The Killing Joke [by Alan Moore] --anyone else not get it?

L. OBrien

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So, I read Batman: The Killing Joke a little while ago, and whatever it was, I missed the punchline. I was so frustrated with it, but then I saw that it was at the top of NYT's bestseller list for graphic novels. I'm trying to figure out if there's something that I missed. Who else here has read it? Anyone have any insight into why this is considered such a masterpiece?

Explaining my stance (spoilers, ahoy! Also, trigger warning: violence, sexual assault):

In short, I thought the whole thing was badly handled. Not one but two women (the joker's wife and Barbara Gordon) are harmed, but their suffering is completely ignored. Instead, the story prioritizes the pain of the men who happened to be associated. I mean, Barbara is shot in the spine, photographed naked, and left for dead, only for the main focus of the story to be her father's mental anguish over what's happened to her. I get that the Joker is trying to make him snap, but why should his anguish be more important than that of the girl who was shot and violated? (Yes, Commissioner Gordon is violated too, but his trauma was acknowledged by the story. Barbara's is all about upsetting *him*)

Second, on a lesser note, the Joker's song and dance routine was like a bad acid trip. It wasn't scary; just kind of clunky and silly looking. The execution of the theme-park bit was awkward. It was like they'd had sociopaths killer joker in one half and goofy clown joker in the other. Didn't work for me.

And third, the possible origin story that was presented for the joker was just a string of cliches--innocent man trying to provide for his family, dead wife, a botched heist. I've read some of Alan Moore's other work, and after having seen what he's capable of, this all felt so...obvious.

So, anyone else disappointed? Any alternate interpretations?
 

EMaree

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(Trigger warning: sexual assault)

Honestly, The Killing Joke is one of those books that ages terribly. It appealed to me as a teen reader, experiencing grimdark DC for the first time. But to adult eyes it's an awful, dis-compassionate story that completely dehumanises women for the sake of darkness and edginess. It was one of the first mainstream comics to go that far, which is why it got so popular, but in the years since many have done it much better.

By comparison the wonderful graphic novels available now, it's incredibly overhyped.

It's topping bestseller lists at the moment because an animated movie is out, which manages to make a bad story much worse by focusing on the Joker raping Barbara Gordon and showing naked pictures to her dad, and tacking on a deeply uncomfortable prologue where Batman sleeps with his Batgirl, his surrogate-bloody-daughter-augh. There's a very honest livetweet of it here.
 
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Diana Hignutt

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The Killing Joke is the joke that the Joker tells Batman at the end of the book, they share a laugh and SPOILERS!!!








Batman kills the Joker. He's done like he said in the beginning, he talked things over with the Joker and nothing is going to change. So, at the end in the last few panels, you see the Batman laughing and grabbing the Joker. We see their feet and a beam of light reflecting in the puddles of rain (remember the Joker's joke). Then only Batman is laughing. And in the last panel, the beam of light is gone. Alan Moore stealth wrote and had DC publish the last Batman story. Or it's Shroedinger's Joker. You decide. Which fits it with the multiple choice origins of the Joker.

But, yeah, the treatment of the female characters is dreadful. Moore's not great at that. Imho, Watchmen is Moore's masterpiece.
 

ShaunHorton

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I thought the spoiler was just a theory, and never really confirmed or denied. The Arkham games for example, take place after the Killing Joke.

While the Joker has claimed multiple different origin stories, since TKJ was first printed, that story has been agreed upon by most as the one most likely to be true, and many story and plot lines have revolved around not only TKJ, but that origin as well.

I don't understand the whole furor over Batgirl and Batman having a sexual relationship. It's been part of the story for years. It's like all these people had their heads in the sand and ignored it until it was pretty blatantly shoved in their faces.
 

Emermouse

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I like it better that I've heard some of the behind the scenes stuff about it. From what I heard, Moore intended for The Killing Joke to be an Elseworlds story and the decision to make it part of the official Batman canon was a last minute one. And he has acknowledged that he screwed up in making it all about how it affects the Commissioner, not how it affects the actual victim, Barbara.
 

Helix Denby

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I'm with Moore in thinking it the worst thing he's written. The underlying crux of Joker's argument - that a single horrible day can turn anyone into a demented killing machine - I never bought into, partly because it gives Joker a bit too much introspection for my taste. Plus the whole Batgirl story never rose above sadistic. I did however like the short about the guy going over how easy it would be to kill Batman, although not really anything to do with the Killing Joke, but it did come attached in that deluxe edition I bought a while ago.
 

veinglory

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Even Moore has basically disowned the story, but it has it's place historically in being an early example of extreme moral ambiguity and blurring of hero/villain archetypes. It has aged badly and for good reasons. The focus on male angst and casual use of violence against women as a motivational shortcut used to be common, almost ubiquitous. So while parodying one set of lazy stereotypes TKJ reinforces another.

What baffles me is why the story is having a renaissance now then its importance should be widely recognized as historical. But perhaps it is because a lot of mainstream comic gurus and thoughtleaders still read comic from an archaic and male-central point of view.

The specific joke itself is clearly a shaggy dog/Mcguffin because it is very lame.