Rejected from 5 MFA Programs (All of them)

uhstevedude

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I've been told I'm a pretty good writer, but that's never been tested until I attempted to go for an MFA.

I outlined my curriculum vitae, made sure to put my best foot forward with my writing sample (excerpts of my then unfinished manuscript and other short story pieces) and exhausted my income as a high-needs undergrad applying for programs with $100 application fees. Maybe it was foolish to apply for only Fiction programs when Non-fiction will provide the same critical experience as a writer, but I did it.

The first rejection didn't upset me too much.
The second rejection troubled me.
The third shattered me.
By the fourth, I didn't want to leave my room.
And then, by the fifth, I convinced myself I didn't even want to go to anymore schooling.

I exhausted all of my money in pursuit of this future that I probably wasn't ready for, and took some months off. A lot rippled from this, including a brief period of near homelessness. My family grew so used to not having to consider my existence while I was at college that when I was suddenly out, and unable to flip my English: Creative Writing degree professionally in ... any industry despite how my resume appeared and my academics excelled. I worked at a Sex Shop briefly and as a Barista where I was hospitalized from a sudden allergic reaction to caffeine that I never knew I had.

In this rejection, I found the power to finish my manuscript, and pen some of the most successful non-fiction pieces I ever conceived. These set backs led me to finally refuse to walk the path I expected of myself (as a Spec Fic writer) and just take the paths that got me what I needed. I looked at my Curriculum Vitae again, and found out that 90% of my plentiful publications were non-fiction, a fact I neglected to inspect as reasoning in my rejections.

I wish I had a good moral for this story, but really it's just taking a glance at the realities of being a professional writer, even as an academic. There is a lot of last-minute adaptation you've gotta do. There's very little things you can plan for, and so you have to find another way to bend your talents at all times. Especially now that Copywriting and Copy editing is becoming an increasingly difficult industry to break into in some locations.

Now that I've changed my academic focus to non-fiction, I've received my first acceptance at a low residence program. I am sending out more applications (as I accrue the funds) and I'm not as optimistic as I was the first go around, but I am aware of some new realities of Writing in Academia.
 

VeryBigBeard

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First off, sorry you went through all this. It sounds like a really bad period for a while and I hope it's mostly in the rear-view mirror now.

One thing with MFAs is that they're usually not great for writers of SFF anyway. I don't want to be generalize too much and say never go for one if you write speculative, but it does tend to be a different crowd and that can sometimes colour the reception you get. I think the best way to look at it would be like you'd look at any rejection: it's not a rejection of you, personally, and you can't know what didn't click. Sometimes writing is very, very subjective.

Rejection will probably always sting, but a big part of developing as a writer is learning to steel yourself against that so that it doesn't shatter you every time it comes. Because it will. FWIW, a lot of MFAs aren't so great at teaching that. So maybe, as you say, you got what you needed to learn out of the process of being rejected? Developing that self-awareness is also a big part of developing as a writer, but you can get it in many ways. MFAs are great for peer critique, but so are forums like this, and so is just testing yourself against your own tastes. If money's tight, evaluate what you can do for yourself right now. MFAs are great for in-person critique, but sometimes I think people over-value that, even at the expense of developing their own process and discipline. Truth is, writing is often solitary. Having a community is great, but you gotta do what works for you.

It's good your happy in non-fiction now. There's often quite a difference between NF MFAs and fiction MFAs, anyway. My alma mater runs a very good non-fiction low-residency MFA, and wouldn't touch fiction in a hundred years, because all the faculty are all hard-core journalists. The most important thing is to find a program that's right for you. Sounds like you've found it--so good luck!
 

Jason

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I'd agree with everything VBB said above, and also add that having that degree behind your name is not necessarily the measure of your worth (nor should it be). Having said that, I have all the respect in the world for post baccalaureate degrees, because completion of such does take a certain amount of tenacity. That respect for the degree does not necessarily work by osmosis for the person.

I know quite a few Ph.D.'s that are complete and utter assholes thinking that because they have that degree, it instantly makes them a better person than anyone else. Those are the ones I refer to as Pretty Huge Dicks (get it? :) ) I put my brother in this group.

I also know quite a few Ph.D.'s that are very aristocratic. They're nice enough people when you talk to them one-on-one, but if you get a room of them together, there is a bit of "our group" versus "your group" mentality. Excuse me for "only" having a Master's degree. I stopped my Ph.D. program to take care of my grandparents who had taken ill, and life took me in another direction. I put my father in this group.

Finally, I know many other Ph.D.'s that are some of the most congenial and down-to-earth people on the planet. Their post BA degree is just something they did, likely as part of a life goal, a career requirement, or the desire to "get it done". It does not define them, but is a part of the larger picture. I put my sister and mother in this category.

Now granted, the requirements for a Master's are notably lower than that of Ph.D. programs, and there are some disciplines (I am thinking hard sciences here like Chemistry, Biology, Physics, etc. - ones where there are labs givinge you the hands on practice you just can't get on your own) where earning a post baccalaureate degree just isn't possible, but...I'd think long and hard about why you want the degree. If you are going after it as a personal life goal, or to meet a career advancement requirement, then by all means go for it.

But, in addition to the costs you've already incurred just in applications - think about the longer term costs of coursework. How are you going to pay for it? Can you afford it without taking out student loans? Can you afford to make the student loan payments afterward? I know some in their 40's who are still paying off their undergrad studies because they deferred, deferred, deferred... then got a balloon payment at the end where it's almost the same as a monthly mortgage payment!

Last but not least, I'd say that you can very much get the equivalent knowledge and experience that a graduate program will give you from roughly $50 in overdue fees at the library, and perhaps $500-$1000 dollars in textbooks. AbsoluteWrite is a great example of how this can happen. Peer reviews, critique, evaluation, and ongoing dialogs with other graduate students and professors is very easily obtained here. (There's a lot of Masters and Ph.D'd personnel present.) I'd say you could earn the equivalent of an MFA from AW if anyone asks and link 'em here! :)

ETA:
In reading through my post from earlier, I'd like to add one qualifier here, so please don't get me wrong. Pursuing knowledge in our institutions of higher education is very admirable, and there are some things you can get in any classroom that just cannot transcend the classroom. As a technical trainer/instructor/teacher for adult learners, I fully support attending classes in person whenever possible - provided you are there for the right reasons!
 
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zmethos

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Anecdotally: I have an MA in Writing, Literature and Publishing. My husband got an MFA in Creative Writing. I can't say the program was worth the money for me in terms of classes (and I know it will be different for everyone), though it did lead to an internship that became a full-time job when I graduated. So, really, the connections I made were good, I guess. But I eventually left publishing and now write full time.

My husband, though, parlayed his MFA into a Senior Directorship at a major biopharmaceutical company. He started out as a newsletter editor at a small investment banking firm and slowly took on responsibilities no one else seemed to be doing. Next thing he knew, he was indispensable. So as you mentioned, it's really tough to find ways to use a Creative Writing degree, and you may end up somewhere you never expected or planned to be. Then again, my husband no longer writes because his job saps him so much. So... I guess I'd recommend you know what you want out of the degree and program before spending the money. I chose the MA program because it had the publishing aspect that felt more practical to me. But my husband is the one who ended up with the "real" job. Go figure.

And we're only just finishing paying off the student loans after almost 20 years. So, really, just be sure it's truly worth it to you. I promise I'm not trying to discourage you! In fact, I wanted chiefly to show you that your degree can still send you in lucrative directions given the right opportunity. May take some hunting, though, and you may need to be willing to start low on the ladder (if you can afford to).
 

Richard White

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Without naming names of programs, I was turned down by a MFA program and the unofficial (not in the letter, but in discussions with the department head) reason was "You're a genre writer and we focus on literary writing here."

It probably didn't help that I had more professional credits than the entire faculty either.

I wound up going to a state school (Bowie State) and am a thesis away from completing my Masters in English and had probably a better time (and learned more) from the courses I took at Bowie State.
 

VeryBigBeard

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I took creative writing classes throughout my undergrad and quite enjoyed most of them despite occasionally being a fish out of genre. There were definitely times it helped me sit down and put down words every week--deadlines are good that way.

I still think I got more out of my English courses. Particularly the period stuff, and particularly the stuff I ended up taking as required courses that I didn't think I'd enjoy but which gave me different perspective on things and germinated a whole bunch of story ideas I'm still playing with years later. I still use stuff I picked up in a Victorian novel course and a course on the medieval Auchinleck manuscript, among others. I'm not sure I can say the same about the creative writing courses.
 

uhstevedude

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After seeing some of my friends navigate the MFA world-scape, I definitely can agree with a lot of what you stated. Post-BA for writing really does come with a lot of these pitfalls, and one thing I feel fortunate in experiencing in this transition is seeing academia from the outside for a little bit after spending four years in nothing BUT Academia. I think my natural instinct to teach and mentor actually makes me really great for a teaching role though: so, I'm heavily leaning into the MFA thing (better, because I won't push students away from the Indie industry like a lot of MFA and academic types seem to do weirdly).
 

uhstevedude

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Without naming names of programs, I was turned down by a MFA program and the unofficial (not in the letter, but in discussions with the department head) reason was "You're a genre writer and we focus on literary writing here."

It probably didn't help that I had more professional credits than the entire faculty either.

I wound up going to a state school (Bowie State) and am a thesis away from completing my Masters in English and had probably a better time (and learned more) from the courses I took at Bowie State.

Oddly, I thought of doing English MFA work, as well. Some colleges also do genre writing now, like William Paterson in NJ. It's such an odd road to walk with MFAs, because where they draw a hard line at genre, thinking it's increasing the literary and artistic integrity of the college: it's ostracizing minority writers who are drafting literary works that reflect their groups in a way that hasn't been allowed in the mainstream publishing world in centuries. Especially if their cultures are integrated into this "genre work" they're rejecting.
 

uhstevedude

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I took creative writing classes throughout my undergrad and quite enjoyed most of them despite occasionally being a fish out of genre. There were definitely times it helped me sit down and put down words every week--deadlines are good that way.

I still think I got more out of my English courses. Particularly the period stuff, and particularly the stuff I ended up taking as required courses that I didn't think I'd enjoy but which gave me different perspective on things and germinated a whole bunch of story ideas I'm still playing with years later. I still use stuff I picked up in a Victorian novel course and a course on the medieval Auchinleck manuscript, among others. I'm not sure I can say the same about the creative writing courses.

I definitely agree. My work in classical lit, and Shakespearean lit influenced a lot of my work. I don't think I could write a manuscript with as much racial and social critique in it like mine without reading Othello, or involve a Trickster character who applies wit to any and all situations without the Odyssey. I just wish we focused on some lovecraftian elements, a bit. With all the problems in Lovecraft as a person, he knew his way around some exposition.
 

uhstevedude

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Anecdotally: I have an MA in Writing, Literature and Publishing. My husband got an MFA in Creative Writing. I can't say the program was worth the money for me in terms of classes (and I know it will be different for everyone), though it did lead to an internship that became a full-time job when I graduated. So, really, the connections I made were good, I guess. But I eventually left publishing and now write full time.

My husband, though, parlayed his MFA into a Senior Directorship at a major biopharmaceutical company. He started out as a newsletter editor at a small investment banking firm and slowly took on responsibilities no one else seemed to be doing. Next thing he knew, he was indispensable. So as you mentioned, it's really tough to find ways to use a Creative Writing degree, and you may end up somewhere you never expected or planned to be. Then again, my husband no longer writes because his job saps him so much. So... I guess I'd recommend you know what you want out of the degree and program before spending the money. I chose the MA program because it had the publishing aspect that felt more practical to me. But my husband is the one who ended up with the "real" job. Go figure.

And we're only just finishing paying off the student loans after almost 20 years. So, really, just be sure it's truly worth it to you. I promise I'm not trying to discourage you! In fact, I wanted chiefly to show you that your degree can still send you in lucrative directions given the right opportunity. May take some hunting, though, and you may need to be willing to start low on the ladder (if you can afford to).

The odd thing is I can never afford to, ha ha. I had to explain to my professors that I was poor, and after they laughed, I had to explain that it was literally not in an ironic sense: our family literally spends time wiring money to one another every week or so for bills, expenses, etc. and I'm the only one with a Degree. But, I've opened myself to use my degree in different ways and trying to find some way to climb over a wall that I never knew I had to climb over professionally. Mostly, it looks like I'm going to have to leave NJ to get a job. I had ideas of doing Magazine work, but that's looking like it won't help much.
 

Richard White

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I parlayed a BS in History and my job as an analyst in the Army into a Technical Writing position when I got out. The fact I was a published author (3 comics and one short story) helped sell the position to the client and 19 years later, I'm still working as a tech writer (and doing analytics on the side). The MA in English I'm working on is strictly a vanity degree at this point (with retirement coming up in the next 4-6 years, an MA won't mean diddly-squat as far as work goes), but even if I don't do my thesis, I learned so much going to Bowie State, it was well worth the cost of the degree.
 

uhstevedude

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I parlayed a BS in History and my job as an analyst in the Army into a Technical Writing position when I got out. The fact I was a published author (3 comics and one short story) helped sell the position to the client and 19 years later, I'm still working as a tech writer (and doing analytics on the side). The MA in English I'm working on is strictly a vanity degree at this point (with retirement coming up in the next 4-6 years, an MA won't mean diddly-squat as far as work goes), but even if I don't do my thesis, I learned so much going to Bowie State, it was well worth the cost of the degree.

I definitely love that you found a way to make your degree work into your interests. My English degree exposed me to some older forms of storytelling (also to how Oral traditions really weren't that bad if you're facing something like, I don't know, the complete destruction of the Library of Alexander and 1,000 years of knowledge). I'm starting to think it's my location that's the issue. A lot of places don't have the enterprise to utilize an English Degree: you really have to cast a wide net to find someone who will look at your degree and go: "Oh wait, I can read and write, but not on an English level". I'm still looking, just six months out of Undergrad.