Sequels and prequels and sequels, oh my!

Toto Too said:

Lots of great feedback here, thanks everyone! Aggy, I think you're getting at it here. I think simply having other pitches ready is probably all that matters. I mean, any book can have series potential, right? Unless all the characters die and the world blows up. So even though I have zero intent to cheapen a perfectly fine self-contained story by tacking on a sequel, a simple "yes of course this has series potential!" with a few ideas in that regard, is probably all it takes. Apologies in advance to the agent that falls for it. It's not going to get accepted anyway, but I think I'll find the process interesting.

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I'd really encourage you not to do this. It's never a good idea to begin a business relationship with subterfuge.

Toto Too said:

Lots of great feedback here, thanks everyone! Aggy, I think you're getting at it here. I think simply having other pitches ready is probably all that matters. I mean, any book can have series potential, right? Unless all the characters die and the world blows up. So even though I have zero intent to cheapen a perfectly fine self-contained story by tacking on a sequel, a simple "yes of course this has series potential!" with a few ideas in that regard, is probably all it takes. Apologies in advance to the agent that falls for it. It's not going to get accepted anyway, but I think I'll find the process interesting.

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Don't do this.

If you do end up finding an agent and they find out that you've been dishonest with them right from the start they'll dump you without hesitation.

It's a really bad idea.

They wouldn't tell you it's wrong. They might tell you it's less sellable, which isn't the same, or be concerned that you only have one book in you.

The majority of people who get a book traditionally published, never publish a second novel. It's not a concern based on nothing, if that makes sense.

I'm gearing up query MS2. It's standalone, and cannot have a sequel, or a spin-off, or anything else in that "universe"; it's simply impossible. But I've got part of a fantasy series already another written, and another standalone MS lined up after this one that I want to write. I know that I'm not one-book-only and I think I could demonstrate that.

We already have a few woe-is-me-the-never-published-and-likely-unpublishable authors around here. It's really... not the best attitude, partly because self-fulfilling prophecy and all that. Focusing on the problems *will* prevent you from taking steps to meet your goal. That doesn't mean getting published is easy, but it certainly becomes more difficult if you are telling yourself that it won't happen. (There's a difference between self-defeating and pragmatic assessment of the challenge.)

Also, some stories don't need more books. Some will change over time and you could find at a later point that there is another idea in there. But suggesting to an agent that sure, it could be more books, is not wise. It's okay to say "I wrote this as a stand-alone and I don't have any further ideas for these characters. But, I have been working on these other ideas." Various editors are interested in series vs standalones and vice versa it's important for an agent to know which group they need to take your work to. An agent is unlikely to turn you down just because this book is a standalone, but if you suggest that it might be a series and they go to editors who are looking for a series and then you're all "Whoops, maybe there's just the one," it will create some ill will and that's not a thing you want to do deliberately.

Best of luck with your project.

Toto Too said:

It's just sad to me when the business side overrides the artistic side.

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But this has always been true, at least for any artist who wants to make money at it.

Publishing people in general love books, but they also have to eat. They're trying to match your book up with a large enough audience so everyone in the food chain makes some money. If an agent doesn't think their personal set of contacts can do that with your book, they won't offer to rep you on that book. It's not personal. It's not even necessarily an artistic judgement.

Not at all, I get where you're coming from. I do want to offer a final word of caution, though - I think the self pub world has something of an undeserved reputation for being an outlet for "truer" art.

My somewhat limited experience of self pub community is that this is the opposite. A lot of self pubbers have to be focused on what sells--and far more than presses, that usually means writing to market, following trends, and pleasing the crowd. They simply haven't got any margin for error.

A big press can take a gamble from time to time, and invest in proper marketing/reviews/reach (Too Like the Lightning is one such novel and Tor did very well out of it.) Small presses can be good places to find a niche, too.

Anyway, just throwing that out there. Trade pub isn't quite as soulless, or indie pub quite as free-spirited, as the general myth surrounding them both sometimes suggests.

Toto Too said:

Thank you so much for this advice. It seems paradoxical but it actually makes perfect sense, and I honestly hadn't looked at it from that perspective. I'm just in a strange place right now, where I never set out to impress anyone but myself with my writing, and now I'm at the point where I have to decide if I want to remain headstrong, or be flexible enough to impress agents or appeal to the masses. It's an awkward place to be. But I know I'm not alone.

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Or you could remain headstrong and see if it sells.

Another myth is that books that "appeal to the masses" are necessarily lowbrow or less literary. Or in any way easier to write.

I mean, I think everyone on this board understands frustration with getting your work read. Everyone here, almost universally would LOVE to just write, and have their work read and enjoyed by the masses, nothing else to it. That's just not the reality of it. If you are trade published, it's hard getting an agent for many reasons, some of which may not necessarily have to do entirely with quality, but the demands of the market at the time. You may be writing sparkling vampires, and that trend has passed. You may be writing dystopias, and that was five years ago. Then it's hard getting a book deal. Lather Rise Repeat. Then you have to get the next book deal. Or you self-publish and you have more creative control, but instead of having *some* support in marketing, editing, cover design, you have none, so you're having to put time and energy into that and the market determines whether they want open-ended or series, or whatever.

Don't get me wrong, I hear what you're saying. But agents aren't out to diss your book or say it's wrong. They love books and are trying to earn a living. Whether or not they want your book is partially a reflection of the current market.

Toto Too said:

do today's readers become angry if a book comes to a conclusion without teasing a sequel?

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I certainly don't. I like standalone novels and I like series, but teasing a sequel (such as in "Maze Runner") is rather irritating.

Harlequin said:

Hrm, the first Game of Thrones was okay as a standalone, fi that's all you read. .

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Not sure how it could be seen that way. Members of the Stark family are either dead, captive, and/or hunted and on the run. Nothing is resolved or wrapped up in any way, but instead it's one massive cliffhanger. That's not normally the definition of a standalone.

I have always loved sequels, going on forty years. I remember saying when I was very young, 'Is it a series?' If the answer was yes, I bought book #1. I read fantasy and soft SciFi.

I've since learned to appreciate standalone novels. they rock. But, in the fantasy genre I still hope for sequells.

There is also a flip side. If an author intends a series, I get irritated. Especially if the author intends a long series. I got fed up with Xanth after maybe 12 books. I realized I was being played for a sucker. On the other hand, some books that introduce me to a world, I learn the world, I love the world, and then I never see the world again - I get irritated because I invested that time in a world. And the author never wrote a sequel. I learned the world for what, to not see it again?

The business side makes sense too. If a book is a hit they want it to amplify with a sequel.

The key word is 'potential.' Wrap up your story. Make it complete. That's the best advice. But, if there is one hint that you could keep it going (a hint you are truly excited about developing) then that's your potential.

I think this makes sense.