• Basic Writing questions is not a crit forum. All crits belong in Share Your Work

annoying antagonists clichés - is it a case in my idea?

inkstar

Registered
Joined
Nov 30, 2018
Messages
14
Reaction score
1
Is an evil vampire as antagonist too cheesy? Well. He hasn’t to be their king. But my story will be about a girl, who discovers that she belongs to a humanoid race, which protects the human and “fantasy” world. The antagonist of the story will be an evil vampire, who stole a goblet, which bestows immortality (so, by meaning of vampires, don’t die by sunlight or silver). Is it cheesy?
 

Undercover

I got it covered
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Mar 1, 2010
Messages
10,432
Reaction score
2,054
Location
Not here, but there
I wouldn't worry about it being cheesy. Instead, I'd go with my gut and just write the story like Marian also suggested. If you have a good feeling about it, run with it. It's a good sign. If you think it fits the story, yes, try it out then. I've had feelings like this before and I always went with my gut and it's never steered me wrong. Whatever you put into it and invest your time on working on it, it will always improve. If you can look at it like that, things will work out whether it sounds cheesy or not. There are tons and tons of books that might seem cheesy to some, but really interesting to others.

Even though I know a lot about the market I write for, I still write whatever I want and what sounds good to me. Please yourself, before anyone else and the writing will start working for you.
 

inkstar

Registered
Joined
Nov 30, 2018
Messages
14
Reaction score
1
@Undercover I know. But some readers will say, "Urgh! That’s too obvious and bad?" How can I create a creepy, sleep-stealing and memorable villain?
 

CalRazor

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 30, 2017
Messages
379
Reaction score
19
@Undercover I know. But some readers will say, "Urgh! That’s too obvious and bad?" How can I create a creepy, sleep-stealing and memorable villain?

Well, you might not want to focus too much on those basic points. An original context won't necessarily change whether or not your villain is a cliche. Of course, the premise can be used strategically to enhance the image of your "sleep-stealing" villain, but it will fall flat if the character development is lacking.
 

K.S. Crooks

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Oct 21, 2014
Messages
217
Reaction score
28
Location
Toronto
It's how the characters behave and how the story progresses which will make your story cheesy or not. I say begin writing and after a few chapters go back and read what you've done. If it feels cheesy or predictable to you then change something. Sometimes these things happen simply because we have been exposed to certain situations repetitively and for an extended period of time. In the last book I finished part way through I realized I had unintentionally made a major character into the "evil step-mother". I immediately change her relationship with others and some of her behaviours and created a much more unique and interesting character. Sometimes we need to start with what we know before we can create something new. Best of luck with your story.
 

jjdebenedictis

is watching you via her avatar
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 25, 2010
Messages
7,063
Reaction score
1,642
@Undercover I know. But some readers will say, "Urgh! That’s too obvious and bad?" How can I create a creepy, sleep-stealing and memorable villain?

You're basically asking, "How can I write well?", and there's no easy answer to that; you have to just work hard at learning how to write well for an extended period of time. Writing this book is one way of doing that, so go for it. :) And if you don't succeed, you can think hard about why, then go back and re-write it.

Self-rejecting your own ideas before you start is something you should avoid doing, because stories evolve and grow as you write them, and often it's that evolution that saves the story from being cliche, not the culling of ideas that happened before you began. It's better to just write something than to second-guess yourself out of writing at all.
 

Marian Perera

starting over
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 29, 2006
Messages
14,354
Reaction score
4,661
Location
Heaven is a place on earth called Toronto.
Website
www.marianperera.com
You're basically asking, "How can I write well?", and there's no easy answer to that; you have to just work hard at learning how to write well for an extended period of time.

Exactly.

And one way to answer your own question is to ask yourself, "How does (author whose work I enjoy) characterize and describe (villain in a book I liked)?" Then apply those techniques to your own work.
 
Joined
May 31, 2014
Messages
369
Reaction score
27
Location
Alabama
It doesn't sound cheesy to me. Don't know if editors want vampires after the whole Twilight fad.
 

NateSean

Vulcan/Time Lord Hybrid
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 18, 2014
Messages
803
Reaction score
78
Location
Bennington, VT
It doesn't sound cheesy to me. Don't know if editors want vampires after the whole Twilight fad.

And yet Vampire Diaries and Vampire Academy seemed to enjoy a surge of popularity as a result. And the former predated Twilight by a considerable amount of time.

Vampires aren't going a anywhere.

To the OP, write the story. It's only words on a piece of paper, it's not like you're flapping your arms and trying to fly.
 

inkstar

Registered
Joined
Nov 30, 2018
Messages
14
Reaction score
1
Well. @NateSean My problem will be that the youth, these days, has not the original pic of a vampire in the mind. I mean, at beginning of the 2000s, the most teens reaad Twilight and the most loved it. So, either I can make jokes about the sparkling vampire. Or I should explain the powers very well, shouldn’t it?
 

KBooks

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Sep 17, 2018
Messages
448
Reaction score
108
It doesn't sound cheesy to me. Don't know if editors want vampires after the whole Twilight fad.

I don't think vampires and other supernaturals are particularly hot at the moment. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't write the story you want to tell. There is a niche market of readers who still love reading paranormal even if it isn't as huge as it was back in the Twilight days, and once your manuscript is finished you can figure out what option is best for you.
 

rwm4768

practical experience, FTW
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jan 12, 2012
Messages
15,472
Reaction score
767
Location
Missouri
If you write it well enough, it won't be cheesy.
 

Lolly12

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 2, 2018
Messages
90
Reaction score
5
Location
UK
If you want an evil vampire to be the villain of the piece, use an evil vampire. Or a conflicted vampire. Or a misery guts of a vampire. Vampires are fun.
 

vicky271

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Mar 22, 2014
Messages
623
Reaction score
35
Write the story. It's more about the execution than the idea :)

- - - Updated - - -

Write the story. It's more about the execution than the idea :)
 

Locked

Registered
Joined
Jun 9, 2013
Messages
36
Reaction score
5
What rwm4768 said. Vampires are not inherently cheesy. That being said, don't be surprised if your first-draft version of this vampire antagonist turns out that way. It might take some work to really show the reader how evil, horrifying and non-cheesy your vampire really is, but I'm sure it's doable.
 

Adversary

Banned
Joined
Jul 27, 2015
Messages
302
Reaction score
29
It doesn't sound cheesy to me. Don't know if editors want vampires after the whole Twilight fad.


Uhh... doesn't that kind of make them want them more? I dont know if writing is like TV, but if it is then anyone who wants money and fame should be writing about vampires. All it takes is one TV show about garbage men to become a hit and suddenly every idiot writer and his idiot writing dog will be firing garbage man scripts at producers... I dont know if its like this (god i hope not) but i do know the last time i was in a big fancy bookstore i sure remember seeing a lot of vampire novels...


To the OP. I think if you're a good writer, the only way it could be cheesy is if you just rip something off. I dont care how good your prose is, if i read it and immediately think; Hmmm... girl with low self-esteem, effeminate vampire boy, angry werewolf boy, love triangle... are you even trying...???, or if i think; 'Hey, Gary Oldman just called, and he wants his character back...' well then, newsflash: its cheesy. Be original, or put an original spin on something.
 

bapeery

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 19, 2018
Messages
86
Reaction score
6
Location
Tennessee
I think it is all going to boil down to our writing and how you sell the characters. If you come out with an amazing grab you by the seat of your pants kind of story, cheesiness won't be a factor. If you give the same old "vampire is a bad guy and needs to be stopped" type of thing, people are going to be bored with that. Make it exciting!
 

Lolly12

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 2, 2018
Messages
90
Reaction score
5
Location
UK
Uhh... doesn't that kind of make them want them more? I dont know if writing is like TV, but if it is then anyone who wants money and fame should be writing about vampires. All it takes is one TV show about garbage men to become a hit and suddenly every idiot writer and his idiot writing dog will be firing garbage man scripts at producers... I dont know if its like this (god i hope not) but i do know the last time i was in a big fancy bookstore i sure remember seeing a lot of vampire novels...


To the OP. I think if you're a good writer, the only way it could be cheesy is if you just rip something off. I dont care how good your prose is, if i read it and immediately think; Hmmm... girl with low self-esteem, effeminate vampire boy, angry werewolf boy, love triangle... are you even trying...???, or if i think; 'Hey, Gary Oldman just called, and he wants his character back...' well then, newsflash: its cheesy. Be original, or put an original spin on something.

I don't really believe in originality. We are all working with the same basic material and millions of books, possibly billions of stories have been written or told or performed up to this point in civilisation. Some of the most satisfying books I've read have been located smack in the middle of their genre with the expected tropes.