The Democrats are so bad at messaging. We're doomed.

MaeZe

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Sigh....

There's a video circulating of Keith Ellison, deputy chair of the DNC, wearing a t-shirt that says "yo no creo en fronteras" (I don't believe in borders).

Here is the actual sentiment behind that position. To get to it I had to go through a couple pages of links to the alt-right echo chamber passing the stupid message around like hot cakes.

The Hill Op Ed
In a recent interview, Ellison suggested that because corporations “can go back and forth across the border seeking out the lowest wages,” regular people should be able to “go back and forth across the border seeking out the highest wages.” Not only is this statement in itself completely detached from reality, but it seems to suggest that if we cannot have wide open borders, then we must not have free trade at all. These remarks come just weeks after Ellison wore a shirt that read “yo no creo en fronteras,” which in English translates into “I do not believe in borders.”

OK, so the sentiment has some value, but half the country is against immigrants and the other half isn't sure it may be enough to keep us from getting a majority in Congress. How can the second in command of the D. Party not understand that and come up with a message that isn't going to get voters believing the Democrats are one step away from communism?
 
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darkprincealain

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OK, so the sentiment has some value, but half the country is against immigrants and the other half isn't sure.

It seems like a good idea to talk about the messaging of the Dems, but I wonder if you could say more about the part I quoted? It just seems to me that you are painting with an awfully broad brush.
 

MaeZe

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It seems like a good idea to talk about the messaging of the Dems, but I wonder if you could say more about the part I quoted? It just seems to me that you are painting with an awfully broad brush.
Sorry. I did not mean everyone is against immigrants, I got emotional there about how bad of a campaign message this is.

The #2 guy in the Democratic Party is sending out a campaign message that almost certainly will lose votes, not gain them.

If the Bernie supporters cannot slow down, there won't be a blue wave in November. I want all that stuff too, public support of colleges, rein in the corporate greed, increase minimum wage, universal health care. But if our campaign message is all that all at once, it won't win.

We have to use Words that Work—"It's not what you say, it's what people hear." The GOP figured this out decades ago.

Why can't Democrats figure that out! It makes me so angry. You'd almost think Ellison is a secret GOP plant.
 
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Xelebes

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Ellison is, like many in the DNC, committed to representing the Hispanic minority and that means listening heavily to the louder activists of that community who may or may not represent the interests of the community. So we end up with messages as though they don't understand that the Treaties of Westphalia and subsequent treaties are still in effect and that means borders are a thing.

IN reality, they need to look at the effects of NAFTA and propose changes in policy to make sure that policy balances out the devastating effects. A lot of Mexican farmers were displaced out of sustenance farming and were left to go searching for a livelihood in the 90s as NAFTA allowed Mexico access to credit and machinery to pursue the mechanisation of their agriculture industry. Simply saying "no such thing as borders" is meaningless/counterproductive and doesn't help the immigrants looking to enter nor does it help the Mexicans trying to re-establish their lives from one way of life to another. And it provides no solace to those in the Midwest who saw many of their factories and their livelihoods move to Mexico with no means of following their work.
 

nighttimer

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Sigh....

There's a video circulating of Keith Ellison, deputy chair of the DNC, wearing a t-shirt that says "yo no creo en fronteras" (I don't believe in borders).

Here is the actual sentiment behind that position. To get to it I had to go through a couple pages of links to the alt-right echo chamber passing the stupid message around like hot cakes.

The Hill Op Ed

OK, so the sentiment has some value, but half the country is against immigrants and the other half isn't sure it may be enough to keep us from getting a majority in Congress. How can the second in command of the D. Party not understand that and come up with a message that isn't going to get voters believing the Democrats are one step away from communism?

Sorry. I did not mean everyone is against immigrants, I got emotional there about how bad of a campaign message this is.

The #2 guy in the Democratic Party is sending out a campaign message that almost certainly will lose votes, not gain them.

If the Bernie supporters cannot slow down, there won't be a blue wave in November. I want all that stuff too, public support of colleges, rein in the corporate greed, increase minimum wage, universal health care. But if our campaign message is all that all at once, it won't win.

We have to use Words that Work—"It's not what you say, it's what people hear." The GOP figured this out decades ago.

Why can't Democrats figure that out! It makes me so angry. You'd almost think Ellison is a secret GOP plant.

Here's some totally unsolicited advice, MaeZe: Don't take what DINOs say so seriously. Someone is a secret GOP plant, but it's not Keith Ellison. It's Douglas Schoen, the author of the article you quoted from The Hill and this kind of mischief making is his stock and trade.

Who's Dougie Schoen, you ask? A pollster and a Fox News democrat (and yes, I did mean to use the small "d".) Dougie is to democrats the way a Big Mac is to a porterhouse steak. An unreasonable simulation. As part of the "fairly unbalanced" crew at Faux, Schoen's primary audience is made up of conservatives, not liberals and by bashing Dems, he earns his paycheck.

Dougie's democrat bona fides are based upon his time as a pollster for Bill Clinton. Since then, what he's best known for is calling upon N.H. primary voters to force President Obama to step aside in 2012 and allow Hillary Clinton to be the Democratic nominee in 2012, I shit you not.

We argued in a recent Wall Street Journal op-ed piece that President Barack Obama should stand down and let Secretary of State Hillary Clinton run as the Democratic presidential nominee in 2012.


We are now calling on Democratic voters nationally — particularly in New Hampshire — to organize a write-in campaign for Clinton. This is something that New Hampshire voters have a long history of doing.


We advocate this Draft Hillary movement not because of the desire to make political mischief — but to put the country on the right course.


It’s clear that Obama has been unable to build consensus and, with the polarizing campaign he is now running, will be unable to govern effectively even if reelected. Only Clinton can commit the Democratic Party — and, indeed, the nation — to a unification and healing process. (Sure. The way she did in 2016. Oh, wait...) This could allow Washington, in a bipartisan manner, to finally address the economic and governmental crises that now grip America.


A write-in candidacy in 2012 can send a message that the Democratic Party must stand for something more than Obama’s reelection at all costs.

This kind of fuckery is how Dougie rolls. In 2010, before the primaries began, Schoen and his BFF, Pat Caddell, another Fox News DINO, ran a similar op-ed where they implored Obama not to bother running for a second term because he was such a bad terrible awful no good prez.

This is a critical moment for the country. From the faltering economy to the burdensome deficit to our foreign policy struggles, America is suffering a widespread sense of crisis and anxiety about the future. Under these circumstances, Obama has the opportunity to seize the high ground and the imagination of the nation once again, and to galvanize the public for the hard decisions that must be made. The only way he can do so, though, is by putting national interests ahead of personal or political ones.


To that end, we believe Obama should announce immediately that he will not be a candidate for reelection in 2012.


If the president goes down the reelection road, we are guaranteed two years of political gridlock at a time when we can ill afford it. But by explicitly saying he will be a one-term president, Obama can deliver on his central campaign promise of 2008, draining the poison from our culture of polarization and ending the resentment and division that have eroded our national identity and common purpose.


We do not come to this conclusion lightly. But it is clear, we believe, that the president has largely lost the consent of the governed. The midterm elections were effectively a referendum on the Obama presidency. And even if it was not an endorsement of a Republican vision for America, the drubbing the Democrats took was certainly a vote of no confidence in Obama and his party. The president has almost no credibility left with Republicans and little with independents.


The best way for him to address both our national challenges and the serious threats to his credibility and stature is to make clear that, for the next two years, he will focus exclusively on the problems we face as Americans, rather than the politics of the moment - or of the 2012 campaign.


Quite simply, given our political divisions and economic problems, governing and campaigning have become incompatible. Obama can and should dispense with the pollsters, the advisers, the consultants and the strategists who dissect all decisions and judgments in terms of their impact on the president's political prospects.


Obama himself once said to Diane Sawyer: "I'd rather be a really good one-term president than a mediocre two-term president." He now has the chance to deliver on that idea.

Schoen, Caddell, and others of their ilk are popular with the Right because they hate the Democrats as much as they do. Maya Angelou once said, "When someone tells you who they are, believe them," so when Dougie Schoen swoons over the dreamy Tea Party and dumps all over Occupy Wall Street, progressives, and a two-term Democratic president, believe him. He's not a Democrat. He's a Dinocrat.

Don't believe any of Dougie's hype. His job is to hurt Democrats, not elect them.
 

MaeZe

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I'll let your optimism sink in for a bit. But I've been watching the Democrats lose election after election because they don't understand how to message. This 'open borders' message has limited appeal and maximum sound bite suicide.

The explanation is a lot like Clinton's lengthy policy plans on her campaign website. They are excellent but not enough people read them or understood them.

I know she had 3 million more votes. But Cambridge Analytical had an accurate assessment of the weak spots and messages that would work in those areas.

For example, the GOP took a Clinton soundbite: "we're going to end coal jobs" or whatever it was. It could have been countered with a rapid response on how Clinton was going to create good jobs in coal mining areas. I never knew anything about those programs that actually exist until W Kamau Bell did a segment on it in his Appalachia episode.

Then there was the kerfuffle about her speeches to Goldman Sachs. Clinton was involved with a joint venture with GS called the 10,000 women initiative. OMG there is nothing wrong with that, it's not some corrupt crap.

Clinton did little to message things like that to counter the attacks. Instead her campaign was going by an outdated plan to ignore anything bad because calling attention to it makes the controversy go on longer. That made sense during Bill's era, but we have research about messaging now that surpasses that old dogma.


Anyway, I will continue to scream it from the rooftops when I see it. :D