The Next Circle of Hell, Vol. 2

aceafer

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Slow for me just hearing back from my agents! It's been about two months since I sent my last edits but it was a 100k+ MS at that point and they do quite detailed line edits so I'm not overlyyy concerned although I am at the point now where I'm getting very impatient to hear back. I do have two other projects I'm working on in the meantime - trying to do nano to get more words on one of them - so I'm trying to stay engaged but it's hard at the moment!
 

Sonya Heaney

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It's been about two months since I sent my last edits but it was a 100k+ MS at that point and they do quite detailed line edits so I'm not overlyyy concerned although I am at the point now where I'm getting very impatient to hear back.

This is how it's for me at the moment. I actually suspect at least some people have been on holidays in the last few weeks.

I've developed a new coping strategy: reading (and occasionally writing) in completely different genres. I think the people at my local library are sick of seeing me, but I'm going faaaar outside my comfort zone and doing a decent job of forgetting about my own books. There's no section of the library I don't visit now!

I've either written a million times too many or nowhere near enough notes for my talks on Thursday. I've only done one thing like this before, and I thought I'd be a disaster and have nothing to say, but I ended up running overtime. At least I found some book cover magnets and postcards buried in a drawer that I can give out in a couple of days!
 

RaggyCat

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I suspect a prolonged Frankfurt may have been slowing things down, but that's my best guess. I've just been in the library myself stocking up for the imminent UK lockdown - I've not actually read any YA for ages, because I felt weird about it with my own book on sub - but I did today. Maybe I should be braver in the library too, as a lot of my reading is quite samey. I am part of a book club which pushed me to read different things, but I realise this year I somehow seem to have been extremely bossy with the books we've read and wound up choosing many of the books!

Good luck for Thursday, Sonya. The freebies will go down well and I imagine you'll have a fairly engaged audience to begin with, which helps!
 

Sonya Heaney

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Phew, so I wrote a million pages of notes for my massively long talks, but in the end I didn't even look at them! I don't know whether I was okay or awful! Apparently everyone in the book groups go out for lunch after the talks, and I generated a lot of conversation, so I guess that's something ... ?? I'm actually pretty good at talking rubbish for ages. It's probably not very interesting, but I can fill the time!

Raggy - and everyone else - I feel a bit rude talking about my life at the moment. The only virus case we've had in about six months was a diplomat who flew here and immediately isolated, so we're basically back to normal now. It's hard to think how bad it still is for people in less isolated countries. :(

I'll just be a downer for a minute, and say - wow - even for 2020 ... In the last month one relative died of cancer, another was diagnosed with advanced cancer, another one is currently being tested for a serious disease, and my grandmother's entire village in Ukraine has just been diagnosed with Covid. When does stuff start getting better??
 

Harlequin

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Sorry to hear of all the difficulties, Sonya x In a weird way the election has been a microcosm of the wider planet: a long slow crumbling mess, or so it often feels. @Raggy - Frankfurt was a bit of a bottleneck by some accounts, moving more slowly across days. Sounds like lots of agents were tied up with getting to grips with the set up. My announcement date has finally been set for this coming Tuesday, 10th of Nov. I'm not super active on AW these days but might use the announcement board if that is still a thing.
 

S. Eli

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@ace my agent gave me an estimated return time double as long as it usually is, and she's super fast so i have been randomly anxious about it lol - you at least waited before you could get legitimately anxious.

I just finished an enormous revision of my second book with my agent (which was actually the book before the book that she offered on). If I did well with the revision, we MAY go on submission with that one, too, next year. Idk how to tell her I just write all the time so she doesn't have to sub with all my crap lol im gonna be writing regardless
 

aceafer

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@S.Eli: yeahh but they haven't said anything to me about it at all :( i sent over a revised prologue and they confirmed receipt but that was it :( it's annoying because i'm making good progress with my next idea and want to get their thoughts on but really feel like i need to get the first one back before sending over a new one. at the min i'm just assuming election stuff + lockdown stuff = a longass time.

and is that dead girls??? that's exciting!!!
 

A.P.M.

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Still waiting here. Not too worried about waiting since I know things are slow and stressful for everyone right now. I'm just focusing on writing my next book.
 

litdawg

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Another nice rejection last week. I have a phone call scheduled with my agent in December to strategize the next round of pitches. Some people might be distressed by the wait, but I'm too occupied by day jobs to expend much thought on publishing right now. I hope we all can find some productive distractions in the weeks ahead. The electoral college can't vote soon enough as far as I'm concerned.
 

Sonya Heaney

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Hey - any Australians or Kiwis who might read this: Puffin (Penguin Kids AU) has an open call for chapter books, middle grade and YA until the end of this month. I nearly rushed through a half-done manuscript to send off, but then decided it wouldn't be ready in time.

Wow, it's all so SLOW at the moment. It's been so long I actually forgot I was waiting for news about a manuscript! I swear, sometimes I forget I've even been published.

At least it's hot and sunny here in Australia now, and I'm thinking about Christmas. In my culture we have Christmas twice - December and January. :)
 
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RaggyCat

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It's super slow! Literally NOTHING is going on. Can't comment for other markets, but in the UK at least it seems to be agreed that books and publishing have had a "good pandemic" so I would have expected that maybe things would start to move as people become more risk-averse...

That said, it wouldn't surprise me if agents and editors are flooded. Not the same, but I've had a definite uptick of editing jobs coming through from the Literary Consultancy I edit for. People finishing books in lockdown, maybe?

I feel like I really need to have a frank talk with my agent about what's next for my submission book as there are still tons more places to send it, and I don't know what her plan is for it anymore, but I'm feeling sluggish and reticent to even ask. Maybe I will once things with my IP book are firmed up.
 
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Sonya Heaney

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That said, it wouldn't surprise me if agents and editors are flooded. Not the same, but I've had a definite uptick of editing jobs coming through from the Literary Consultancy I edit for. People finishing books in lockdown, maybe?

I feel like this is part of it! And now NaNo is nearly over it will probably only get worse ...

I just remembered I was asked to write or contribute to 6-8 (I can't remember!) promotional pieces nearly half a year ago, and only two of them have gone up so far - so even THAT'S slow. One was interview questions, and what I said in July isn't exactly going to apply in December or January. :Shrug:
 

MercyMe

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Glad to hear from others that it's slow. I haven't heard from Agent on 2nd round sub and I'm not jumping to get in touch with her either. I think we're both feeling "well, this sucks" as 2020 draws to a close. I'm very conflicted at the moment about continuing to seek publication in 2021. If there's no love for that book, I doubt there'll be love for the next.
 

Harlequin

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I would not always assume that, MercyMe :)

I don't know your situation and wouldn't want to say you shoudln't keep trying if your heart isn't in it, but definitely so much can change between books.

My second manuscript died on submission very slowly across 18 months. It was pretty painful, esp after agent had been excited to sign. The general feedback was, good concept, shoddy execution (I'm paraphrasing). It was either too weird, or not different enough; too pulpy, or too posh, depending on the editor.

I didn't think book 3 would do any better, and in many ways it is (to me) a less interesting novel, but we sold extremely fast over the summer. A combination of factors contributed to that, including luck, but basically, situations always change. Every book is different. The editor we sold to this time wasn't even available to pitch with the last book (as an example of things that can flip easily.)

In general I would say a lot of the 'successes' on AW have come after failed subs (check out Puttputt's story sometime.)
 
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RaggyCat

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I also would not assume that, MercyMe. Harlequin's example from her own writing is an excellent one, and I will second that success is dependent on a number of random factors, of which the quality of your book is actually one of the lesser ones. Luck is an enormous factor, frustrating and unfair as it is. And I think luck has not been on your side with the timing of this sub - March, April and May were really funny months in UK children's publishing thanks to the pandemic, and YA is super tough without that. The cancellations of LBF and Bologna were also bad luck. Don't give up - this really has been an exceptional year.

Feel free to DM rant me if you want, I'm in the same boat.
 

Shoeless

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Glad to hear from others that it's slow. I haven't heard from Agent on 2nd round sub and I'm not jumping to get in touch with her either. I think we're both feeling "well, this sucks" as 2020 draws to a close. I'm very conflicted at the moment about continuing to seek publication in 2021. If there's no love for that book, I doubt there'll be love for the next.

It's hard to predict. There have been a lot of "not following the trope" publication stories here in the Circle. Harlequin's second book on sub was the one that sold. Putputt when through multiple books and agents over years, but now has a Netflix deal. Sparverius got a book deal only after a cautious R&R from one editor, going through all the other editors and then finally coming back to that initial editor and getting acquired after the R&R. Took me over a year for my book to get acquired on a second round of submissions to other editors, and that was only after five unsold books and a new agent.

So much of it is totally out of your control once it's on submission. All you can do is keep writing and enjoying whatever you're doing now, because the one that's out there is on its own, you've done everything you could up to that point. Now it's just down to timing, luck and circumstance, in addition to being "good enough" to publish.

As for me, my current MS is still on submission, not expecting to hear much about it since we're entering December, but I will have another announcement I'll be able to make shortly.
 

Laurel

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I'm very conflicted at the moment about continuing to seek publication in 2021. If there's no love for that book, I doubt there'll be love for the next.

Echoing what others have said -- you can't really assume this. Many people sell a book after having one die on sub.

It's still super slooooow for me. I was hoping to hear something last week, but I'm assuming I won't hear anything this week with the Thanksgiving holiday.

I'm going to try to get some writing on my new manuscript today. After going back and forth on whether I think the idea is marketable, I've decided to just write it for myself because I want to -- I have two MG manuscripts and several PBs with my agent, so it's not like I'm feeling rushed to get another manuscript to her anyway!
 

Sonya Heaney

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MercyMe - Echoing everyone else here.

I got a remittance statement from my publisher this morning and got excited. Hey - they remembered I exist!
 

A.P.M.

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Yep, it's too early to give up. And strap in--My agent just warned me that things will likely be slow until January with the holiday season/COVID concerns.
 

MercyMe

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THANK YOU everyone for your responses. This is just what I needed to hear. It's not great, obviously, that it's slow and the book on sub is likely to be rejected, but I do remember reading this entire thread before I even got an agent to inspire me to keep going. The book I'm working on now, I'd like to really pour myself into it but I come up against resistance. But as you've all said, the last book is no indication of how the next book will do--in spite of the gremlins telling me I either can't tell a story or the story I'm telling is unmarketable. I've got to forget about the market for awhile and write what I want to say. I hope you're all keeping safe in your part of the world.
 

RaggyCat

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Although it is never good that things are slow, I'm kind of relieved that things are slow for everyone - helps us feel less like we're all going mad! It wouldn't surprise me at all if things taper off over December, then come back with more energy in the new year. Bologna and LBF have now moved to June, so there's plenty more time for publishing to get back on its feet before the big trade season.

MercyMe, I think just write whatever you're drawn to for now - at least you're writing! Like Laurel says, write because you want to. IIRC, your WIP is a sequel/series book to your sub book? It might be an idea to think of how, if needed, you could convert it into a standalone - I know doing things like that always make me feel a little more future proofed. (I plotted a sequel book to sub book, but also have it plotted as a stand alone).

I'm 70k into my WIP and very much on the home run with it, but I think I'm going to have to park it before completion as I'm going to have a tight deadline for something else very soon. It's a shame but that's life!
 

Sonya Heaney

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Okay, so I decided a while ago that I'd be really open about two things: my life as a ballet dancer (where abuse was rampant), and the garbage that is the publishing world. I'm guessing some people I work with will see this, but I just don't care anymore.

I feel like I should say this for everyone who is annoyed with their agents:

Since June, I've had four emails from my publisher. Two were royalty (or similar) statements, so they don't even count. One was to tell me one of my books was on sale. The other one was from an editor, acknowledging my manuscript was received.

That's it. In half a year.

I walked to the shops this afternoon, which was really stupid when it was So Sunny and So Hot (I got sunburnt!). But, while I was there, I checked my phone, and saw yet another person just signed with my publisher and did a big announcement. I've had several people contact me this year because they've had offers from them, and they wanted to know how it was to write for them. This person today was the final straw.

On the way home I stopped in an underpass (I think it's called a "subway" in US English), and cried.

I mean, I'm completely fine if my writing is crap, but this is getting ridiculous. This thread was so happy for all of us a few months ago, and now everything sucks for us all.

Ugh. I hate publishing. I have a goal to finish four new manuscripts by my birthday in February. And I'm going to sub widely. I'm so annoyed with everything at the moment!
 
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RaggyCat

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Oh, Sonya, big big hugs! I'm so sorry it drove you to tears (been there! frequently!) and that you feel neglected and unseen. Six months feels a hella long time to essentially not be contacted and it feels such a screwy industry where this can be a normal thing. I literally think that unless a person is A Massive Name for the publisher, unless you've a book coming out very soon that you're contracted for, you're not a priority and can just be left. You know it's not just you feeling this way, or having a lack of contact, I know, but it's easy to feel that way. So hugs and sympathy and a big "it happens, it sucks, why do we do this to ourselves".

(And speaking as someone who has read one of your books to date, your writing is not crappy. And I say that with my editor hat on).

Shall we just pretend the rest of 2020 isn't happening and it's 2021 already? I know I'd welcome that.