance as anyone and better chances than most.

Right about now I'd support a mean old mastiff with a broken leg on crutches than the Evil Orange Cheeto. :e2tomato:
 

MythMonger

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Not to quibble, but Romney isn't really from Massachusetts. :)

Despite being former governor of MA, I have to admit I'm much more comfortable thinking he's either from Michigan or Utah.

I'm not hopeful this country would elect a woman, no matter how qualified.

I'm afraid you're probably right, at least for the short term.
 

MaeZe

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Volunteered for both her senate campaigns, voted for her twice. While I would like to see her stay in the Senate and she's not my top choice for Democratic nominee, I'd work for her and vote for her in a heartbeat if she got the nomination. I see the same misogyny coming from the same voices, not all of whom are on the right, and we better work on that, in general.

It's not her gender that concerns me. I'd like to see Kamala Harris or Tammy Duckworth run. They seem like broader candidates than Warren.
 

Lyv

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It's not her gender that concerns me. I'd like to see Kamala Harris or Tammy Duckworth run. They seem like broader candidates than Warren.
If it's not about you, it's not about you.

I stand by my comment.
 

BenPanced

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I had to pull back from Facebook this weekend because people are posting links to articles along the lines of Well, your Dem candidate fails my imaginary purity test so you can't vote for them. I couldn't take it any longer. That being here nor there, I see Warren failing a lot of the purity tests mentioned above: she's too old, she's not Progressive™ enough, she's Hillary 2.0, she's not _________________ (fill in the blank, probably more than likely Bernie Sanders), she's a bitch (i.e. an ambitious/aggressive woman), she needs to visit the places Hillary didn't last time or I'm not voting for her, she has to ______________ (again, fill in the blank), ERMAGERD she's co-opting somebody's else's ideas/policies! somebody stop her, etc. The funny/sad part is, I also see a lot of people hanging too many hopes on this one person before anything really happens, as if she's the only choice and we have to vote next week. Let's just let things happen.
 

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Whether or not she is smart and qualified (yes and yes) I worry she does not necessarily have the media savvy and it factor to defeat this particular opponent in a national race. We saw what happened with Hilary, who was supremely qualified. Ideally, we need someone who will excite voters and who can get out the vote at 2018 levels.
 

lizmonster

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Despite being former governor of MA, I have to admit I'm much more comfortable thinking he's either from Michigan or Utah.

I had it in my head he was a carpetbagger, but now that I look up his bio, it seems I was thinking of some other Republican who moved here to run for something. Scott Brown, maybe? (Sorry!)
 

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Whether or not she is smart and qualified (yes and yes) I worry she does not necessarily have the media savvy and it factor to defeat this particular opponent in a national race. We saw what happened with Hilary, who was supremely qualified. Ideally, we need someone who will excite voters and who can get out the vote at 2018 levels.

To be clear: Hilary absolutely won the messaging, but the media didn't cover her. I spent Saturdays having lunch with my kid, watching CNN run Trump stump speeches, even if Clinton had one at the same time. Even if Trump had very few people in the audience. It wasn't lack of media savvy that did her in.
 

Marissa D

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I had it in my head he was a carpetbagger, but now that I look up his bio, it seems I was thinking of some other Republican who moved here to run for something. Scott Brown, maybe? (Sorry!)

They were both carpetbaggers in my book. :mad: Romney used to enjoy bashing MA when he was giving out-of-state speeches.
 

KBooks

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To be clear: Hilary absolutely won the messaging, but the media didn't cover her. I spent Saturdays having lunch with my kid, watching CNN run Trump stump speeches, even if Clinton had one at the same time. Even if Trump had very few people in the audience. It wasn't lack of media savvy that did her in.

I respectfully disagree, although I agree with your point that the media does no favors by hurrying to cover ad nauseum all the trifling things when it gives him constant free air time for his platform.

That said, while I find Hillary exceptionally qualified, and think she had things thrown at her that were completely unfair, I fear another candidate using the same approach and style (male or female) is going to have similar results.

Just my opinion.
 

lizmonster

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I respectfully disagree, although I agree with your point that the media does no favors by hurrying to cover ad nauseum all the trifling things when it gives him constant free air time for his platform.

I kept casual track of media coverage during the election. There were days when it wasn't apparent from the headlines that there was anyone running against Trump at all.

That said, while I find Hillary exceptionally qualified, and think she had things thrown at her that were completely unfair, I fear another candidate using the same approach and style (male or female) is going to have similar results.

Just my opinion.

Respectfully, a man who ran the same campaign wouldn't be roundly ignored by the press, nor constantly have his "likeability" questioned (which I've already seen brought up wrt Warren).

Whether or not you believe sexism turned the election, to suggest it doesn't affect how candidates are perceived seems disingenuous.
 

RedRajah

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[h=1]We Need to Rethink the Way We Talk About Women In Politics[/h]
And the worst part is that this oppression didn’t come from the party that has been actively in our faces trying to oppress us. The oppression came from inside our own house. And maybe that is the biggest argument against #SomeWhiteGuy2020: They just don’t get it. How can you help people toward progress if you don’t fully understand what is standing in their way and the part you play in it?
 

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I'll try to hunt down the link if anyone likes, but I saw a story quoting a number of people who back in 2015 held up Elizabeth Warren as a paragon of "likeability" compared to Hillary Clinton, and who used that as a club to beat Clinton, who have now switched to how awful and impossible Warren would be as a candidate.

Apparently female politicians are only "electable" and "likeable" when they are not actually running for office.