Starting a novel with a prologue

lizmonster · Jan 2, 2018

Patty said:
No one complains at the lack of a prologue.

Unless you compare the same story with and without the prologue, there's no way to assess the relative damage.

Some stories need prologues. When I put a prologue in, it's because the story structure requires it. If I lose readers over that, so be it; it only means they don't want to read the story I've written anyway.

(And BTW, I've had plenty of bad reviews, but not a one of them has said "You know, if only she'd ditched the prologue I'd have loved this.")

Harlequin · Jan 2, 2018

Or the start of Les Miserables... 100ish pages of a priest dicking around... all so his monumental act of forgiveness has context and believability.

But I doubt that would get kept in these days.

Woollybear · Jan 2, 2018

Yep, that's true, and I am in envious awe that you have six.

I like bonus material wherever it comes from.

lizmonster said:
Unless you compare the same story with and without the prologue, there's no way to assess the relative damage.

Some stories need prologues. When I put a prologue in, it's because the story structure requires it. If I lose readers over that, so be it; it only means they don't want to read the story I've written anyway.

(And BTW, I've had plenty of bad reviews, but not a one of them has said "You know, if only she'd ditched the prologue I'd have loved this.")

lizmonster · Jan 2, 2018

Patty said:
Yep, that's true, and I am in envious awe that you have six.

I like bonus material wherever it comes from.

Not sure what you're referring to as "bonus material?"

I have three books in print. Two of the other prologued books were combined into one of the three that was published (the combined version got its own flashy new prologue). Right now I'm working on two: one with a prologue, one without.

Not meaning to rain on anyone's opinion here. I've just always found prologue hatred to be really, really strange. A bad prologue is one thing, but saying "no book should have a prologue" is kind of like saying "nobody should paint with cerulean blue." It's all about what you're trying to compose.

(And it's perfectly OK if readers don't like cerulean blue, but if my composition calls for it, I'm using it.)

Harlequin · Jan 2, 2018

lol! I've had complaints like that from a couple betas; 'this needs a prologue, it's too complicated' etc. I've even had a dev editor suggest I put a prologue in.

I didn't want to, though. I already have so many things (everything) that makes that particular book a near impossible sell; a prologue would probably just be a nail in the coffin.

Not that it matters, I suppose, since I've buried it regardless >.> But a prologue would be insufficient to explain everything going on so it wouldn't help anyway.

I don't mind reading prologues if they're good. An example of one that I hate was in a Guy Gavriel Kay novel which opened with a woman engaged in political intrigue. It was all quite interesting until suddenly a bunch of years skipped forward and she fucking died, and then the rest of the book was like 50 years later. I put it down after the prologue ended; the character I'd bonded to was gone.

Justobuddies · Jan 2, 2018

I know everyone hates this answer, but if the story needs a prologue, give it one. If it doesn't need it, leave it out. Assuming that you'll send it out at some point; if the story works and the prologue doesn't, publishers will let you know.

One of my WIP currently has a prologue, and another doesn't. One needs it, one doesn't. I'm responding because the WIP that has the prologue, is much like yours in that it's the introduction to the antagonist. I consider my Prologue bonus material, in that I think one could read the whole story, and understand it. Although, skipping the prologue may have some readers asking "who's this guy?" when the big bad gets his second scene somewhere in the middle (maybe end of the first third) of the book. My prologue event takes place at about the same time chronologically as the start of the story, and serves to show off a bit of the magic system, which doesn't get much attention in the first couple of chapters. I think it will help readers quickly understand that they're picking up an epic high fantasy assuming they read it. When books have them, I usually read the prologue, then first two pages of chapter 1 before I decide whether I'll buy the book or put it back on the shelf.

Woollybear · Jan 2, 2018

I like Justobuddies answer too.

The reason I put my prologue in to begin with was because I didn't want the readers to have a collective groan when they discovered a particular device around chapter 10 (think: OMG! they were identical twins the whole time! ... but it wasn't that one.). I wanted to tip it off in a prologue, because as a 'reveal' in chapter 10 ... it would piss me off - (like, really? Identical twins?) but as a gut churning choice in the prologue I would buy into it. And the prologue provided other opportunities too.

In the end, through multiple revisions, at least, mine works and there are other advantages doing it this way. I like that it can work both ways. So: OP: No harm in playing around with it, and that's my final answer.

I consider prologues to be material that is 'bonus.' Like icing on the cake. You can eat the cake without icing, and some do, and I think that's crazy. The icing is there for a reason. Some would argue it is part of the cake. But some really really think icing is a bad idea.

There's lots of bonus out there - Fan-fic, website material, epilogues, chapter lead-ins, etc etc etc.

Oh hey! OP: If it is only 350 words maybe you could try chapter lead ins. Or not. Your call.

mccardey · Jan 2, 2018

Patty said:
I consider prologues to be material that is 'bonus.' Like icing on the cake. You can eat the cake without icing, and some do,

No - that's not right. Sorry, but that's not a good way to look at prologue.

Justobuddies said:
if the story needs a prologue, give it one. If it doesn't need it, leave it out. Assuming that you'll send it out at some point; if the story works and the prologue doesn't, publishers will let you know.

Exactly this.

eastallegheny · Jan 2, 2018

Justobuddies, you hit the nail on the head. It's the same with my story. The prologue is an introduction to the antagonist. I don't want people getting attached to him, or thinking the story is about him - that's part of why I'm so reluctant to put it as part of Chapter 1. (The other main concern being the stylistic, POV choice.)

And Patty, I like what you said too because I think it's relevant to my story. When the party begins to understand just what it is they're holding, they're naturally going to assume that Lesser Neutral is behind their betrayal. Without the prologue, the readers will too, when the reality is, Lesser Neutral is the cat's paw and nothing else. I don't want Big Bad's involvement to be an eleventh hour reveal because to me it feels dangerously close to "And then I woke up and it was all a dream" lol. If I wrote the ensuing quest without the prologue it would feel to me I like was that girl from Charlie Brown, leading people to blame Lesser Neutral deliberately then pulling the football away just as my reader went to kick it. Which is a revoltingly clunky metaphor. I promise my story is better written than this post!!

Laer Carroll · Jan 2, 2018

Lots of good suggestions. Consider them.

ON THE FIRST DRAFT do whatever you please. If starting with a big long fat prologue helps you create your story, do it. You're a writer, which means you can re-write and probably do it really well. But I never show that first draft to anyone, because I know it has problems, and I know best how to find and fix them. I show the later drafts to people.

Serddar · Jan 2, 2018

It depends, I have a dislike towards those prologues that are there for purpose of saying as much information as possible, simply throwing everything about this world at you, it is too much. On the other hand it can work very well for showing an event that took place some time ago before the main story or something that will impact our story in the future (example - assassinating a king ten years before our main character comes into play - later on in the chapters he discovers who was behind it).

lizmonster · Jan 2, 2018

Patty said:
I consider prologues to be material that is 'bonus.' Like icing on the cake. You can eat the cake without icing, and some do, and I think that's crazy. The icing is there for a reason. Some would argue it is part of the cake. But some really really think icing is a bad idea.

A prologue that is expendable like that doesn't belong in the book.

A prologue that does belong is less like icing than it is a leavening agent - without it, you don't actually have a cake, and you probably shouldn't be serving it to company.

Every single piece of a book should be essential. For some stories, a prologue is essential. There should never be 'bonus material' in a book.

(I can explain exactly what the purpose of each of my prologues is. People can argue about whether or not I achieved that purpose, but they're all there for specific reasons. Without them, each book becomes unfinished.)

Marissa D · Jan 2, 2018

lizmonster said:
A prologue that is expendable like that doesn't belong in the book.

A prologue that does belong is less like icing than it is a leavening agent - without it, you don't actually have a cake, and you probably shouldn't be serving it to company.

Every single piece of a book should be essential. For some stories, a prologue is essential. There should never be 'bonus material' in a book.

(I can explain exactly what the purpose of each of my prologues is. People can argue about whether or not I achieved that purpose, but they're all there for specific reasons. Without them, each book becomes unfinished.)

Yes, exactly.

And as to length--my WIP also has a prologue that is maybe 300 words. It's as long as it needs to be, no more or less. The number of words really has nothing to do with its function.

Harlequin · Jan 2, 2018

I think Patty was possibly building off my comment where I said something along the lines of, if a prologue has plot crucial information I'm not keen on it. (Mentioning it because she's gotten flack and I haven't.)

lizmonster · Jan 2, 2018

Harlequin said:
I think Patty was possibly building off my comment where I said something along the lines of, if a prologue has plot crucial information I'm not keen on it. (Mentioning it because she's gotten flack and I haven't.)

Do you want me to give you flak?

Woollybear · Jan 2, 2018

(I'm trying real hard not to mention that I occasionally skip entire chapters.)

Cyia · Jan 2, 2018

You know what, i'm going to expand on the Star Wars analogy:

Good prologue: pre-movie crawl. You can skip it and it won't matter, but it might give some deeper info if you want to go back and read it later.

Bad prologue: prequels. No one needed 20 minutes of podracing or waxing emo about sand. It could have gone - all of it - and no one would have noticed. Vader got enough character arc in the main trilogy.

mccardey · Jan 2, 2018

Patty said:
(I'm trying real hard not to mention that I occasionally skip entire chapters.)

Layla Nahar · Jan 2, 2018

Adding to the voice that says 'better to roll the information into the story'. It doesn't have to be 'make it chapter 1' - in fact, I'd say it's better to avoid that approach. I think the information can come out in bits and pieces - a memory here, a conversation there - and if the information isn't necessary to the plot, why put it in a prologue?

ForeverYoursCaffiene · Jan 2, 2018

I remember reading a story with a thick prologue, and it bored me in a minute's time. I'd rather read the story and clue in the history through conversations. For example, Game of Thrones (HBO) is deep in history, but I learned it throughout the shows. I didn't have to be introduced by someone on the screen saying, "Okay, this is what happened. The Mad King did this and this..." It ruins it for me if they do.

morngnstar · Jan 2, 2018

Layla Nahar said:
Adding to the voice that says 'better to roll the information into the story'. It doesn't have to be 'make it chapter 1' - in fact, I'd say it's better to avoid that approach. I think the information can come out in bits and pieces - a memory here, a conversation there - and if the information isn't necessary to the plot, why put it in a prologue?

Renaming a prologue chapter 1 doesn't change anything. It's a prologue if it takes place a long time before (or after) the main events of the book, or involves a POV never used again, or similar reasons. The chapter title doesn't matter.

morngnstar · Jan 2, 2018

lizmonster said:
Not always. Some stories need a prologue.

You shouldn't have anything in your book that doesn't need to be there. If a prologue makes the story work, it's necessary. If it's not necessary, it should go, just like a superfluous Chapter 6.

I stand by my statement, which I meant to apply to the OP's book based on the description.

I also said you can get rid of it, which doesn't mean you have to or should. If it makes the story better, keep it. Just saying, you can try it both ways, and see which you like better. Don't feel like they way you've written your story is the only way it could be written.

Sage · Jan 2, 2018

So here's how I look at prologues.

An infodump prologue is always bad. Always always. And that's what has given prologues a bad name.

The prologue should be a part of the story that feels important when taken with the whole, but that could potentially be skipped. The reason for that is that many people, for whatever reason, do skip them (and sometimes Kindle does too). If you make the prologue so important that the story does not make sense without it, those people will not understand your novel. The prologue must be supplemental. It must enhance the story without being a key part of it. If it is actually the beginning of your story, it should be chapter 1, and you should find ways to make it make sense as chapter 1 (like giving that POV more chapters throughout your novel).

It's too late for the OP, but one suggestion I like giving to authors who are considering a prologue is to write the book without it, and then see if they think it's really needed when the rest is written.

For the OP, are you sure you can't reveal to the audience, as you reveal to your characters, what the Big Bad did to set everything up?

Jan74 · Jan 2, 2018

I think of prologues as a snippet to the MC past. It gives us a taste of who/where/what the mc has endured or survived etc. One of my favorite prologues was Morning Glory by Lavyrle Spencer. It's a simple prologue detailing the day the FMC was brought home by her mother and their trip from the train station to their house where they would live with her grandparents. You could start the novel from chapter 1 and be fine reading the book, but the prologue gives you such a great little snippet into HOW the FMC was probably raised and in what circumstances that you immediately feel something for her.

I like prologues. I don't care if they info dump or not, I like having a sneak into the past that sets up the novel. And I think the prologue is making a resurgence because I see a tonne of them.

I'm not a huge fan of the preface, but it's a tool an author can use especially if the novel starts off slow, like Twilight. The preface let the reader know that there would be action.
I love the epilogue. I like having a peek at the future.

So you can always edit and delete later, I've written my prologue a few times, its not necessary to the novel, you could start at chapter 1, but it gives the reader a snippet into the MC past and its fast. I personally prefer a quick prologue, something to wet my whistle.

Just my two cents, good luck to you

onesecondglance · Jan 3, 2018

Harlequin said:
... prologues are usually regarded as the starter vegetables an author is asking you to chew before getting on to the meat of the novel.

GoSpeed said:
This is a wonderful analogy! I may have to steal it

With all due respect to Harlequin, don't, cos it's wrong... !

Listen, prologues get a lot of hate, but almost all of it is writers telling other writers that they are crap and unnecessary, in the same way that writers tell other writers to show not tell and all the other "rules". Those "rules" are there to help you learn your craft. Once you know your craft, you know whether you need them or not, and when to break them appropriately.

lizmonster said:
Not always. Some stories need a prologue.

You shouldn't have anything in your book that doesn't need to be there. If a prologue makes the story work, it's necessary. If it's not necessary, it should go, just like a superfluous Chapter 6.

lizmonster said:
Every single piece of a book should be essential. For some stories, a prologue is essential.

^ this is right.

You need to engage your writer's brain and think about the way you want to tell your story. If that includes a prologue, do it. And do it with confidence.

Starting a novel with a prologue

lizmonster

Possibly A Mermaid Queen

Harlequin

Eat books, not brains!

Woollybear

lizmonster

Possibly A Mermaid Queen

Harlequin

Eat books, not brains!

Justobuddies

Iä! Iä! Cthulhu fhtagn!

Woollybear

mccardey

eastallegheny

Laer Carroll

Aerospace engineer turned writer

Serddar

lizmonster

Possibly A Mermaid Queen

Marissa D

Scribe of the girls in the basement

Harlequin

Eat books, not brains!

lizmonster

Possibly A Mermaid Queen

Woollybear

Cyia

Rewriting My Destiny

mccardey

Layla Nahar

Seashell Seller

ForeverYoursCaffiene

morngnstar

morngnstar

Sage

Supreme Guessinator

Jan74

onesecondglance

pretending to be awake