Trump the sequel: Mueller Grand Jury indicted Thirteen Russians/Russian entities

MaeZe · Feb 16, 2018

Here's the indictment: USA v long list of defendants

There is a mention of "unwitting individuals associated with the Trump campaign" (#6 on page 4).

That doesn't mean Trump et al is off the hook. The indictment seems to be a very calculated act by Mueller.

Roxxsmom · Feb 16, 2018

I will admit I've never heard of the charge "aggravated identity theft." What does it entail, as opposed to regular identity theft?

Evidently, it is identity theft in association with a felony.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/1028A

Alessandra Kelley · Feb 16, 2018

Wow, this is genius! It absolutely establishes that crimes were committed, laying a foundation for further investigation.

I can't wait to hear what lawfareblog.com has to say about it.

Brightdreamer · Feb 16, 2018

Anyone else worried what scale of "distraction" will be employed to divert public and media attention from this?

Roxxsmom · Feb 16, 2018

Brightdreamer said:
Anyone else worried what scale of "distraction" will be employed to divert public and media attention from this?

Yes, though I'm afraid the Florida shooter already obliged Trump in this regard.

I'm half expecting some national open carry bill, or bill requiring teachers to pack weapons in their classrooms or something like that.

BenPanced · Feb 16, 2018

Brightdreamer said:
Anyone else worried what scale of "distraction" will be employed to divert public and media attention from this?

Evidence shows it going back to 2014 so 45's crowing it started before he even threw his hat in the ring so NO COLLUSION.

shakeysix · Feb 16, 2018

looks like Mueller has more on Manafort, too. I'm betting the shoes are only beginning to drop. Trump is saying that we must stand strong against the lies and wild allegations that are dividing us. Like no one remembers the whole birther thing against Obama and the "Lock her up" chants. I think he is spooked --s6

Roxxsmom · Feb 17, 2018

I learned a new word today--troll farm.

CWatts · Feb 17, 2018

Roxxsmom said:
I learned a new word today--troll farm.

"Let's lie and troll
Working on a troll farm
Trying to raise some hard hate
Pulling out my fake news
And poking your brain."

Lyv · Feb 17, 2018

BenPanced said:
Evidence shows it going back to 2014 so 45's crowing it started before he even threw his hat in the ring so NO COLLUSION.

Of course that means nothing, but also, he had run before and even trademarked his infamous campaign slogan in November 2012 (and was inspired by the election of Barack Obama).

cbenoi1 · Feb 17, 2018

I'm sure Trump is even more eager to talk to Mueller now. If only his lawyers would stop telling him to just shut the f**k up.

-cb

JJ Litke · Feb 17, 2018

BenPanced said:
Evidence shows it going back to 2014 so 45's crowing it started before he even threw his hat in the ring so NO COLLUSION.

I saw this on Twitter earlier—evidence of Trump planning his run back on 2014. While visiting Russia, coincidentally.

ETA: link fixed (AW was trying to append an extra http on the front of it).

BenPanced · Feb 17, 2018

BenPanced said:
Evidence shows it going back to 2014 so 45's crowing it started before he even threw his hat in the ring so NO COLLUSION.

JJ Litke said:
I saw this on Twitter earlier—evidence of Trump planning his run back on 2014. While visiting Russia, coincidentally.

Loose lips sink ships? A stretch, I know, but...

Brightdreamer · Feb 17, 2018

Roxxsmom said:
I learned a new word today--troll farm.

... and on this farm he had some trolls,
E-I-E-I-O.
With a tweet-tweet here,
And a tweet-tweet there,
Here a tweet, there a tweet, everywhere a tweet-tweet!
Old MacPutin had a farm,
E-I-E-I-O...

blacbird · Feb 17, 2018

I love how Trump (via Huckabee-Sanders) immediately put out the claim that these indictments "prove" there was no collusion.

Does anybody think these Russians cooked this up on their own kopeck?

caw

Roxxsmom · Feb 17, 2018

Brightdreamer said:
... and on this farm he had some trolls,
E-I-E-I-O.
With a tweet-tweet here,
And a tweet-tweet there,
Here a tweet, there a tweet, everywhere a tweet-tweet!
Old MacPutin had a farm,
E-I-E-I-O...

I admit I've been thinking of the song from the Spinal Tap movie (Sex Farm Woman):

Let's tweet and troll
Working on a troll farm
Trying to raise some hate
Getting out my fake news
Poke you where it hurts...

ShaunHorton · Feb 17, 2018

A nice twitter thread tearing apart Trump's statement that the Russians couldn't have known he was going to run for president in 2014, that also practically shows Trump knew he was going to get help from them to do it.

Roxxsmom · Feb 17, 2018

ShaunHorton said:
A nice twitter thread tearing apart Trump's statement that the Russians couldn't have known he was going to run for president in 2014, that also practically shows Trump knew he was going to get help from them to do it.

Talk about Trump being caught (and called out) with his pants down and not a leg to stand on.

RedRajah · Feb 17, 2018

Roxxsmom said:
Talk about Trump being caught (and called out) with his pants down and not a leg to stand on.

Probably too busy peeing on a prostitute.

Roxxsmom · Feb 17, 2018

RedRajah said:
Probably too busy peeing on a prostitute.

Evangelicals love him, though, so he's forgiven.

shakeysix · Feb 18, 2018

I am betting that he takes the evangelicals down with him. I'm betting Ryan bails first. Takers? --s6

Kjbartolotta · Feb 18, 2018

shakeysix said:
I am betting that he takes the evangelicals down with him. I'm betting Ryan bails first. Takers? --s6

Ryan is ride or die as they come, IMHO. Though considering his relationship with Priebus, still not 100% sure I'd bet against you.

Larry M · Feb 18, 2018

shakeysix said:
I am betting that he takes the evangelicals down with him. I'm betting Ryan bails first. Takers? --s6

There is a chance that Ryan gets beaten in the upcoming election in his home state. That's his chance to slink off and hide.

BenPanced · Feb 18, 2018

Of course, somebody else who isn't 45 should have done more. (HINT: his name rhymes with Schmbarak Schmobama.)

RichardGarfinkle · Feb 18, 2018

shakeysix said:
looks like Mueller has more on Manafort, too. I'm betting the shoes are only beginning to drop. Trump is saying that we must stand strong against the lies and wild allegations that are dividing us. Like no one remembers the whole birther thing against Obama and the "Lock her up" chants. I think he is spooked --s6

The Manafort thing is hilarious. He's accused of committing fraud in trying to raise the bail money for the other offenses he's charged with.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/manafort-bail-bank-fraud_us_5a89137ae4b00bc49f44f359

As for Mueller. This is brilliant legal strategy. He's established an underlying crime containing both political crimes (all the election interference) and non-political crimes (identity theft). He's indicting non-US citizens, which highlights foreign interference, and Trump's supporters are largely nativists.

With the underlying crime established, he can move on to charge others with conspiracy. He can also follow the money trail and use the action of funneling money from foreign sources into US election activities as a way to prize open the financial records of everyone involved.

Trump the sequel: Mueller Grand Jury indicted Thirteen Russians/Russian entities

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